Forum Moderators: Robert Charlton & goodroi
Over and done with?
All done all through?
"Best links are earned, not sold or traded. You may not get what you pay for."
That may not mean that traded links are penalized or even worthless. They could count for something, just not as much as "earned" links.
Also what is an earned link anyway? I have a lot of earned links in the sense that people have linked to me as a resource for their readers not in order to trade links. The problem is that I may have linked to them not because they linked to me (I may not even know they've linked to me) but because they have information on their site that would be of value to my visitors.
So in a niche topic like mine there could be many links that would be seen as recip links by Google but they aren't.
Yahoo! Wins Search Victory
Chris Kraeuter
BURLINGAME, CALIF. - In the ongoing battle for high-level search expertise, Yahoo! announced a key hire in its research department, tapping the former chief scientist at AltaVista to lead its developmental search projects in this hot area of the Internet.
Top talent is scarce for search experts, so the hiring of Andrei Broder as Yahoo!'s vice president of emerging search technology is a significant addition in steering the company's search tools during the years ahead.
"There is an enormous amount of possibilities and an enormous amount of invention coming in the next decade," Broder says.
He acknowledged talking with Google and Microsoft before accepting the Yahoo! position, but that he liked Yahoo!'s ability to utilize both content and user information in improving search.
"I knew that whatever I would do would disappoint two-thirds of my friends," Broder says.
His hiring follows a protracted court battle by Google and Microsoft over computer scientist Kai-Fu Lee, who now heads research and development in China for Google, although the case is still being litigated due to a non-compete agreement.
Broder was the chief scientist at search pioneer AltaVista from 1999 into early 2002, before leaving to be the chief technology officer for search and text analysis at IBM Research, where he mainly focused on enterprise search issues.
He says the Internet is where the real action in search is right now. "This is a combination of cutting-edge research with very solid large-scale engineering and the understanding of microeconomics and advertising," he says.
As for where he sees Internet search going, Broder says it will move beyond plugging words into a simple box and more toward "information flowing to you as you need it."
I didn't know they were able to index my bank account ...
This occurs a lot of ways. The problem seems to come when some people need to force square pegs into round holes so they can make everything black and white so they can sleep better at night.
Earned/given by choice doesn't comment at all on reciprocity, one way, nine way, ROS, or anything else like that. Each of these could be "best" or the could be "not best". It's not the method, it's the meaning.
That may not mean that traded links are penalized or even worthless. They could count for something, just not as much as "earned" links.Yes, he does come short of actually condemning those who use reciprocal links. But those who use automated programs top obtain links should beware.
Best links are earned...
So, the best links are links from forums...;)
Good point-- very good point.
I just went and changed my signature line on a big forum just to boost my newest site.
1. Duplicate content between different pages on a site,
2. Duplicate content between different sites,
3. Duplicate links, (DMOZ mirrors, etc...)
4. ...
Too me my 'best' links are from the top quality sites in my field. They will bring visitors that are interested in my site and also the fact they have linked to me indicates my site is a quality one.
My impression was that Google measured 'best' by PR from the linking site and how related that site's topic was to mine.
Matt's comment implies traded or bought links also have less weight. If someone pays me to put their ad on my site is that a paid link?
It's not the method, it's the meaning.
Steve, can you explain this a little more? Can meaning be measured?
People must keep in mind that there is absolutely no news in Matt or anyone else from G suggesting that one way quality inbounds are the best sorts of links to get.From Matt Cutt's Blog
The best links are not paid, or exchanged after out-of-the-blue emails–the best links are earned and given by choice.
Powdork I am perhaps not making my point clear.
Does anyone think it's *news* that G favors natural one way inbounds over paid links, exchanged links, or other more manipulative kinds of links? I hope not. G now and always has preferred links given in good faith, as true "votes." There is *nothing* new about that.
Matt could post about G's dislike of too much kw repetition in titles and that wouldn't be news either.
The only thing that is new at all is that they keep getting better and better at identifying, dampening and at times perhaps even penalizing sites involved in what they view as manipulative link schemes.
Since at least as far back as the Florida Update, there was pretty clear evidence that G was exploring all sorts of ways to go after 'artificial' links. Everything from too-common backlink text to IP related issues to speed of accumulation has been on their radar for a long time now.
Jane_Doe and I think others in this mega thread have noted the fact that there are plenty of sites out there with substantial amounts of recips that are doing just fine. There are all sorts of different kinds of recips, both in terms of the sites doing the recip-ing and the way it's being done. ;-)
If highly regarded "Site A" exchanges links with highly regarded "Site B," is that as good for "Site B" as a simple one way inbound from "Site A"? I dunno; probably not. Should "Site B" not link back to "Site A" then? If there is good reason to, then of course they should, and without fear. Karma works.
Another way to look at this all is that if there's news, it's that G is doing a better job all the time of trying to sort out what some of us might refer to as "intent". ;-)
Reciprocal
Good- A page with links to their preferred vendors, many of whom link back because they share a common ground.
Bad- A link directory with several hundred or thousand links and descriptions, many to places like istanbul hotels. The descriptions are all easily found on hundreds of other link pages.
Paid Links
Good- A long running campaign on modern bride or the knot
Bad- A number of links randomly appearing on many unrelated pages. Obvious high inbound link churn.
One Way
Good- Long lasting. Related is better but not necessary.
Bad- High link churn, non unique description, poor reputation of linking site.
These are just general guidelines and probably have some hole as well. And no, none of this is news, but....
You would be surprised how many times this happens
1. I get a request for a link exchange, or just a link.
2. I see the site, like it and decide to add a link. I always create my own title and description rather than what they give me. Uniqueness of content is paramount on my sites.
3. I get an email thanking me for the link, "but could I please use the description given to me."
I returned one of those emails with a note saying they had just lost the link. I was told she is just doing her job, she is given a quota of titles and descriptions she must get in order to get paid. You would think a firm that specializes in hunting down links would recognize the futility of this method.
A week ago I totalled my 5 year old site in favour of new handmade content, no links, no sales and absolutely no affiliate schemes and msn has already cleaned the deleted files (over 2000 pages) and replaced with entire site (471 new pages). Not only that they have given me top listings for pretty much everything that I'm targeting (not too competitive).
How long do you think it would take google ... if they ever get round to it.
p.s. anyone who uses links for anything other than just honest and informative purposes is a SPAMMER and deserves the SLAMMER. There is no place on google for anyone who use their links in or links out as part of a marketing plan ... you are everything that is wrong with the Internet today.
Although not as drastic an update, Yahoo has got me top of my local information listing (1/10'000'000).
Things are starting to look up again.
I wish everyone good luck for todays google madness :-)
There is no place on google for anyone who use their links in or links out as part of a marketing plan ... you are everything that is wrong with the Internet today.
And why is this? Businesses dont use newspaper, T.V. and media listings to help push their product? How should search engines be any different?
If you use <DIV> tags to compress and hide text ... You are a liar and a cheat
If you use a carefully planned network of target keyword links ... You are a liar and a cheat
If you use repeated phrases in order to artificially raise your relevancy ... You are a liar and a cheat
In fact ... if you at all stray from the original content in order to attract an artificially high PR on google ... Guess what you are.
Spam is bad and you will get caught
Thats the funniest thing I've read all week. LOL
And why is this? Businesses dont use newspaper, T.V. and media listings to help push their product? How should search engines be any different?What you are referring to would be equated to selling traffic in the online world. I believe what colin h is referring to is links you sell or buy strictly for the purpose of your SE ranking.
I've not got the same listings on google, but Yahoo & MSN love me and my weekly takings are only 15% down on pre jagger times.
Get with the new trend ... SPAM STINKS and anyone who touches it STINKS TOO ;-)
Talking about update Jagger3 again :-)
Yesterday there were some movements on the DCs which looked like Jagger3 migrating to other DCs. Not so this morning.
Our dear beloved Jagger3 is still on its original 4 DCs and refuse to migrate to anywhere else.
66.102.9.99
66.102.9.104
66.102.11.99
66.102.11.104
Any of you folks out there seeing something else?
Thanks.
>>Get with the new trend ... SPAM STINKS and anyone who touches it STINKS TOO ;-)<<
Well said :-)
And here is my Saturday shameless anti-spam spot:
Folks! Don't wait to send Jagger-related spam feedback; I'd send that now. Using the keyword "Jagger3" at [google.com...] will get someone reading and checking it out.
I knew that you're happy welcomings every morning would rub off on me.
All the best
Col :-)
if we all had websites as a bit of fun it would be nice to just play around in this game, but unfortunately some of us need to make an income from our sites to pay the bills so need these affiliate links
I had to lay off 4 employees and friends last month because I'm just playing.
Wind your un-educated neck in
I also have had to lay off staff so lets not get personal here please
CainIV......I totally agree with you. Google makes lots of CPC money from me and I believe any legal method of marketing an ecommerce store and your product is just good business. I'm on the internet to make money! By personal choice, I don't use hidden text, or any other cloaking tactics because I might be banned from the SE's, but exchanging links with other related websites makes a lot of sense. Every new store I open would have little traffic for the first year if I didn't exchange links. I'm not in this to get any gold stars.
The Jagger update dropped me from page 1 to page 2...and I can live with that.
