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Update Saga. Part 6

     

selomelo

6:25 pm on Nov 21, 2005 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member





Continued from:
[webmasterworld.com...]


The same down-and-on problem here in Turkey.
But j3 goes on and off. No steady results. At least three different sets:

216.239.63.104 (I think with additional tweaks)
64.233.161.104 (still J2)
64.233.179.104 (J3)

walkman

4:40 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)



reseller,
with all the praises, not to use another word, you sing Googleyour site should be on top by now. Maybe Matt doesn't like your nicknames...

reseller

5:51 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Good morning Folks

A new day and a new week and its 6.50 am (GMT+1) my local time. Cold and still awaiting for the sun to shine. Isn't it really so wonderful to be alive.

The older you grow the less you need to sleep, the more you enjoy life and the more you appreciate your family and health. Money will be still important but you start to realize that harmony in life is more important than $$$$ :-)

I see some of you folks think that I'm kissing Google's ass just because I hate spam and think that Google is still the greatest search engine on earth.

If you are a spammer and think ripping off other fellow webmasters contents is great. Power to you.
If you are a spammer and you think that hidden text, doorway pages and cloaking is the way to the top of the serps. Power to you.

But if you are just like me a hard working webmaster who still believe that contents and whitehat SEO (example Brett's 26 steps) is the right way to get more search engines referrals. More and More Power to you!

Therefore my anti-spam spots. In fact you don't kiss anybody ass when you fight back on spam and spammers. The same way in real life, you don't kiss the ass of anybody when you fight thieves and criminals.

And back to my humble site. As I mentioned it several times, I lost around 75% of my Google's referrals on 2-3 Feb 2005 (ALlegra). Then I lost most of the rest on 22nd July 2005.
However, around 22nd September 2005 my site regained around 50% of its pre-Allegra Google's referrals. And even those 50% didn't come back so easy. I had to do much cleaning work, 301 redirect (thanks Dayo_UK), filed twice reinclusion requests etc.. etc... All genuine hard work. Kissing other people ass wasn't the name of my game.

And now to Google as the greatest search engine on planet. Well thats how I see Google mostly because its the search engine that deliver most traffic to most websites.
Google is still the search engine that most people prefer, as far as my site is concerned.

If you can live without Google's referrals and happy with the referrals from Yahoo, MSN etc... Power to you.

I guess what I'm trying to say is:

There is nothing wrong in fighting spam. Nothing wrong if you are just like me still see Google as The Mother of ALL Search Engines.

And there is absolutely nothing wrong if you talk nicely to the search engines folks and you make friends among them. Its a cooperation not a confrontation policy which I believe in as a way to deal with search engines.

MikeDammann

6:02 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member



OK giving you the benefit of the doubt that you mean what you've just said:

Don't you think it would be much wiser to simply inform webmasters of the option to report rather than say: "Let's go report some spam!"

I can already see the abuse, webmasters reporting things that are less spammy than what they themselves do to get a competitor out of the way. I am a member on one forum where the threads about "Look what site outranks me here and there" has gotten so annoying, it takes away from the value of the forum. I doubt that things will be very easy to manage like that.

reseller

6:04 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Folks

I see Matt "Inigo" Cutts has been very productive on his blog recently. Maybe its the effect of consuming more Bacon Polenta. Who knows :-)

Talking about spam...here is something good that Inigo wrote this morning:

SEO Mistakes: software mistakes
[mattcutts.com...]

Enjoy!

MikeDammann

6:11 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member



Thanks, I've read it already. That didn't really answer my question, but that's ok ;)

CrackSeo

7:19 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I still see the flux going on. Does any one else?

reseller

7:31 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



CrackSeo

>>I still see the flux going on. Does any one else?<<

Yes. I see the flux too on most DCs.

MikeDammann

7:52 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member



on 64.233.161.99?

reseller

8:09 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



MikeDammann

>>on 64.233.161.99? <<

No not on that one, as far as the sector I'm watching is concerned.

But on these 4 Dcs and several other DCs too:

66.102.11.99
66.102.11.104

66.102.9.99
66.102.9.104

colin_h

8:23 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)



Reseller,

At last, fighting talk. I think it would be nice to hear from the organisers of this forum about their thoughts on spam.

Is this forum for webmasters to learn about spamming techniques (Black or White Hat)?

IMHO, and I've said it a number of times ...

If you make changes to web pages, for no other reason than to list higher on your favourite search engine ... you are a spammer and you are taking the food out of more worthy webmasters' mouths.

If you think that because Google can't program you out in their algo updates, this is not a warrant to cheat further. You are a parasite, feeding off the droppings of real business people and if Google can't stop you ... the there should be laws to do it.

When I get back from my holiday, I will be building a site that outs you cheats & none of this "non-specific" rubbish ... I'm coming for you!

Power to You Reseeler & your everlasting optimism.

Colin

cleanup

8:53 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Hi Reseller,
There is of course nothing wrong with trying to fight SPAM.

Why don't you start a new thread about that and people can contribute to it as they see fit.

Cheerleading for Google is your opinion but again I don't think it contributes anything to this thread which is about the Jagger update.

For what its worth and from my viewpoint I think Google is having too many problems which they are not addressing to continue to be hailed and revered as a great search engine these days.

StriderUK

9:01 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



colin_h >>If you make changes to web pages, for no other reason than to list higher on your favourite search engine ... you are a spammer and you are taking the food out of more worthy webmasters' mouths. <<

So if I go through and optimize my web pages ensuring each page has a H1 tag repeating the title, am I then classed a spammer? We are all entitled to play on a level playing field. Get real.

reseller

9:13 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



colin_h

>>Power to You Reseeler & your everlasting optimism. <<

Thanks for the kind encouraging words. Much appreciated.

And here is something, from Mr. "Blue Eyes" :-)

"For what is a man, what has he got?
If not himself, then he has naught.
To say the things he truly feels;
And not the words of one who kneels.
....."

taps

9:18 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Back on topic. The most fascinating part of this pre-post-jagger-n+1-thread: flux.

I don't see any flux at all. And I'm waiting desperately for it.

Oh, hold on, I can see DCs with a significant lower pagecount for site:www.mysite.xy. It went down by 10.000 - there are still ~60.000 to go.

If you see flux, please tell me in which sectors you can see it.

My site recovered a bit from a dupe content penalty last week when jagger 3 probably ended. However it did not regain it's old strength. I think the pagecount is an indicator to show when my site might come back completely.

reseller

9:29 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



cleanup

>>Hi Reseller,
There is of course nothing wrong with trying to fight SPAM.
Why don't you start a new thread about that and people can contribute to it as they see fit.<<

Thanks.

The background for my Jagger/jagger3 anti-spam spots is/was to support Google WebSpam Team efforts during Jagger update to remove spam sites, especially at top of the serps. So in this sense its much Jagger related. Both GoogleGuy and Matt Cutts asked us to assist in reporting spam through posts within Jagger update.

Especially during and after Allegra and Bourbon updates there has been at least hundred posts of kind fellow members asking GooglGuy and Google to do something about scrapers and spemmers. Then GG and Matt have graciously responded to the calls and asked for spam reports.

Personally, spammers and contents thieves were just about to kill my main primary site which I have created in 1997. Some spammers stolen pages and others did a 302 hijacking. I spent months after Allegra just to clean and write nice and sometimes nasty emails asking spammers to leave my site alone.

Should I love those filthy spammers after all what they have done to my site? should I just sit back and watch my site get ripped off without doing anything?
Of course not ;-)

zikos

9:49 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)



[mattcutts.com...]
scrol down a bit and check his answer
PS: I might put out a call for comments on that test data center sometime this week.

zikos

9:52 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)



what he means "test DC" ,is jagger not finished are they still testing? why he or his alter ego GG haven't done any comments yet? Does google has screw things with Jagger?

tigger

9:55 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member tigger is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



well I don't know about everyone else but I've had it with this update and want to see the dam thing go stable so some of us can try to see what/if we should change anything on our sites.

We all know this was about links & spam but from where I'm sitting and the serps I monitor nothing has changed the spammers are stronger in fact on .co.uk results I'd say almost stronger and some of the sites that were involved in linking have vanished myself included within that and the only thing I did wrong was exchange links! does that make me a spammer? maybe but as we all try to build that little green bar up what else are we to do other than exchange links!

I'm rambling now I know and for now I've walked away from G traffic or should I say pushed away but fortunately I'm strong on both Y & MSN so G can take its update and - nope I'm not that mad but getting there!

Miop

10:06 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I too wish I knew it was definitely over! Our rankings on .uk are completely different (better) from the rest, and I'd guess that when they move the new serps my site will disappear completely (though I stil have no idea why - I've fixed most of the problems I thought were causing us to fall). G is still showing 19/11 cache for my home page and is avoiding me.

Dayo_UK

10:07 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Intresting MC has made a comment at all. Tends to ignore my comments on his blog regarding how far Jagger3 has progressed :)

However, I get the feeling that he was asked to keep quiet - eg Jagger promised Canonical/Supplemental changes - and the optomistic side of me thinks they may still be working on this - however, they probably want to do it in their own time......

MC & GG did rather suddenly go quiet on the whole update - and it still looks like it is running IMO.

Test, DC - is that still visible to us?

zikos

10:07 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)



tigger
We all know this was about links & spam
Bull S$%^T
Link farming doin great ,all this update was a CR£$P.
(Hope you check my sticky)
notice as well the PR of our friend

reseller

11:27 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member




Dayo_UK

>>Test, DC - is that still visible to us? <<

I guess... yes it is. Here is what GG and Matt use to talk about:

66.102.9.104

And it looks good from where I'm :-)

Dayo_UK

11:34 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Reseller

Well I assumed that he meant:-

[64.233.179.99...]

Which GG said was a test DC ages ago. (weeks)

However, I dont see anything encouraging about this DC - has a lot of pages displaying older cache versions - but cant see any improvements on the problems that Google has.

Although I am not happy that J3 has rolled out yet - hence 66.102.9.104 still being different.

What an absolute mess. :(

MikeDammann

11:35 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member



Here is what Google doesn't like:

seo without any implementation of changes that improve the quality of the site and therefor the search results. I never look at other seo's when it comes to finding my way. I imagine what I would want to see done if I was Google.

get real: being 100% self serving is not the way to go. It makes no difference if you're Black or white.

What matters is what the web surfers think about the results that they get. Are they satisfied or not? There is nothing more annoying than some of the threads on various forums discussing whether or not a competitor should be banned.

Do you think Google has time to nitpick? NO!

If you seo a site, then do it in a way that it benefits the Googlers as well. If you exchange links, do it in a way that it gives visitors more options. In other words: lose to tunnel vision and make some sense.

Sorry to say this, but I see a ton of @$$kissing here, and personally: Matt doesn't strike me as the kind of guy you need to suck up to.

So please, stop the talk and lead by example guys.

Show us some of your best work and lets get real :cool:

reseller

11:43 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Dayo_UK

>>Reseller
Well I assumed that he meant:-
[64.233.179.99...] <<

All I can say is the Dc you mentioned has an old cache of my homepage (21 Nov 2005 03:46:47 GMT.) while the DC I refered to [66.102.9.104...] has a new cache of my homepage (27 Nov 2005 04:03:35 GMT.).

So I guess we should keep looking at

[66.102.9.104...]

Dayo_UK

11:47 am on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Lol - Reseller

I meant old...... :)

[64.233.179.99...] - I have a homepage with cache of 21st February 2005 - while on [66.102.9.104...] it is 17th November 2005.

God know which one to watch - however, the important thing is that no DCs show a fix for the Googlebug problems at this stage.

tigger

12:12 pm on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member tigger is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



can I ask you guys something what does watching the DC's achieve?

reseller

12:13 pm on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Dayo_UK

>>God know which one to watch -<<

Few days and we shall hear it either from GG or Matt :-)

reseller

12:16 pm on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



tigger

>>can I ask you guys something what does watching the DC's achieve? <<

Meet new friends with same interest; The DCs Watchers Club :-)

Kangol

12:19 pm on Nov 28, 2005 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



"can I ask you guys something what does watching the DC's achieve?"

Sometimes Google let me see my site ranking on some obscure DCs for half hour. I get so high seeing that, my heart feels with love and I remember the old days. I get so motivated and start thinking that I could rank again. It keeps me motivated :)

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