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Kackle - can you explain the "dictionary" for me? And how I might benefit from it - Im reading your posts hard but dont see where youre coming from.
Sure. But you have to act quickly. Google will fix this one just like they fixed the hyphen.
1. Google is depreciating pages/sites that are over-optimized for certain keywords or keyword combinations. It does this by looking up search terms in a dictionary of target keywords or keyword pairs that it has compiled. This dictionary is Top Secret, because if you knew what was in the dictionary, you could avoid these words in your optimization efforts.
2. If the search term or terms hit on a dictionary entry, the search results for that user's search are flagged. This means that before the results are delivered, the order of the links, or even the inclusion of links, are adjusted so as to penalize pages that have overoptimizated for those terms. Most likely the title, headlines, links and anchor text are examined. It's possible that external anchor text pointing to that page has also been pre-collected and is available for scanning, but this is much less likely. (Besides, external links are not something within your immediate control, so don't worry about it right now.)
3. You want to find out which keywords that are relevant to your site are in Google's dictionary. Compile as many relevant keywords you can think of that searchers might use to find your site. Now take these words singly and in pairs, according to how users might search. Run two searches for each combination and compare the results.
4. If the results are strikingly different for the pre-filter and the post-filter search on a particular term or combination of terms, it means that some variation of those terms has been flagged because something was found in Google's dictionary.
5. Do lots of searches and you can come up with a list of "sensitive" words that you'll want to avoid when you re-optimize your pages.
It's a nice weekend project.
[uweb.superlink.net...]
If you need more info, you can PM me as I don't keep tabs on threads like these.
not all keywords just the major ones
How would Google define 'major'? AdWords?
WB
I think agent10 was right to say that Google should use this forum's voice before making this type of index live. This new index will kill many legimate sites and has made the serps for the most part irrelevent.
If Google isn't finished updating then it shouldn't make the results live. Test, test, and test again should be their method. I believe the current situation will hurt Google. People have little patience and will not tolerate such unless search results.
I'm starting to think giving out more links might be a good idea. Directories seem to be ruling the day for "area widgets" at least. Great time to shop for niche directories!
>Look around then. Our main site with around 200 pages was
>hammered. A smaller site with around 15 kept its position
One of our 6000+ pages sites has dropped 3 pages (to page 5 of SERPs) and our one page site has moved from #11 to #3.
Lots of our 10-15 page sites have not moved at all and some have moved up. Several 25-100 page sites have moved up or down or stayed the same.
Size does not appear to matter by itself.
It does cause confounding effects.
For example:
widget widget <country of the widget> (widget being something every site needs unless you do it yourself)
In this example what seems to be prevalent is lists & pay for inclusion lists of widget companies. (Interestingly the customers of these pfi directories are faring better in updateFlorida)
So once you have the authority sites for your keyword, do sites mentioned (doesn't have to be a link) on the authority site rank better?
Tip, you can preface your authority search with "resources for....."
I'm thinking of registering a new site and might think twice about the name now..
[Hey - if my site goes from #3 to #800 they must be silly results ;-) ]
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If this were to be the case, then how about the overly optimized sites / pages with "less popular" keyword phrases? With less popular and non-generic ones, it does not appear that the sites or pages are dumped by Google. IMHO, Google does not impose any filter based upon "on-page" factor. If that keywords are popular and competitive, then filter is applied based upon "on-site" factor.
You aren't looking very hard then. If the above was true, all brand.com sites would get penalized for "brand".
>Look around then. Our main site with around 200 pages was
>hammered. A smaller site with around 15 kept its position
>> One of our 6000+ pages sites has dropped 3 pages (to page 5 of SERPs) and our one page site has moved from #11 to #3.
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I second that...
>>> Lots of our 10-15 page sites have not moved at all and some have moved up. Several 25-100 page sites have moved up or down or stayed the same.
Size does not appear to matter by itself.
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Are your targeted keywords generic and super competitive?
The general trend right now does not seem to support that.
The hard work & time I/we all put into our sites to make them relevant and good resources for people (yes so we can profit but that's fair) and remember Google also relies on our sites to attract traffic to their search engine-- and with the snap of a finger they can take it all away from us overnight.
What is the point? Were their search results not relevant?
Now we are all going to have to take the time (invest more money) to rework our sites so that Google likes them again.
And in the end it will be the same relevant sites at the top that have always been there.
I don't undertand.
Should I support a company that does this?
I don't want to have to re-write every word on my sites. I can't afford to. Then again, I can't afford not to.
Yes my sites are relevant for certain searches, but now all traffic is gone. Why? Just because Google suddenly thinks sites that don't use these keywords are somehow more relevant?
I don't understand.
As far as my own personal search engine queries go, I hate to do it but I have already begune searching at alltheweb.com where I know I can get results similar to what I was getting at Google a week ago.
I know some of you are going to say I should not complain because the traffic I was getting from Google was free.
But ask yourself was the traffic really free?
I mean, consider the time and effort that goes into making the sites all nice and pretty for search engines.
Everyone with the work they do on their sites helps to make Google what it is. Without our sites, Google would have no results to show.
But when one player like Google controls so much (with their results also at Yahoo) I think it is questionable for them to be able to just flick a switch that turns out the lights like this across the board.
Many of us commercial sites have employees we pay based upon the traffic level we are expecting. But now the traffic is gone, and we still have top pay these people.
Am I supposed to freak out and start putting in time to frantically rearrange my site? Or am I supposed to hope that this is just temporary?
It just seems at a time like this that a company like Google has way too much power. If they are going to dramatically change results they perhaps should be regulated in some fashion. In other words, maybe they should only be allowed to change the results for a percentage of the search queries being conducted gradually over time, so as to not cripple various businesses instantly overnight by taking away traffic. You know, phase in a new algo over time. Because these search result changes are so drastic and so is the effect of it all.
Sorry for the venting. Good luck everybody.
don't panic, don't change anything - the results look silly - the sensible ones will be back.
Why would they throw away everything they know about determining the topic of a page? If they're going after "over-optimized" pages, that would be swell, but the way to attack that problem is to put a bell curve on keyword density or something. I believe they already stop counting "hits" after a certain number anyway.
I've seen some of our content drop in SERPs, some of it rise, and a big drop in referrals for a lot of search terms we didn't really deserve to show up for. Overall, Google referrals are down about 15%, but we still show up where we ought to.
It's a bit early to tell, but it seems we're getting broader overall coverage, with more search terms appearing in our logs. Is anyone else seeing "more search terms?"
