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11:32 pm on Nov 29, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Heads up for changes at the dc's. Rumors swirling that there have been some changes today momentarily.
11:49 pm on Nov 29, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Thanks for the heads-up, Brett. Let's hope they're not replacing the new spam with the old spam.
11:57 pm on Nov 29, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Yessir, index page is back on -gv for it's best money phrase.

--ranking right where it should be

12:02 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Fix'n a fresh pot o' java... Showering, and settling infor the evening!

Thanx for the Heads Up, Brett!

12:05 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I'm seeing -va and -lm showing the same different results, -kr showing a third version, none retrieving my client site.
12:06 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Results numbers are all over the place. Never seen some of them.
jb
12:14 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Looks like the same results from two to three days ago. The only difference I see is that the indented listings are not as zany, but the results are still poor.:(
12:18 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Dramatic change in my favour on some dc's.
I have noticed in the last couple days things have been bouncing around. Must have been a lead in to this.
12:20 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Big differences in the results numbers across the DCs for the terms I track. Some are 1/3 their previous count.
12:22 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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>>Big differences in the results numbers across the DCs for the terms I track. Some are 1/3 their previous count.

You are absolutely right. Huge differences.

12:33 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Not sure if it makes a difference, but the results on -gv are DEFINITELY from a master cached page over 2 weeks old on my site. I incrementally added my keywords to a search and migrated from page 8 to page 2. I can check the cache of each of the incremental searches and see the increase in highlighted keywords (no stemming btw) and it coincides with the SERPS which tells me that this isn't just a fluke old cached page because the SERPS are based on my KW density. Basically it's right where it should be... if I hadn't completely reworked my index page a few weeks ago that is. I upped my KW density to just a nudge below the #1 and #2 leaders for my sector. My competitors are still in the SERPS in the same old position. I ranked for a few days with the new cache and KW's, then dropped out for a few days (completely expected with large scale changes) and then came back in with an old cached page. None of my current pages are reflected in the cache or (apparently) the SERPS. I'm figuring once that changes I should be much further up the food chain than I was.

Personally I'm of the opinion that all the massive tweaking people have been doing is doing no good because the index from the last dance/update/fiasco (oops, did I say that outloud?) hasn't even settled yet (I'm living proof... my cache / SERP problem mentioned earlier). Any tweaking people are doing is likely to not show up for at least a few days, if not a few more weeks under these circumstances.

Granted, I'm no expert... but that's my take. I've noticed the fluctuations you're talking about too... something is changing... that's for sure.

12:40 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I noticed a missing site return on .de this morning, while also not degrading the better-than-before results that were there.
12:45 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Just checked most data centers. SERP's still full of directories and outdated sites related to "mycountry real estate."
1:51 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Are we getting back to a regular update schedule or does this feel more like adjustments?
1:51 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Personally I'm of the opinion that all the massive tweaking people have been doing is doing no good because the index from the last dance/update/fiasco (oops, did I say that outloud?) hasn't even settled yet (I'm living proof... my cache / SERP problem mentioned earlier). Any tweaking people are doing is likely to not show up for at least a few days, if not a few more weeks under these circumstances.

Anyone doing MASSIVE tweaking is doing the wrong thing in my opinion .... this is NOT about "over optimized" sites! Its about google ceasing the opporunity to bring in additional funds via adwords on highly competitive keyword phrases!

1:56 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I read somewhere (a link posted here) that a few weeks ago G's PR was messed up so they attemped to fix it and this problem is the outcome of it. Did anyone else see that article? If so can someone post it on here?
2:12 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Are we getting back to a regular update schedule or does this feel more like adjustments?

Adjustments.

There's been no regular update schedule since Dominic. The new process is a rolling update but we don't seem to be quite back into that yet.

I know people here like to think that Google is watching the forums and using it as feedback, maybe they are, but you can bet they're running thousands of searches themselves. With Florida they changed things. They've been monitoring the result. They're now twisting the knobs a little to fine-tune it. Maybe we'll see major changes, maybe the major changes are done and this is a tweak. I really hope that some of the white-hat info sites that got lost reappear now, but don't get your hopes up too much, just in case.

2:15 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Anyone doing MASSIVE tweaking is doing the wrong thing in my opinion

That's very true and exactly my point. I'm not so sure about the adwords angle though. I'd lend more credence to the theory that this is a trial run of full-fledged keyword stemming (check googles help... they've switched stances as of yesterday (?) and endorse this now. There are a few threads on this elsewhere) with some SERIOUS bugs.

Sure, there's some changes to tone down SEO and maybe some to test adwords, but I seriously think what happened here is they unleashed the keyword stemming without realizing what it would do to their density filters when 'widget', 'widgets', and 'widgeting' are stemmed into the same keyword. It may have set off the SEO flag and they're toying with how to fix it. Lending credence to this is the fact that for the past 2 days you could see evidence of stemming in the results and now all the sudden pages are reappearing... but stemming isn't.

Again... not an expert. Just rather "Spock like" in my approach to things.

Oh... and for the record, my massive update was needed and planned well in advance of the last update. It had nothing to do with Florida or any other update problems.

2:19 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I'm seeing the new SERPS on all DC's now btw. They're not MUCH different, but they're different. Can anyone else confirm that stemming is NOT being used in these results? I tested earlier on -gv for my own site and there was no stemming.
2:36 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Heyguys:

I am new here and still cannot figure it all out... but I suspect this whole thing is about OVER-OPTIZATION of KW and what better time for anyone to notice would be when it hits you right in the pocket... now for the holiday sales time.

Though having said that, the whole thing is ridiculous and I'm thinking... since my KW are compound words... I can easily split them up and see where that takes me... though my concern is that the current sites that are ranking have a keyword density of about .72%

That seems kind of low if you have a page which you try to describe something... well lets look at this way...

You have a 1000 word page and G is saying...you should only have your KW come up about 7 times?

How would something like this even be relevant?

Thanks
ARC

2:36 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I'm definately seeing stemming - Australia becomes Australian & Australia's.

I wonder if they're all combined to calculate KW density?

2:49 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I'm definately seeing stemming - Australia becomes Australian & Australia's.

What DC are you querying on and getting these results? I just tried the default and -va and got no stemming for keyword australia. Are you using keyphrases? If so, what are they so I can try and duplicate.

I wonder if they're all combined to calculate KW density?

This is what I was mentioning earlier. It stands to reason that if they're going to intuitively stem the users keywords, they're going to have to recalc the results based on a combined keyword density. If they don't do something along these lines there's no way to determine which sites are more relevant than others.

4:22 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I just did a search for seo and 6 of the top 20 websites were in Chinese. I am not an SEO, just thinking about hiring one, I can't keep up with this anymore, this is crazy, good thing for our print advertising.
4:43 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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nothing looks different to me
5:28 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Quick Quick! Another change in the Google SERPs! Let's all make changes to our sites ASAP, then we can check ALL the data centers every 5 min. Quick Quick, time is of the essence. Gotta go, time to check all the data centers....
5:52 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Looks to be the same rubbish to me.
5:55 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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It is very different on the few DCs that I checked. Luckily my main page and/or some deep pages from my site are ranked well on many of them.

Hopefully one of grips onto the www results.

8:10 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Hopefully this is the eye of Florida. -gv is the only movement I've noticed. Subjectively speaking on -gv with regard to index overboard:

'mystate big product' - rescued
'myregion mystate big product' - lost at sea
'mytown big product' - spotted, hope of rescue

10:27 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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The best way for Google to knock out all the over-optimised sites is to change the algorithm every 2 days - and of course, start it off with one that makes everyone delete all their keywords.
10:58 am on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Same bad results to me...-lm is not updated with backlinks.
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