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Thinking about new sites. Will high quality content sites get indexed quickly? Is anyone doing anything to get indexed quickly?
i'm guessing expired domains now will have to go through the sandbox, too?
Assuming that Google is scanning whois data one would have to assume then this would also be possible.
When sites get bought or taken over Domain name and site ownership change all the time. If Google scan whois for the registrant details then all sites that change hand would be subject to the sandbox effect regardless of content and as Google at the end of the day (should) pay more attention to its results than the registrant details of the website I would say the owner change alone is not enough to flick the sandbox switch.
However if an old site’s content entirely change over night along with the change of registrant details and possible IP move then this may set of the alarm bells. The other give away is that all inbound links that originally pointed to the old site x would be somewhat unrelated to the new content and this may also trigger off the sandbox and loss of PR.
I would say that the best way to avoid the sand box is to get lucky and find a decent and related old domain that is related to your market sector. To limit the possibiltiy of triggering the sandbox buy out your competition!
At the end of the day for all the time this would probably take (unless you were very lucky) I would take into consideration the sandbox effect into your project time line.
In my opinion my advice is to just do what SEO’s do best and adapt to the new conditions.
Expired domains go through a much longer and surer sandbox.Trust me.The quarantined time of course is subject to Google's whim but at the moment all evidence points to their whim being upto 12 months.
I would say that the best way to avoid the sand box is to get lucky and find a decent and related old domain that is related to your market sector. To limit the possibiltiy of triggering the sandbox buy out your competition!
Yes, or use the money to subscribe to Adwords, which is effectively what this is all about.
Yes, or use the money to subscribe to Adwords, which is effectively what this is all about.
True but I also thing Google is trying to take on spam from the gecko.
We have good, non-spam sites in sandbox since last year. We are constantly working on them and do not lose hope. I understand that Google may not care about our wasted money, but I would appreciate if Google stated overtly what they mean by sandbox and how it can be overcome.
In my opinion, Google are themselves responsible for the link farms by making links the most important factor. They should not punish for them, but create a better algorithm. I bet sandbox is a part of this story.
......but I would appreciate if Google stated overtly what they mean by sandbox and how it can be overcome.
One school of thought: the reason for the sandbox is to prevent spam getting into the index. By releasing the information to the public on how to overcome it would defeat the whole object. However the principle of the sandbox should be made public in due course (after the testing phase).
We innocently changed ip + content..... the site died.
One site is a couple of years old with high PR. I now want to translate it. Normally I would register a new country specific domain name for that new translation and wait but now that the waiting period for new domains to perform is 8+ months I will now register the new domain and assign it with a temporary 'holding' site and leave it for 8+ months until it is out of the box. In the mean time I will host the newly translated site on the back of one of my existing sites www.myfullyindexedsite.com/transalation/ until its time to switch.
Does anyone know if sub domains of established sites are subject to the sandbox?
If only new sites are subject to the sandbox effect and new pages on established site are not then in one of my sites I could get around it this way:
I created and optimised a completely new page on my established site on Friday and it is ranking reasonably well today in a very competitive area. This seems to confirm that the sandbox does not apply to new pages on established sites.
I'm just giving it more time.
I know that my new websites can beat anything that is out there for its topic in both quality and quanity.
I’m thinking that you have a large staff proofreading that large “quanity” of pages you’re pumping out…
"I know that my new websites can beat anything"That isn't necessarily arrogant. Ideally, you would choose a topic because you know you create a site of better quality and depth than the competition, having thoroughly researched the competition first.
!What an arrogance!
The real purpose of the Sandbox is to piss off SEO people, which is seems to have done quite nicely.
If you have to wait 3 to 6 months before the effects of any new links, or changes to links (including both anchor text effects and PR effects) show up, it will discourage all the SEO people.
It seems to be working.
Google doesn't really give a crap if your new site doesn't show up. They would say "stop being a cheapskate and buy some adwords."
where there's a will there's a way...listen to cabbie, there are many dying sites that can be picked up for next to nothing.
Start using subdomains.
Add new "sections" onto existing sites.
Be creative. This too shall pass. Do the dance and just try to stay one step ahead. Complaining and whining doesn't seem to be working, so do it the hard way.
Why has the Discussion been edited from 'Beating the Sandbox effect' to 'Beating the penalty effect'?
This is about the Sand Box effect. Penalty effect can happen to both new and old sites.
Most definitely. The open question is whether bought/transferred domains go through the sandbox? Such is not necessarily suspicious. If I buy "Joe's Pizza" in my hometown from Joe, and keep selling pizzas there, unless I change the recipe dramatically likely the customers won't care. If I buy example.com, and keep up most of the same content there, why should the visitors to that site care much?
Google doesn't really give a crap if your new site doesn't show up. They would say "stop being a cheapskate and buy some adwords."I will pay for advertising, but I'll be damned if I'm giving the money to Google. There is overture, adsonar, paid directories, newspapers, etc.
Why has the Discussion been edited from 'Beating the Sandbox effect' to 'Beating the penalty effect'?WW doesn't seem to like the term. I'm guessing this [sandbox.msn.com] is the reason, but am not sure. I agree something more descriptive should be used like 'new site penalty' or perhaps the "sucked into Google's black hole" effect.
I like "google black hole," it fits the idea perfectly: an enormous mass of junk that cannot be seen from the outside. Even light rays can't escape...
This is an excepted and acknowleged term by SEO's not just on WW and it certainly not 'The Penalty Effect' come on mods you can do better than that.
This is not the case. It's not a "penalty", Google is merely DISCOUNTING the value of new links until they have matured.
And that's what I imagine is happening. Google considers whether or not to put a site high in the rnakigns, or low, based in large part on the aggregate power of its inbound links.
Suppose a link that's less than 6 months old counts as only 5% of an old link? That would explain what's happening.
it will discourage all the SEO people
Only the ones that give up easy. The other ones will work so hard that once they do get out, they will be that much harder to knock off.
make a search of any general KW of your area and see how many out of 1st 10 Results are Newly (4-5 months old) websites?
For my Dream KW... about 1st 50 results are OLD sites...old more then an year or so.
