'Stuck' on PR2

4th update and still no change despite backlinks

[Doozer]

I run a number of different small business websites and over the years and I like to think that I have become quite proficient (mainly through the tips gained here!) in getting a small new site into the top page for its main keywords in google within a couple of updates through basic linking and building the site properly.

However, I launched a new site at the tail end of 2002 which was no different fundamentally to anything else I had done before, or since and it was given a PR2 back in the January update. It had no backlinks then, fair enough, quite typical...
Next update comes along, Backlinks at 0, still PR2. Okay, third time lucky...
Dominic update, lots of strangeness across my whole network, backlinks lost all over the place, site in question still no backlinks, not unexpected due to wierdness.
Esmeralda update comes along and all the backlinks I worked hard to get 6 months ago are finally found, including DMOZ, Google Dir, Lycos Dir and a whole host of other relevant ones (with good PR's) totalling 30+ links. Hooray I think... The result... the PR is still at 2!
The thing that makes this irritating is that some of my later sites that are in the same industry "vaguely" and link to it are getting ranked higher because its main keyword is mentioned in its link!

What I ask is... eternal PR2 is a bit of a strange one that I haven't seen before, is it likely that the site has been penalised in some way? If so, how do I find out?
Has anyone else experienced this "low PR for ages, despite backlinks" behaviour? What happened long term?

Cheers in advance if you can shed any light.

D

[msr986]

There seems to be a lot of talk that the PR values have not been fully calculated yet for the recent update (updates?).

There has also been some talk that we should not pay much attention to the PR in the toolbar.

The real question is, how well do you rank on your favorite keywords?

If you have a penalty, your pages will probably be very low in the SERP's.

[mfishy]

If it makes you feel any better, Yahoo! is showing a drop to PR9 with 800,000 backlinks.

I would hold tight. If PR is finished, Google has botched it really badly. More likely, it is still in the works

[ogletree]

My PR has gone from PR2 to PR3 back and forth for the last month. Also my site is showing up in other sites backlinks so I must have at least a PR3 or PR4.

[rogerd]

The toolbar is Google's experiment in group psychology, and WebmasterWorld is the lab. I guess that would make us rats? :)

[Doozer]

> There has also been some talk that we should not pay much attention to the PR in the toolbar.

I also try to get values from the directory listings wherever possible as I consider these to be more accurate (is this true or false?)... same result.

> The real question is, how well do you rank on your favorite keywords?

Not well at all. As I said in my initial post, newer sites of mine that are much less relevant rank higher even for keyword-in-domain specific searches! odd indeed.

> If you have a penalty, your pages will probably be very low in the SERP's.

I'd say top 50's, so more of a "slapped wrist" rather than a penalty!

I'll conclude that "wait it out" is the best advice (as usual with google)!

[Brett_Tabke]

and you've noticed lots of lower pr sites beating higher pr sites?

pr is but one aspect of the algo...concentrate on the others.

[requiem]

Ofcourse I could be very wrong. GG wrote is the questions&answers post that PR is all natural, but I think Google is using a PR ceiling as a semi-penalty. I have never had a site go PR2 after getting listing in DMOZ, Yahoo and Zeal. A site will almost always jump right up to a toolbar PR of 4 or 5. However if your results on the SERPs are ok don't worry about the little green line.

The toolbar is Google's experiment in group psychology, and WebmasterWorld is the lab. I guess that would make us rats? :)

LOL :-)

[edit reason: misspelling of 'Google']

[edited by: requiem at 3:20 pm (utc) on June 23, 2003]

[mfishy]

<<GG wrote is the questions&answers post that PR is all natural, but I think Goolge is using a PR ceiling as a semi-penalty.>>

SearchKing

[ogletree]

I have been in Yahoo, Zeal, and DMOZ for several years and have had a PR2 until just recently. It is now a PR3. I think you get a higher PR if you are in a better part of DMOZ. My site is burried real deep. Almost all my directory lising are on PR2 or PR0 pages.

[illad]

I too have been stuck in PR limbo since late February.
My newer sights now have a plethora of quality backlinks, yet I still have NO pagerank calculation, they are stuck at PR0. Based on my other sights, I've estimated they should have at least a PR5-6.

Brett, it would be wonderfull if your ever so simple assessment actually still held true. Unfortunately when a sight has 0% Pagerank calculation, and pagerank is a multiplier of the content, your page simply won't rank. These sights don't come up anywhere in the top 100, they stay at the bottom of the bucket because google has NOT calculated their pagerank.

[markus007]

I have 3 sites that haven't changed since feb. Ones a PR 4 with 128 backlinks from PR 7 (1 of 3 other links on that page) and a host of PR6's and 5's and i am still sitting at a PR4. My other 2 sites are setting at PR0 and they also have a host of backlinks. It seems no PR calculation has been done since feb.

[natural]

i have about 100 first page SERPs with 0 PR pages. you guys need to make better sites. the kw's i'm ranked for generally return between 300,000 and 3,000,000 results, and i have under a dozen backlinks, no dmoz, and a pr0.

i think that i have to take a ww break. reading all of the hysteria drives me crazy.

[jdancing]

Tale of two sites

I have a site that has one PR4 link (from the site detailed below) and about 75 outbound links and was surprised to see that it jumped to a PR 3.

My other site that is in Yahoo and DMOZ has about 30 outbound links and 80 plus incoming links and is stuck on a PR 4. Of the 80 incoming links about 70 have been added since the site hit Google at PR 4.

Serp results are the same or a bit worse on both sites. However, I am cleaning up on Alltheweb serps on my second site as I seem to be given full credit for my link ratio. Unfortunately I get about one hit per month from Alltheweb.

I can't make any sense of how PR is calculated anymore. It seems only three or four strong incoming links are all you need and additional links have diminishing returns.

Next site I cut some deals for incoming links with two or three PR 6/7 sites and quit wasting time chasing down incoming links. More links are no longer merrier.

[decstar]

I foolishly added my site to searchking when I first set it up. I didn't pay anything, just submitted for a free link. Will I be penalized for this? Should I remove it?

Decstar

[Kirby]

pr is but one aspect of the algo...concentrate on the others.

Brett,

In light of the possible de-emphasis on PR and now that things seem to have settled down, are there any amendments you would make to your 26 steps to success?