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A 14-year-old Travis County girl who said she was sexually assaulted by a Buda man she met on MySpace.com sued the popular social networking site Monday for $30 million, claiming that it fails to protect minors from adult sexual predators......Attorneys general from five states, including Texas, have asked MySpace.com to provide more security, the lawsuit said. Texas Attorney General Greg Abbott sent a letter to the MySpace.com chief executive officer May 22, asking him to require users to verify their age and identity with a credit card or verified e-mail account...
...Lauren Gelman, associate director of the Center for Internet and Society at Stanford Law School, said she does not think MySpace is legally responsible for what happens away from its site.
Damn! Watch this one. May have huge implications for user generated content sites.
[edited by: engine at 4:32 pm (utc) on June 20, 2006]
[edit reason] Added quote to link [/edit]
If your kids are online and you haven't had a talk with them sharing some of the horrific stories out there... you are not doing your job. The common theme is let someone else teach my kids. Or my kid is too good, they would never do that.
If you teach your kid and this still occurs, then the blame is on the kid... the girl is 14! She knows what is right and wrong.
This is not exactly on the same level but I got busted stealing when I was 14. Was it my friend's fault for getting me into it? Hell no. It was my own damn fault because I knew it was wrong and still did it. I didn't need my parents to tell me it was. I sure learned my lesson... the hard way. I blame no one but myself. Personal Responsibility.
End of Story.
Also if some one decides to take an online affair offline, what can an online entity do?
They could stop providing the introduction service.
Was it my friend's fault for getting me into it? Hell no. It was my own damn fault because I knew it was wrong and still did it.
I think you are defeating your own argument. What you are telling us is that you were unable to behave because you were too silly or immature, just like the girl in question but she was sexually abused. It's a wee bit different.
If you teach your kid and this still occurs, then the blame is on the kid... the girl is 14! She knows what is right and wrong.
I rest my case :(
A. People fear what they don't understand. Hence why parents of teens (a large target demographic of the mainstream media) are easily scared by these "internet predator" stories.
B. People love a scandal involving a huge player (Myspace) owned by a huge company (NewsCorp).
All the technological safeguards, controls and policing in the world are no substitute for parental involvement.
For example,
who is this [cache.defamer.com]?
put that on the front page of MySpace and all their problems would be solved.
edited ...
Oh, sorry, someone has already done it [80s.com]
MySpace could make an "under-18" captcha.
A trivia question that no one under 18 would know the answer to.
The problem simply is that things like this can happen anywhere. Not only on myspace but here on webmasterworld or any other forum or place where people exchange messages and meet online. Or it can happen offline on the way to school, the bus stop, the local library, public pool, the gym or any other place where people meet and hang around.
That's life and it's the parents job to prepare their children for it.
And if they think the child is not prepared to use the internet or to go to a public swimming pool alone they have to take measures to prevent it.
Hence why parents of teens (a large target demographic of the mainstream media) are easily scared by these "internet predator" stories.
No. They are scared by the sexual assault of children stories. But then it is not stories is it? It is fact.
And if they think the child is not prepared to use the internet or to go to a public swimming pool alone they have to take measures to prevent it.
.. and these would be?
.. and these would be?
Or take some time and talk with the kid about the dangers that are out there. I think I was about four or five when my parents taught me not to simply trust strangers and not to get into the car of a stranger. And I never did. This girl was 14.
Hop on over to your favorite news outlet for details.
It's a shame really.
MySpace knew they had teens posing as adults. MySpace knew there were sexual predators. MySpace knew that there was a danger to minors.
You want an offline analogy as to why they are responsible...
Drinking and smoking. A nightclub/bar will be fined and eventually shut down if they serve alchohal to a minor. A store will be fined if they sell cigerrets to a minor. A store or a nightclub can be sued if someone who was drinking in their establishment drives home and kills someone on the way. A nightclub/bar can be sued if they allow behavior that leads to death or injury. MySpace has done just that.
I was a teenager once. My parents told me that meeting up with guys was bad. They regulated where I went and when I had to be home. I said F&^% 'em, what did they know. I snuck out and met up with guys. I am lucky I didn't get raped myself. My parents did everything in their power to make sure I was safe and I still managed to find a way around them.
Heck, these parents could have told their daughter she was only allowed to go to the library and she could have gotten on MySpace there.
MySpace is an internet eutopia that people want to cling to, the same as they wanted to cling to the whole the internet is a place of "free" information.
Eutopias are still responsible for their members. MySpace, in tehir pursuit of some greater marketing buzzword has become like a bar that everyone knows will serve alcohal to a minor. The bartender saying, "Well, they looked 21" is no excuse.
There are sustained law enforcement operations working through a number of chat-systems to detect and take action against predators. They also offer advice about managing the threat.
I'd like to know if such an operation was being undertaken at MySpace, if the offender had come to the attention of the investigation and if not why not.
The fact that MySpace has ignored requests from the Attorney Generals of multiple states to implement reliable verification is going to be a big negative for MySpace in court.
Something as simple as not allowing free e-mail addresses to be used may be able to reduce the threat on MySpace. First - minors rarely have non-free e-mail addresses and will hence need the assistance and implicit agreement of an adult or more senior person to set up the account; Second - the potential predator has left a warmer trail as to his identity, as at some point he has had to purchase the email account as part of an internet package or otherwise.
Parents have had 10 years to get the message about their kids and the internet. Yes, this is a tradgey, but an even greater tradegy is the lack of parenting. Where are the dozens of stories about irresponsible parents?
About 8 weeks ago, after watching yet-another setup "gotcha" job by NBC - I looked at Erika and said, "this is only going to end in lawsuits enmass against MySpace. This is flatout an attack on MySpace by NBC". They ran "predator" story after story and set people up to look guilty. Never mind that this exact same thing could have been done over-n-over for the last 10 years on the net. It has little to do with MySpace at all, and everything to do with ineffective parenting and a competitor taking shots at perceived power threat.
Personally, if anyone should be sued here, it should be NBC for all their stories and setup jobs that precipitated and instigated this action. It smacks of a competitor (NBC) trashing another (NewsCorp) for pure ratings and personal gain.
How can a national news company get away with things like all those ambush interviews and setup jobs they did on Dateline over the last 3 months? They single handidly villified MySpace. The same setup done by your local police would have been laughed out of court. Yet dateline goes into chat rooms and myspace accounts to target 'sexual predators'. The undertow of the entire series was, "please - someone sue myspace...". Well, here you go NBC - you win and the Internet loses once again.
This stuff is bad and as worse as it gets for the internet as a whole - it hurts us all. We were just getting to the point where all the old criticisms against the net were fading into memory. All these old chat room stories from the 90's had slowly faded from the publics image of the net....now this crap by nbc.
More of the NBC assault on the internet:
[msnbc.msn.com...]
"Remember, you don't need a computer to connect to the internet - only a modem, and that costs about $12 dollars a month" - Stone Phillips - NBC Nightly News Spring 1997.
Heck, these parents could have told their daughter she was only allowed to go to the library and she could have gotten on MySpace there.
Or she could have met the guy right there at the library without Myspace ever involved. But nobody would ever think of suing the library.
It says in the article:"In May, after a series of e-mails and phone calls, he picked her up at school, took her out to eat and to a movie, then drove her to an apartment complex parking lot in South Austin, where he sexually assaulted her, police said. He was arrested May 19."
So you could with the same arguments also sue the email provider, the phone company, the school, the movie theater, the place where they went out for lunch and the apartment complex owner. Of course not to forget the car manufacturer.
Or you could ask what is wrong in a family when the parents did not notice this going on for such a long time. Did they even care whom she called, whom she met and where she went after school?
It is very wrong to blame the victim and it is very wrong to blame the parents. As anyone who has or knows of a sexually assualted child will very well know.
It is also wrong to blame anyone that ir brave enough to stand out and say something against sexual assault. This will be with the little girl for years to come.
Drinking and smoking. A nightclub/bar will be fined and eventually shut down if they serve alchohal to a minor. A store will be fined if they sell cigerrets to a minor. A store or a nightclub can be sued if someone who was drinking in their establishment drives home and kills someone on the way. A nightclub/bar can be sued if they allow behavior that leads to death or injury. MySpace has done just that.
Thank you Hanna for more eloquently saying what I have been trying to say. You have summed it up very well.
Parents have had 10 years to get the message about their kids and the internet.
* You have to understand what is like being the parent of a teenager before blaming the parents.
* You have to understand that more than a few parents have no interest in computers, don't have one, don't want one and don't even know that this problem exists. That is their choice and it is not necessarily a real failure on their part. That is why the burden of responsibility must be with the provider, just like the bar owner in Hanna's example
* You have to understand that very few people are like us who spend a large part of our lives immersed in IT and the Internet.
* You have to understand that kids need some freedom to allow them to grow up.
* You have to understand that most teenagers are convinced that they know better than their parents.
* You have to understand that is a teenager's duty to disobey the rules. That is why people like the Rolling Stones, Marilyn Manson, Eminem et al were/are so popular.
* You have to understand that that is why you disobeyed your parents as a teenager. (Well, didn't you?)
Well, here you go NBC - you win and the Internet loses once again.This stuff is bad bad and more bad for the Internet as a whole.
Brett, the Internet most certainly does not lose. Apart from the free publicity and the rush by certain people to log on and check out what it is all about the Internet wins in any situation where something triggers an action to make it safer for kids and to minimise the possibility of more of these crimes occurring. As Hannamyluv said MySpace and the others chat providers are not stupid. They know that this goes on and they accepted that children may be abused as a result.
They could have put in place mechanisms to make their site safer but it would have had a serious affect on their success. Sadly this is acceptable collateral damage in today's business world. "What if some kids are abused?" "No problem, we'll just blame the parents!"
When I was growing up, and my parents had seen that I had written even a slight amount of the trash I have seen kids write on mySpace, I would still be grounded, well into my 40's.
Old fashioned? Maybe. But a good way to not get molested maybe too. Kids can sneak and do things, but to say parents are just too inept and unsavvy to take care of their own kids is just pathetic.
Old fashioned? Maybe. But a good way to not get molested maybe too. Kids can sneak and do things, but to say parents are just too inept and unsavvy to take care of their own kids is just pathetic.
And you have raised how many children of your own?
How can someone being sexually assaulted have anything to do with a parent? (in most cases)
Does that mean a 28 year old woman is sexually assaulted it must be her fault, or even her parents.
Why so many people here are blaming the system, the parents, etc disgusts me.
I say analyse it - find a way to make sure it does not happen again, and/or at least limit the chances.
Sick.
I am not going to look at this thread again, as I find the whole issue of an under age girl being sexually assaulted being taken so lightly very disturbing.
I can only assume many posting here are not parents, and/or do not know anyone close that has been sexually assaulted.
But things like that only ever happen to other people right?! never ourselves or anyone we know.
should be put to rest based on conslusive evidence ...
if putting to rest is not an option, then castration and permanent incarceration would be the next viable option.
I'd have to agree with this. It's all too common for someone who commited this type of crime to do it again.
I agree that the 'perv' is the culprit in this, but the blame should be on the parents as well. How about a bit of supervision, people? Why let your 14 year old kid spend hours and hours on the computer without checking up on what she's doing?
Is it because it leaves you with free time to do whatever you want? Is it because at least you do not argue with your teenage daughter or son?
Why not restrict access to the internet to supervised times when you can check from time to time what they're doing? Why not restrict access to the net to only school related tasks (1/2hours a day) when you can check from time to time what they're doing? Why not put the computer in a central place in your home where you can check from time to time what they're doing? see a trend developing here?
If you've got a kid who spends most of his/her time on the Net, it's your responsability as a parent to learn how to use the computer and make sure it is a safe place for them. The same way you would check the playground to make sure it's safe for them to play. You wouldn't leave them there without supervision, now would you? (it was a very good analogy)
A store or a nightclub can be sued if someone who was drinking in their establishment drives home and kills someone on the way
this should not be allowed/legal - it's the drinker responsability not to drive drunk
edit reason:typos
[edited by: le_gber at 8:38 am (utc) on June 22, 2006]
"How can someone being sexually assaulted have anything to do with a parent? (in most cases)"
We are not talking most cases, we are talking isolated cases involving chat rooms.
"I say analyse it - find a way to make sure it does not happen again, or at least limit the chances."
On limiting the chances, how about this:
Parent says to child: 'I see that the chat room that your involved with, AND THAT I MONITOR CONSTANTLY, is getting out of hand and I am going to put a stop to it.'
As I said, tried to say, if my parents had seen me write the stuff I have seen being written, I would not have had access to the PC at home, unsupervised, period.
I did not even mean to suggest that the molester was not responsible, but it is up to parents to watch like a hawk, a parent hawk, anything that may danger their child.
I did not even mean to suggest that the molester was not responsible, but it is up to parents to watch like a hawk, a parent hawk, anything that may danger their child
Yes I am sorry. I must live in another world. One where kids, drink and smoke before being legally allowed, oops and then drugs, Teen pregnancies, internet cafes, parties, violence and porn on the web, handhelds, shcool violence, crime and a million other things.
But yes, these could all be avoided if parents were more vigilant.
After all none of us ever did anything we should not do, twice or even a third time, and is we did manage to get away with something then it was out parents fault because that is a parents job.
After all when we were teenagers we told out parents everything but we did not really need to as they already knew everything.
but it is up to parents to watch like a hawk, a parent hawk, anything that may danger their child.
Here we go again, I feel like I am banging my head against a brick wall here. These people do not live in the real world. :(
This is not, or should not, be about blaming anyone. Perhaps the parents did a WONDERFUL job of raising their daughter, but she just didn't listen to them about this one area. Maybe she was rebelling. Who knows? The girl made a dumb choice. The boy made a heinous choice. Those are the only things we can safely say in this case.
What kind of parents let their son grow up thinking it's OK to rape 14 year old girls?
Yes I am sorry. I must live in another world. One where kids, drink and smoke before being legally allowed, oops and then drugs, Teen pregnancies, internet cafes, parties, violence and porn on the web, handhelds, shcool violence, crime and a million other things.But yes, these could all be avoided if parents were more vigilant.
While suggesting that myspace should be protecting children, some of you keep saying at the same time that parents aren't able to do it effectively.
Someone else already brought this up, but I'll ask again. If a parent in a one to one relationship can do so little, exactly why do you think myspace can do so much?
If you think kids will run wild while mom isn't looking, what will they do when myspace isn't looking? All of the current "big brothers" in the world can't even protect children effectively.
Someone guilty of a crime should certainly have penalties. I don't see how myspace falls on any list of those most able to protect children from anything. If failing to protect a particular child is a civil offense, then I'm sure we can find a number of people and companies that did not protect this particular child. As mentioned, parent(s), other family, friends, ISP, backbone, myspace, host, programmers, etc.
Word is, the boy is joining the lawsuit against MySpace.
Think I am offbase about NBC? Here is one of their classic scripts. Is is another one of their anti internet formula peices:
[msnbc.msn.com...]
