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Overture is also on Lycos!
Do think that "average Joe" will see it?
I guess FAST is just trying another revenue stream before their search technology sales can support the whole operation. I think AlltheWeb is just a PR and exposure vehicle for FAST's core product anyway, as i think Heini has said several times.
The Overture deal is exclusively with Alltheweb
Heini, This is not the case. Lycos is also showing Overture in the US.
Lycos.Europe shows Espotting PPC listings on top.
So while you are of course correct, Lycos.com does show Overture listings, that's an old deal between Lycos and Overture, while the deal between Allthweb/Fast and Overture is new.
>Deception
Well, if you insist on this term, so be it. Just tell me: do you know of any search destination on the web, where it says: those are not onjectively ranked search listings, those are paid ads?
All in all, this Thursday has brought us a glimpse at what Google serps will look like in the near future, plus it has brought us a once cool fast advanced users searchdestination, Alltheweb, cluttered with Overture listings.
Not a good day.
I still wonder what the thinking behind this move is. I tend to agree - if Alltheweb still is a showcase only, then it's not a very clever move to dump Overture onto the serps.
In response to the postings about the Overture links, here's the deal:
AllTheWeb is, and will continue to be, the technology showcase for Fast. The newest, most advanced search features are on display here and we will continue to add new features going forward. All these features are available in our products that we sell to to our customers - portals and companies with large data search problems.
At the same time, AllTheWeb is a cost center for Fast and we need to reimburse the cost of the site to the extent that we can. That's why you now see the Overture links.
Overture links are only for US based IP addresses which is why some of you are not seeing them.
Thanks for your feedback and suggestions about search features on the site - they help us to improve the search engine.
Do you really think adding third party PPC listings is a good move for a technology showcase?
you might as well have chosen adwords
I'm a bit puzzled: how much are the costs for showcasing the websearch you are selling to your partners anyway on a seperate site? Is it really that much?
>AllTheWeb is, and will continue to be, the technology showcase for Fast
Too sad...
>AllTheWeb is, and will continue to be, the technology showcase for Fast
>Too sad...
I agree. Seems as though Fast is working as hard as anyone on producing relevant results. The technology is there, the search engine is live, and now the revenue-generation (Overture) is in place. Why not promote the engine and make some money? It would also get your brand name out to companies that are looking for search solutions. The "yeah, I have heard of you guys" factor is amazing on sales calls.
Or maybe I am preaching to the choir?
When this happens, it's typical for company execs to think, "Hey, let's double this next quarter and all get rich!"
I think FAST has sold out, pure and simple. If this latest move were the last gasp of an unprofitable company, I might be more understanding.
This all would be simply great and wonderful, were it not for those Overture results.
Personally I don't care how they are called, as long as they are clearly marked, and they are as clearly marked as it gets on the web.
For many people this comes as a dissapointment. Fast was seen, along with Google, as a bastion of free, relevant, unpaid websearch.
So I'm not sure putting up PPC listings on their showcase Alltheweb is such a fantastic idea public relations wise.
AllTheWeb is used by FAST to demonstrate there websearch application.
It's a show off.
Most of the Portals that FAST is powering, the search function is a major part of the portal, and therefore an important income.
FAST can use Overture results to show that they can interpretate PPC listing in the results.
And why wouldn't they want to get money?
Almost every portal uses PPC listing before they show the FAST results.
AllTheWeb.com gets about 2 million queries each day, instead of just using it as a show off, why don't instead make some money on it, instead of just use it as a pure search.
They also bring up a communication line with Overture, which may be good for further co-operation especially in the US.
If you want to discuss semantics and ethics of paying for placement, Brett has just given you a full own thread to do so.
Back on topic: Fast has up to now used Lycos for placing ads on Alltheweb.
I believe even the occasional, Kanoodle driven Start Here PPC listing came through Lycos network.
I wonder if this move means Fast is going to act more independantly with marketing Alltheweb.
I wonder if this move means Fast is going to act more independantly with marketing Alltheweb.
Well the reason is that they want to make money, and the effect is that it will cost us more money with our Overure listing. We will get less free relevant results generated clicks. Is that on topic? :)
>alltheweb as startsite
well obviously - see Jami's statement above - Fast does not intend to do so. Which is a pity.
Fast does not intend to do so. Which is a pity.
Why???
Sure it looks great and it has great functions, will they make a large profit from it, IMHO NO!!!
And since FAST is company listed on the stockmarket it's pretty important for them to make a profit.
You don't get the same amount of money from displaying Overture results as you get from powering a portal like Lycos.
But my interests are those:
- have an alternative to the ubiquitous Google
- see another great search engine rise
- have another venue for promoting websites without playing the PPC game
I think I just let Stephen, Jami, Knut and all the folks at Fast define Fast's interests themselfes.
FAST Isn't Google.
ALL INFO BELOW IS MY OPINION.
- see another great search engine rise
Yes, FAST is great, but fast isn't a PURE search engine, they don't have a "destination site" like Google.
Sure there are positive things to have a Destination site and there is negative things.
I do belive FAST have thought of this pretty much.
AND there isn't a search engine/crawler based company out there that rises as FAST as FAST is doing.
-my concern is a potentially great search engine not really taking off.
FAST have taken off, they have made a profit, that's the #1 thing for every company out there.
They don't care if you don't like them placing Overture results on the top of the searches, use someone else.
Google presents up to 10 ads per page, that's extermly much. And they are bigger and users see them more.
I know it's hard for some to realise that FAST isn't here to please us, neither is Google.
They don't care if you (not you heini, SEO in general) like there way of presenting results or not, you are one.
As long as they see an increase of queries compare to other search engine they won't bother, if 1 man/woman
thinks it bad with PPC listings.
And YES, they care what we SEO people think but not to the extend that most SEO people think they do.
We "spam" them, we give them results that shouldn't be there (i know this isn't the case for every
SEO out there)
Even if they place 3 Overture results on the top of AllTheWeb, SEO will still pay for the PFI program.
I guess most people get the FAST traffic from Lycos, and they have had PPC listings for a long time.
AllTheWeb only get the 2 million queries of the 50 million queries made each day.
So you will probably not see a difference at all from the traffic from AllTheWeb.
From the top of my head:
lost Sympatico
lost Web.de
lost regional Lycos sites
won Telius
Both sections, lost and won are not complete. But it sure doesn't look like taking off.
That's what I'm criticising about this move: taking Overture on board does not help with publicity.
Fast has won some very important and prestigous deals in the corporate search industry - that's where the big money is.
Powering all Lycos sites except Lycos.co.jp right?
FAST Needed the publicity, and therefore the deal with the goverment was great.
What would be the reason to maintain product marketing for a techonolgy showcase?
The regular ads however displayed on ATW are handled by Lycos. I'm pretty sure this was also true for the occasional "Start Here" PPC listings from Kanoodle.
So I would be surprised if the implementation of Overture listings at ATW was not in some way handled by Lycos too.
It's Lycos.com, the US division, handling the advertizing on ATW.
Lycos.com, as opposed to Lycos.Europe, which partners with Espotting, also has had deals with Overture for a long time.
