Forum Moderators: open
| Yahoo_Mike Junior Member   msg #:1 | 1:18 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| I'm not certain if folks here have seen Forrester's recent Consumer Technographics Survey, but it cites some interesting stats on Yahoo! vs. Google search. According to the survey, Yahoo! Search and Google are at a draw – personalization, presentation and quality of service are considered the big differentiators now, with the nod ultimately going to Yahoo! Search. PC World cites the survey's findings. While this is great validation, I think we also recognize the fact that we still have a lot to accomplish and we're working really hard to make improvements to our services and more important, address the issues and concerns identified on this forum and others. Much more to come in the weeks and months ahead.
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| stevenmusumeche Junior Member msg #:2 | 2:52 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Congrats to Yahoo. I control many sites, and only get about 10% of my referrers from Yahoo. Many of that 10% is from Overture. So Yahoo may be improving in quality, but from my vantage point, not market share.
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| notredamekid New User msg #:3 | 3:00 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
you're joking, right?
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| robjones Junior Member msg #:4 | 3:10 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Sorry if this is an obvious question, but what are the personalization features in the report?
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| nutsandbolts Senior Member  msg #:5 | 3:28 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Congrats Yahoo! Started a new site a few weeks ago and Yahoo has already indexed many pages and took my new XML news feed a few days ago. Google hasn't even started to crawl the site.
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| kmick New User msg #:6 | 3:32 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| A very nice survey result for Yahoo. I don't know how to measure personalization and presentation, may be they're the things just like art work, every body see thing differently, so, I'm not going to said anything. But the "quality of service", I don't know how TURE it is, but what I do know is that the result of this survey might not be the same again, if it DO collecting its user data from the people like me - working in internet related business. As a webmaster, sites that I managed are not listed in the search result unless my customers willing to pay Overtune. As a user, I don't think I got a complete result from Yahoo, many sites were simply not included in the SER. However, to be fair for Y, non-commercial search is not worst than G.
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| Sparrow Nine New User msg #:7 | 3:33 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| It's nice to see competition surfacing, albeit around the corner and several blocks along. Although, I don't give much weight to any survey which concludes the difference between the above aspects of search at Google and Yahoo as "at a draw", especially in terms of quality of service. Obviously these people didn't consider the many thousands of webmasters still trying desperately to locate Yahoo! Slug in their log files.
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| bakedjake Moderator Forum 40 msg #:8 | 4:01 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Anyone got a link to the actual survey? I can't find the report on Forrester's site. [edited by: bakedjake at 11:01 pm (utc) on July 20, 2004]
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| kmick New User msg #:9 | 4:01 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Sparrow, locating a Yahoo! Slurp in th elog isn't hard, you just need some quality links, but this doesn't mean your pages got a chance appear in Y's SERPs and/or Y will index your pages. What's more, Yahoo! Slurp keep looking non existing pages (meaningless page name) in one of my site in the last few weeks, I have no idea what it is try to do, anyone?
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| alex_h Junior Member msg #:10 | 4:42 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Must say, I've been REALLY impressed with Yahoo. For a bit I even had Safari make Yahoo my default search. I have found that when I am looking for technical information, Google still owns the market, but when I am looking for anything business or financially related, Yahoo OWNS the space. Google is nothing but spam, Yahoo certainly HAS spam, but it also has useful results. I think this amounts to which Directory is used to boost sites. Yahoo's commercial directory is MUCH better than DMOZ in the business/financial space, where $300 is a drop in the bucket and cuts out the keyword spammers. Dmoz is pretty empty in those areas, so the kw-kw-kw-kw.biz people don't have a directory to compete with, so they pretty much own those spaces. The categories are run by self interested editors that generally push their sites. Yahoo's $300 fee keeps throw-away domains out, and I'm pretty sure the directory influences results. Now if you guys could speed up the review process, I'd be thrilled. It's annoying that now that you're popular again, you take 7 days to review sites. I see more and more Yahoo traffic, and more importantly, more and more leads from that traffic. In the consumer space, Yahoo traffic is easily worth 4x-8x Google traffic, and they can put up decent numbers. Keep up toe great work!
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| martinibuster Moderator Forum 12 msg #:12 | 5:13 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| I was unable to find a copy of the Forrester report. Sorry, Yahoo_Mike, but secret reports have trouble getting past my hype-o-meter. I read another report (by Vividence) that stated Google's brand is so powerful you can slap the Google logo on any old search results and user satisfaction levels rose by a significant margin. Another interesting tidbit of information is that Yahoo and Google were lowest in terms of advertising CTR, and Ask Jeeves was the highest. Controlled information: Is this really news? However, with the Vividence report you can download the PDF Report and read it for yourself.
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| Kirby Preferred Member msg #:13 | 5:22 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| >quality of service yea, right. Forrester hasnt read these threads, among others. http://www.webmasterworld.com/forum35/2373.htm BTW, when are you going to get around to fixing the 301 problem and the bogus duplicate penalty that goes with it? >While this is great validation If you think so. >Much more to come in the weeks and months ahead. I heard this in March. I'm not holding my breath.
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| Yahoo_Mike Junior Member msg #:14 | 5:38 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Martinibuster, at the moment the Forrester research is for Forrester clients, but hopefully they'll release something on this publicly soon.
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| IanCP Junior Member msg #:15 | 6:05 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Mike, I'm somewhat disappointed you couldn't find time to respond to Kirby's post. I for one would be interested in your response.
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| skibum Moderator Forum 81 msg #:17 | 6:54 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Were they tied in terms of the number of people who go to each domain or the number of people who use the search feature? If its just the number of people who go to Yahoo.com or Google.com, then Google would probably have the advantage (in search) because people probably go there much more frequently to search. There are probably more visits to Yahoo! by people who want to "portal" instead of search. By nature, a portal would focus more on personalization whereas, thus far personalization doesn't seem to be to prominent in search. What kind of "service" would a searcher expect from Google?
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| Chndru Senior Member msg #:19 | 7:23 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
mm.. Not suprising. Satisfying clients through "number buzz" is more to it than substance.. It would be good for Google, as long as Yahoo deludes itself with these appeasing client "research".. Wonder how much G spent on this research? a dime, i guess..
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| notredamekid New User msg #:20 | 7:38 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Yes... If Yahoo! Search was actually good, they wouldn't need Forrester... their spam free, robust results would prove their own worth. I said Spam-FREE not Spamful. Just my .02
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| DaveAtIFG Administrator msg #:21 | 9:14 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
Taken in it's entirety, the post strikes me as more of a "We've got some of it right and we're working on the rest" reassurance than self promo.
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| born2drv Senior Member msg #:22 | 9:29 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
Good job Yahoo!  Everyone else can bash you guys as much as they want, but I don't think there's anyone here that can't honestly say Yahoo isn't in the very least closing the gap to Google in terms of quality, etc. Who's better than who is debatable of course. It's nice for you guys to get recognition for your hard work though. I see more and more people embracing yahoo personally, just by asking friends and relatives and I frequently find myself using it more, I'm personally growing tired of Google's search... Not that Yahoo is much better than Google or whatever, but it's nice to know there are more alternatives now and I look forward to Yahoo and MSN's continued offerings in search.
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| Kirby Preferred Member msg #:23 | 9:50 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| >Fully 2/3rd's of my business comes from Y & MSN via Overture. That only means you are willing to spend a few bucks. >I don't think there's anyone here that can't honestly say Yahoo isn't in the very least closing the gap to Google in terms of quality, etc Quality is subjective, but mixing cloaked PFI in with the organic serps and calling it quality is pushing it. The majority of the posts I see from Y! these days are self serving, IMO.
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| sun818 Senior Member msg #:24 | 10:18 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Here's a link to the report page. Can't get the PDF though: http://www.forrester.com/ER/Research/Survey/Excerpt/0,5449,359,00.html Its a mail-in survey where you can fill out a survey for a chance at winning a prize.
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| Kerrin Junior Member msg #:25 | 10:51 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Did Yahoo pay for this research to be carried out? If so then i'll take these findings with a pinch of salt... Also, given that under certain circumstances Yahoo still use Google results, this research is a bit pointless. [edited by: Kerrin at 6:08 am (utc) on July 21, 2004]
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| Dayo_UK Preferred Member msg #:26 | 11:00 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
Lol - that has Yahoo stamped all over it for a start.
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| sun818 Senior Member msg #:27 | 11:28 pm on July 20, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Let's be clear here. I'm not implying a mail-in survey is somehow less worthy than another form of data collection. I was merely providing the details on the process. You can reach your own conclusions if you wish.
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| RobbieD Preferred Member msg #:28 | 12:59 am on July 21, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| PC world also did a story on it. http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/index.php/id;2133334071;fp;2;fpid;1
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| Namaste Preferred Member msg #:29 | 2:46 am on July 21, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| what they don't teach you at Harvard: How to get it right! This report is your typical MBA type, using obselete parameters & pseudo values.
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| ke1th New User msg #:30 | 3:28 am on July 21, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Valid research or not. I've noticed an increase in traffic from Yahoo to my sites. So, I'm not going to complain. Also as of late I have been using both Google and yahoo in tandem for my own web searching endeavors. Yahoo seems to be keeping the spam sites at least in my searching circles to a minimum. Moreso than Google in fact. Shock! Horror!
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| Brad Senior Member msg #:31 | 4:30 am on July 21, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| I agree that Yahoo is getting more and more right and most certainly closing the gap with Google. The gist of this Forrester report sounds like it is not out of line with my own observations. Google still seems to refresh quicker and has impressive depth, but for someone running a blog about local topics, businesses and locations I find Yahoo is doing a better job. That and their easy ability to link to local maps and driving directions is a big plus. And I do like seeing the breadcrumb link to the Y! directory with the listings, I find this useful.
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| subway Full Member msg #:32 | 5:38 am on July 21, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
They definitely get my nod. They are hot on the heels of G and I've also noticed a significant increase in referrals from Yahoo search. This SE war is far from over - I think G are fast loosing their lead. The advantage Yahoo have is that they can concentrate on the quality of their SERPS as they're already 110% commercial. Google on the other hand have let the quality of their SERPS slip whilst devoting all of their time to finding ways of making more $$$.
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| suidas Junior Member msg #:33 | 5:39 am on July 21, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| I'm not being sarcastic, but what is there to prefer in Yahoo's presentation? I did a couple tests and compared the results. "Widget" tests didn't give me any ads, so I did "dating sites." (I hope that's okay; I state for the record that, rumors to the contrary notwithstanding, I do not own Match.com.) The Yahoo has: 1. Complex chrome on top, with all kinds of functions in tiny type. Google has: 1. Minimal, functional chrome At 20 results each, the Yahoo results were 50k, the Google 30k. So--other factors unassessed—it ought to load 5/3 faster. I agree that Y! is closing the gap. I have myself turned to them more often, and not just because their backlink functonality still works. But, honestly, when it comes to presentation, what's to prefer?
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| mquarles Senior Member msg #:34 | 6:59 am on July 21, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
| Kudos Mike, I found my first site yesterday that has actually been indexed more deeply on Yahoo than Google, which is definitely a change for the better. My biggest issues have been with crawl speed, but with Google putting new sites in the s***can for a while and Yahoo now indexing more thoroughly, you're getting there. MQ
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| mikeD Full Member msg #:35 | 7:14 am on July 21, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
Quality of what, if they are referring to ads then Yahoo certainly beats Google. Can't see how the presentation of results by Yahoo is better than Google. For a start when you load a Yahoo page all you can see is ads. You have to browse down to see the proper results. Personalization is the only thing I could see Yahoo beating Google on. If you have a dialup connection the Google results will load much quicker compared to Yahoo. Along will Google's results still being superior, these two things alone mean Google is king. Yahoo are getting close to google in terms of quality of serps. But the amount of ads just renders it inferior I would say. Have Yahoo just bought Forrester's by any chance? [edited by: mikeD at 2:22 pm (utc) on July 21, 2004]
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| mikeD Full Member msg #:36 | 7:19 am on July 21, 2004 (utc -7) | ||
I know plenty of sites which just arent in Yahoo because they are commercial. Their content is fine, it's more Yahoo wanting to charge them for inclusion. I have a commercial site listed in the Dmoz and Yahoo directory. It has a high pr6 Goolgle rank. Since Yahoo Search was laucnhed its been crawled daily (thousands of pages, using alot of bandwidth) but still not indexed. Only the help pages are in which have no commercial content. And Yahoo claim they have a free search engine. Think again if your commercial.
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It took hours to rebuild out of the browser cache. There are obvious formatting errors and cleanup...
correct link seems to be:
[pcworld.idg.com.au...]
[edited by: DaveAtIFG at 4:32 am (utc) on July 28, 2004]
