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Everflux: Changes seen in some searches

Google "fresh" listings added all the time.



1:38 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

I am seeing changes now on www2 and www3 for various phrases which have happened in the last 5 mins.

www2 and www3 are the same as each other and 5 mins ago www was also the same as these two.

Now www is different - by virtue of the fact that 2 and 3 have changed.

I get the feeling this is not the dance we are used to.

www2 seems to be ahead of the rest at the mo.

Its on - and I dont care about the usual yahoo link counts. Its on - but it looks like a new process.

hmmmmmmmmm - where are these guys actually messing with their databases.

Check your own terms asap so we can narrow the new process down - dont wait till someone tells you the yahoo backlink count has changed.

Fiver. (Giz A)


1:40 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

Nope, link:www.yahoo.com still shows 642,000
Changes for keywords do not indicate an update.


1:45 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

I see 1st March Fresh Tags in www2.

[edited by: giggle at 1:48 am (utc) on Mar. 2, 2003]


1:45 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

Sorry Yankee, but things move on.

These searches have been static since the last dance, Google have a new format - there is no way they can stick to the old batch monthly routine if they want to stay fresh - they may as well be running a punchcard system if they retain the old once a month thing.

Trust me - they are moving away from it, and this month is a first attempt.

We will see an ever increasing movement towards realtime shuffling over the coming months as the dudes there get their heads round it.



1:47 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

Monday is the 3rd. Thats the evening.


1:52 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member rfgdxm1 is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member

Yet another case of premature egooglation. :(

Alec Doggone

1:53 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

NOT an update.


1:57 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

No Aces, you don't know that - its evolving still - there IS NO WAY ON EARTH THEY WILL STICK WITH A ONCE MONTHLY UPDATE.

I believe (and admit speculate) that the technical issue lies withing the realtime re-calculation of PR for secondary ranking. They want to keep the concept of PR alive - however the sheer volumes make a realtime implementation extremely difficult.

I have already noticed, as many in here have - that "backlinks +4PR" are not showing, PR is all over the show, 3 and 4 "dances" are required to get it into touch.

No - I believe they are in a mess with their PR in terms of inbounds, and this could be a result of trying to remain fresh in a more "realtime" manner.

I believe the PR system is in a BIG mess.

Fiver - still collating.


2:03 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member


A MAJOR update occurs when link counts change. The SERPS change practically everyday, also known as Everflux. Do a site search for Everflux, you'll find plenty of previous threads.


2:08 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

I think google is just doing some minor stuff.
I bet a box of doughnuts (boston cream) Monday 6-8pm Atlantic Time Aprox we will see our first signs of the update. It may come and go, yet It will stay later that night. If Im right you all EACH owe me a box of boston creams.


2:13 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)


Something has been bothering me about the dance.

Can I try and explain my thoughts and then maybe someone can correct me.

I have noticed over about 6 dances that the www2 - (i.e. NOT www) database returns results with massive differences from the www almost immediately and then remains almost constant until the switch to www.

In actual fact, I speculate that the dance as such has already occured elswhere, and the resulting database is then transferred to "say" www2.

We can see this by examining comments made by members of various forums, "The position you are at within www2 (during the dance) is quite likely the position you will retain on the www after the transfer to www).

In other words - the instant and almost complete changes made to www2 (say) seem to stick, and therefore the ACTUAL DANCEING has been done elsewhere and then slung onto www2 (say) for testing.

So where is this elsewhere?

Guys - I'm Still having a think......



2:15 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member

no update yet.



2:21 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

A MAJOR update occurs when link counts change. The SERPS change practically everyday, also known as Everflux. Do a site search for Everflux, you'll find plenty of previous threads."

Yes - the recalculation of PR can only occur after spidering. 100% certain.

Spidering gives :-
New link counts - Separate database to serps.

However, the WWW2 (SAY!) results incorporate this recalculation before transfer to WWW.

So when and where is the real dance occuring which creates the WWW2 database? - cos it aint happening in 5 mins thats for sure.


2:21 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

As a result of this thread I did some checking of my own. I'm not sure if it's a new dance, I'm too much of a newbie to have a meaningful opinion.

If it's not a dance it's the most significant amount of everflux I've seen in the past 6 months on our key serps. My site has was getting hammered by freshbot for the past three days but suddenly stopped sometime this afternoon. By "hammered" I mean a steady stream of freshbot requests for over 48 hours every 1 - 3 seconds.

Maybe the freshbot algo has changed?


2:23 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

Say Bye Bye to the bots they did their job, its update time on monday suppertime.


2:25 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

Fiver_321, you are not the first nor will you be the last to call the update prematurely based on these searches for various terms THIS MONTH.

But now that you know this is yet another false alarm, can someone please change the title?


2:27 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

Sorry - I had to.

"Fiver, A MAJOR update occurs when link counts change"


"A MAJOR update "HAS ALREADY OCCURED" because the link counts "HAVE" changed.

So where was this update? over what period?

Can you see where I am coming from?


2:32 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)


I have no intention of the false alarm stuff, I firmly believe that changes are afoot, and this is the time we will notice them first.

I am 5 or 6 years beyond bothering about making a dumb false alarm with genuine people trying to make a living.

Additionally, you can all slate me if I am wrong this month, but changes towards "realtime" are coming - and soon - I just think they are happening right now.



2:42 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

Everything still looks EXACTLY the same for me...

Backlinks haven't changed, and keyword searches appear the same.


2:44 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

I totally agree that realtime changes will come and the update will be a thing of the past. And when that happens we can quit this crummy routine of false alarms.

I'm not trying to police this free forum of expression but you haven't said anything here in the many posts that make this other than a typical false alarm.

There is nothing new here. I'm beginning to feel like it's Groundhog Day II.

Fiver_321, what have you seen that is different than all the other months?

>I am seeing changes now on www2 and www3

Sorry that thread's been done every two days for the past many months beginning, what? about the 24th until the actual update? And what of it? Have you never seen this very activity that you are talking about? I see it all the time and others have remarked about it before in different contexts.

>real-time re-calculation of PR for secondary ranking

Why do you say that? Because they filed for a patent this week?

I totally agree with you that one day things will change and then we can all check backlinks or some other measure and ask, "it's 2:01, what happened to the 2:00 update?" Also the bot activity has been weird. No question that there is something weird in this. But what? I dunno.

Until the day we actually see something, why speculate? There's no prize for noticing a change first. I'm going to keep waiting for the monthly update.


3:11 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)



3:14 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

I'm new to this, but I wanted to share my experience of the past few days. I am not sure if this is normal, or if it plays to Fisher_321's theory...

I submitted a new site to Google prior to the Feb deepcrawl. As expected, I saw zero traffic from Google for a few weeks. My stats peeked on Feb 27. So I checked Google for my targeted key phrase, and sure enough, my site was #5 with a "Feb 26" fresh date. The next day (Feb. 28), the site was still there, but no fresh date was shown. Earlier today (March 1), the site was #6, with a Feb 28 fresh date. This evening (still Mar. 1) the site is #5 again, with a Mar. 1 fresh date. The toolbar is still gray, and I don't think the site has any backlinks yet...


3:21 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

I have made some valid points, if you are not prepared to look closely at them then so be it.

If you learn how to listen then you are on the right track. I am listening to you also - however I feel you are bleating like a small lamb.


3:25 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

Moderators, delete the post if you would.

Maybe next time round.




4:05 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

No update here but a new refresh of March 1st


4:18 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

Every month a new Fiver comes along, not understanding the index update. Some people just don't get it. Acer, the odds are very high that an update will happen soon. Nobody cares if you prognosticate an overdue update.


4:32 am on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member bigdave is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member


The update starts with the very first page that google deep crawls, it always has. There are weeks worth of calculations that go on, just to order the index.

The process is: Crawl - Calculate - Dance

The dance is just the last few steps of the calculation, moving the terabytes of data to all the data centers, and finally loading up the new search algorithms (search algorithms are different than the indexing algorithms)

The dance never has been the entire calculation period.

I do not expect that they will bet rid of the monthly update in the foreseeable future. But they will keep working on improving everflux so that it should show very similar results right before and after the dance. Why should they go for a major change like that when what they are doing now put them at #1? It just would not make any sense.

Going to a constant update process doesn't matter to most surfers. You could probably drop it to 4 tmes a year with no everflux and you would still make most surfers happy. Webmasters on the other hand....

It is my own personal belief that even google doesn't know exactly when an update will complete to the point that the dance will start. There is just too many variables and failure of hardware or a failure of QA could push a dance back by several days.


2:09 pm on Mar 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

Don't know about updates, what type etc, but definitley something different this month. Freshbot is going through the listed pages in the google search for the first time in months, finally getting 404 errors from removed pages.

Have noticed this from ink in the past couple of months where they are verifying pages in the database. Google has been experiancing problems in getting rid of non existent pages in the past months. There have been other posts in regards to this. Maybe this update is finally verifying the database? Whatever is going on lets hope its for the better:)


8:00 pm on Mar 3, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

It seems like last March my Google listings didn't refresh until like the 10th or 11th of the month. Also last month, Feb., my indexed pages were refreshed about 5 days before the end of the month. I am anxious too, as I have several hundred new pages to be indexed. But clearly Google is not on any official scheduled time, so I will wait.


8:09 pm on Mar 3, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

Every month a new Fiver comes along

ya but do they really have to call themselves Fiver? ;)

This 36 message thread spans 2 pages: 36

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