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Nothing is perfect especially new things. Should we say the new filter is only in beta stages? If the semi-penalty I am talking works perfectly and could apply to all circumstances, then explained to me why google hidden links algo can't catch all hidden links spam? You should be greatful if you site still remained. The hidden links spammer could have say the same thing like you, 'Hey, I got hidden links in my site but my site still rank well, the hidden-links filter is just some bull **** and it never exist.'
For more information on semi-penalty, please read [webmasterworld.com...]
You think it is easy? Ok, you want to harm your competitor and you add their links to the guestbooks. You spend a few hundred bucks buying links for them. And you start exchanging links with other site using their link instead of your link. Are you willing to spend so much time and effort doing that for your competitor? What if you can't accomplish some factors which the semi-penalty algo take in consideration and your competitor is boosted to #1! Will you take the risk.
Invoking the semi-penalty is not a simple 1 + 1 algorithm. There are many more factors such as how is the keyword optimize in your site, variety of anchor text, etc.
And even if you success killing your competitor with your effort. That doesn't means Google has failed. There are always another site ready to replaced the #1 spot. Google visitors won't complaint.
joined:Nov 8, 2002
[edited by: NFFC at 8:45 pm (utc) on May 25, 2003]
But just to be safe: Hypothetically speaking, what might it mean if an index page disappeared from SERPS while internal pages ranked, and also with allintitle: index page is missing but internal pages are there?
joined:Nov 20, 2000
AthlonInside thinks its largely explained by his too much identical anchor text theory, which he repeatedly points to the thread for.
He certainly makes some good points, but I don't buy it at all.
I think we need to bear in mind that the Google index data is in a state of flux. Many backlinks, especially recent back links are missing. Things change sometimes several times per day.
My feeling is that generally the sites most effected by this are less than 6 months old. That may tell part of the tale as these are likely to be less entrenched in Google's database.
I think it was NFFC who was suggesting a potential glitch in Google (sorry if I mis-represent). That is certainly another possibility with all the recent changes - remember this is new software and will not be perfect.
So it could be any one of many reasons. I wouldn't press any particular reason any harder than the others, but on balance, I would suggest it is more likely to be a transient issue than a penalty.
I agree it's a little early for theories.
...I would suggest it is more likely to be a transient issue than a penalty.
I tend to agree. When someone's site goes down in search list, the first normal reaction is oh Google finally caught me for X, Y, Z. Let's face it, most oof us on this forum are doing (perfectly ok) things like increasing keyword density, getting links with the desired anchor text, and so on. However, many of us are nervous about such things.
I have a carbon copy of your issue that you described early in this thread.
Only difference is my site was indexed in December 2002.
Other than that, I have the very same problem: No www.mysite.com, only mysite.com...
I come up fine for 2-3 word KP's, but my index is now on page five when before I had #2 results for a one word search, and now sub-pages come up prior to the index...
I do not buy into the semi-penalty either, Google is just very unstable at the moment (althought I did think about it prior to reading it here...)
Do you have a carbon copy for this also?
allintitle: keywords (index page not there)
allinurl:sitename.com (index page not there)
allinanchor:keywords (index there and ranking high)
btw, I am now seeing me return for some keywords in all datacenters except -fi, -va, -cw
unless the other datacenters are pointing to some weird place where I was showing before. But still in those datacenters, index page MIA for allintitle, and allinurl
I experienced the same - "Main Index File" gone.
What I observe is that those who are affected by this got these symptoms:-
1) when you allinurl:sitename.com - other pages of yours show up, but not the "index" page. Those sites that are not affected, do show the index page.
2) Though the "index" page seems to disappear, I find that they are not really disappear in G index. I see some of them appear for "other keywords" that I did not target for that site, but another site instead.
3) No change in PR and no loss of backlinks.
4) This occurrence seems to be first spotted in EX-datacenter since last Friday and I did not take it seriously until it spreads out to all datacenters this morning.
I don't know the real reasons as of why, but what they have in common are:
a) The sites are less than 6 months old
b) Quite extensive cross linking between sites
c) The index page got two sets of repeated hyperlinks with same anchor text pointing to the same internal pages (one set in Nav bar and one set in the body for explanation).
There is no question of hidden text or hidden links.
For those of you who are affected, what are the things you have in common and uncommon with me?
I, too, have your symptoms.
I see a common theme of less than 6 months old.
I was indexed in February.
I have a lot of links from sites that cross-link, although I do not cross-link to them. But if that is a problem, none of their sites are affected by it. Their hanging strong at number one for all keywords for all of their sites.
No hidden text or tricks here either.
I had one keyword I was still ranking #1 for...moments ago it went dead...nowhere to be found. I thought it would get better, not worse.
Can you explain a little more about what you mean about a duplicate content filter? I just thought about how my site is sitting on 2 servers right now, so I wouldn't be lost when I went to the new one. Was gonna pull the old one when I was sure google had found me for the deepcrawl on the new one. Could that be a duplicate content issue...same URL..just different server. I really don't think that is the problem with my site's disappearance as I have same symptoms as so many sites. But it did just make me wonder about my 2 server issue.
[edited by: WebMistress at 6:25 am (utc) on May 26, 2003]
I do hope google has mixed up something inside the datacenters so that URLS do not show up.....
Thanks for your advice - Some of my sites dated back to November 02 are affected with lost index page, however, I just discover that a site of mine in March is not affected -so I doubt it is the matter of 6 months period.
I don't think this is G technical problem and the situation may not be better.
I'm really interested to examine some samples beyond my websites. Are there any way I sticky you my URL and yours to mine? I will give you my thoughts if I find any and vice versa?
The semi-penalty is there to block sites from appearing with certain keywords only. These specific keywords is what google think the webmaster has been manipulating to rank high with google. You still rank well with other keywords, please notice the word SEMI.
They punish guestbook, microtext, hidden links spammers with PR0 of delete them from index because they want them to rank bad with all keywords.
Yep, index page dropped (not completely vanished) from numbert 1 ranking (for three months) to second results page. Internal page is doing fine.
Yes i have my two main keywords in anchortext in 80% of all my links pointing to my index page.
Yes, index page does show up on less targeted keywords,
used in 10-15 % of anchortext in links
No, my site is more than 6 months old. (2 years)
If this semi penalty is all about too much use of the same keywords in anchortext than I'm in deep trouble.
My site is all about these two keywords.It is only natural to put your two keywords in your anchortext.. The keywords are the products I'm selling, why shouldn't I be allowed to do that in google? My site is absolutely clean, no tricks, good content. Visitors who found my site in google on my keywords
did find what they were looking for...
What's googles trouble with that?
Because many people are manipulating the anchor text to rank well. The filter is trying to catch those who manipulate. The original discussion is going on here [webmasterworld.com...]