Frames or No Frames

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Frames or No Frames

Changing my website out of frames

Saguaroview

6:45 pm on Dec 4, 2002 (gmt 0)

Any suggestions on how to change my website from a framed site to a no framed site? I was told that Microsoft Front page 2002 will build a No Framed Site (Is this True?)
My problem is that when certain keywords are searched for on my website they only pull up certain pages on the search engine and users can not get to see my whole website only that framed page!

sun818

6:56 pm on Dec 4, 2002 (gmt 0)

If all you have is a top or left nav with some ASP, conversion, I think, is straight forward. If the navigation is static HTML, make it an include file for all your pages. If it contains code, make it a function instead. You will need to remove the dupliate <html><body> tags when you edit the frames pages as they are already in tht include.

If your site contains a lot of complex ASP script, it gets really messy.

tbear

7:05 pm on Dec 4, 2002 (gmt 0)

Firstly, welcome Saguaroview .........:)
I'd suggest you brush up on you basic skills (if you are not too sure of html) and go for the no frames site. Continue to use the old .html page names in your new layout but without the frame config.
The problem of finding bits of a frameset within SE results is not new (but I guess it'll get much older).
Personally I wouldn't use front page when standard html is so easy to grasp (it really is, 'cos I got it pretty easily...)
IMHO, I have found that a little work and studying pays off 10-fold without the use of programmes that do it for those that don't know how to!
You can recreate the same design using (I'm a bit slow, like RR) tables or as the smart ones do with css.
Just my opinion, good luck.

papercut

8:17 pm on Dec 4, 2002 (gmt 0)

i am not sure why the distain for frames exists. i dont use them often, granted - BUT they are pretty versatile. anybody wanna shed light?my style of preference? build entirely in photoshop and slice into table format. i create big clean "plates" or images where text goes. i import the finished page into dreamweaver, remove the "plates" and add the text in. photoshop makes sure the images are sliced into quick downloading images. nice and clean.

tedster

8:31 pm on Dec 4, 2002 (gmt 0)

The disdain for frames comes in many colors.

1. Frames break the metaphor of the web - for instance, you cannot bookmark internal content.

2. Only some users "get" it - other visitors (a significant percent) are quite boggled by frames and always have been. I think that different people's minds a just wired up differently.

3. Those search engines that crawl framed sites (a recent development, by the way) send traffic to orphaned content pages -- no frameset, no navigation.

4. Just as you cannot bookmark internal content, you cannot email a working link - this cuts down on viral promotion.

5. My experience with de-framing sites shows that stickiness and sales have always increased when I did so.

internetbrothers

8:55 pm on Dec 4, 2002 (gmt 0)

use microsoft borders
i did this in my site

<sorry, no personal urls>

[edited by: tedster at 9:16 pm (utc) on Dec. 4, 2002]

tbear

11:10 pm on Dec 4, 2002 (gmt 0)

Hi papercut,
I didn't intend to show disdain, it's just that I had the same problem, a few years ago, as Saguaroview.
When I sussed out a bit about SE's, I realised that I had individual frames appearing, in search results, instead of the frame-set. OK, I found a workaround but in the end I found other ways to get the same effect as frames which were mostly faster to load and easier to deal with.
I must confess I had a lot of fun with frames. However, sometimes I had a lot of fun trying to get out of someone elses frame-set......:(

bill

4:53 am on Dec 6, 2002 (gmt 0)

We had a pretty good thread about frames [webmasterworld.com] that was very helpful for me. I believe that tedster has really summed up the problem with frames nicely.

Saguaroview originally asked

I was told that Microsoft Front page 2002 will build a No Framed Site (Is this True?)

FP will not automatically convert a framed site into a non-framed site. You have to do that yourself. However, with the use of the Include Page component you can have the same content (like a navigation header or footer) appear on every page of your site. You will have to go into each page and add this. Depending on how your site is set up you may be able to do a Search & Replace of some HTML that will automate this process for you somewhat.