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Basically, if you used to pay for inclusion with PositionTech but did not renew your subscription what is Slurp told to do about your URL?
I'm surprised to hear this.
Think of it as two different databases. One is always looking for content (free crawl). If you go into PFI then your URL is indexed daily and this is the URL that shows up to searchers. This overrides your free URL if you had one. When you unsubscribe, if the free page is there it will show up. During your subscription the free crawl may find you and it may not.
The answer to whether Positiontech can ban you because you don't renew your subscription. This does not sound like proper business conduct and if you had met Jim Stob who runs Positiontech at any of the Pubconferences you would probably not be asking that question. He will be there again in Florida and I would encourage you to meet him.
for some reason I have a penalty and site was not included for free. Now that I paid they removed al the free goggle ones and my sites is the last one.
I just wish I knew what it was. It could be legit (maybe something I did once 4-5 years ago), or, it could be a mistake /glitch in Y!'s part. That's the frustrating part. No one (that answers) to contact. Also, is a penalty for life?
I subscribed to the service and the Position Tech report then showed me as having 1,000s of pages accepted.
My guess is my site was banned from Ink as a result of this process and therefore like others my site doesnt show up in Y searches today, only the home page is in the index.
While Im certain this isn't something that was done intentionally by PT, the more I read about similarly situated sites, the more likely it seems that this is one of the major reasons why some sites aren't showing up in Yahoo
[edited by: WebGuerrilla at 5:56 pm (utc) on Feb. 24, 2004]
[edit reason] TOS #26 [/edit]
I use positiontech and am not showing up, It appears to be a rather large problem not just with our sites.
Why penalize people who have paid Yahoo's reseller?
If PositionTech isnt the problem, then it means the common denominator here is people who have in the past paid to advertise with one of Inktomi's resellers and at some point cancelled their advertising.
Once cancelled, some sort of penalty kicked in, that isnt removed even when an advertiser signs up with another Inktomi reseller.
If you have this penalty, all newly paid for Inktomi results show up at the bottom of Yahoo results, even when a site specific search term is used.
While this conclusion is based on a limited amount of information, there is sufficient evidence building to make people think twice about using an Inktomi reseller, especially in the situation where they are already in the Yahoo search results.
Tim, is it worth it to Yahoo to have decent sites excluded from the results, because advertisers paid one of Inktomi's resellers in the past?
Why would Yahoo want to impose such a harsh penalty on web site owners, who are a growing source of Yahoo's revenues?
Tim, what do you recommend to do?
1. Does paying Position Tech for Inktomi spider help to get into the Yahoo search results?
2. If we are currently listed in the directory but have not paid, would it help to pay the $299?
3. Is Yahoo going to come out with a new paid inclusion program? Do you expect it will be a one time fee, or ppc?
Any help is greatly appreciated Tim, thanks
Thanks, but I will pass on that bet!
Yahoo is doing the right thing, they can't be held totally responsible for their resellers, they will obviously defend them to a point though! Again trying to do the right thing IMHO, although a tad more complex situation.
The bottom line is that Yahoo will index sites for free if they have good backlinks and are therefore seen as important.
I have posted this message at least 10 times already....DO NOT USE PFI from anybody, you will rank much better and achieve a much more stable position by building link popularity......and you will achieve it for free :)
From my POV, we did 4 new pages through PT a number of weeks ago on a site, they're all in and so are the others that were in before, all alive and kicking. Smooth as silk, showed up at MSN in a couple of days - no problem whatsoever.
It really isn't rocket science. You do not submit the homepage because that is what will get found through links and the rest of the site will get gradually included from there on. You submit selectively chosen targeted interior pages PFI and leave the rest to be found. It's cheap, it's easy and it works like a charm.
During your subscription the free crawl may find you and it may not.
Given that the vast majority of pages on the web will not be submitted via PFI, it sounds like Yahoo's new results are going to be terribly stale.
Sorry Tim, but the notion that the "free" crawl "may or may not find you" sounds almost like Yahoo is blackmailing web page owners.
Isn't it in the interests of the average searcher that the index should be as inclusive and as up-to-date as possible?
if you had met Jim Stob who runs Positiontech at any of the Pubconferences you would probably not be asking that question.
I couldn't agree more. Jim's a stand up guy. He's the last guy in this entire industry who I would ever even consider questioning his integrity.
Given that the vast majority of pages on the web will not be submitted via PFI, it sounds like Yahoo's new results are going to be terribly stale.
I don't think that will be the case. Ink already tried that approach once, and it turned out to be a big mistake. From everything I've been seeing, I think they understand the importance of free-crawling. The sheer volume of eyeballs Yahoo gets will guarantee they will do well with paid inclusion. It won't really matter whether or not you can get in without paying. People will still pay.
It won't really matter whether or not you can get in without paying. People will still pay.
When Positiontech adds the selection for Yahoo paid inclusion I'm going to be near the front of the line holding my credit card. Sales have been growing consistently month to month and I have to maintain the trend. It's a cost of doing business.
There may be some grumbling (the title of Mike Grehan's Yahoo article, "Pay for Exclusion" captures the feeling), but I don't see this avalanching into a LookSmart debacle.
>It really isn't rocket science. You do not submit the homepage because that is what will get found through links and the rest of the site will get gradually included from there on. You submit selectively chosen targeted interior pages PFI and leave the rest to be found. It's cheap, it's easy and it works like a charm.
I went the interior route you suggested and it didn't work. Newer sites and newer pages don't seem to have Positiontech problems. Older domains do.
Positiontech in October blamed my problems on being listed with Speed City plus a number of other search engines. They said I should go to each of those individual search engines and request removal of my site listing. PT said their listings would be viewed as duplicate content. Good thing they weren't crawling Google content or they would be suggesting I eliminate my listings with them.
In November PT suggested I reword my sites.
In December PT suggested I remove certain sites linking to mine.
In January PT said I might be penalized by Inktomi.
Nuff said.
This (^above^) is the case for several of my sites which is why I'm stating that I believe that if you pay for any of the pages of your site, the rest will not be included in the Inktomi index.
Please could those who disagree be a bit more specific, instead of saying that they will be indexed please state whether they actually were indexed, how quickly, and what percentage of your site was paid inclusion before the rest of your site was indexed for free? Thankyou
I hope that this means Yahoo will exclude whatever old penalties Inktomi has imposed on websites and start to screen for bad sites with their own algorithm.
read Yahoo v. Google algorithm
date is in that article
[edited by: DaveAtIFG at 6:47 am (utc) on Feb. 25, 2004]
[edit reason] DeLinked [/edit]
Yahoo To Exclude Inktomi Paid Inclusion
It's definite, stated right at the Ink partner sites
Yahoo! has transitioned to its own search technology and will soon launch a new inclusion program. As a bonus for current Search Submit customers, Yahoo! Search is providing a free trial of Yahoo! traffic that will end on April 15th, 2004.
PT needs to take a look at it's own site and remove the following page accessed in its left hand menu.
[positiontech.com...]
Bottom line if you’re stupid enough to pay us (at Inktomi) we’ll get you at Yahoo now. Oh, by the way. Even though we own Inktomi, use the Inktomi database, and utilize the same resellers as Inktomi we at Yahoo are entirely different.
Gotta love the ___.
You do not submit the homepage because that is what will get found through links and the rest of the site will get gradually included from there on. You submit selectively chosen targeted interior pages PFI and leave the rest to be found. It's cheap, it's easy and it works like a charm.
I have seen with our own sites that if we never paid, we often do great. Once we did, we only did great for the paid pages of that site...
I'd love to know that there was another side to this. It's possible other factors could be at play I guess, even if they are not obvious presently.
Is there anyone who can give us a bit of info on if the unpaid for pages of their site were indexed after paying for a few pages and in what timescale?
Thankyou
