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Charting the Influence of Search Engines

         

jimji

9:57 pm on Jul 14, 2022 (gmt 0)



It seemed that some folks in another thread felt I should start a new thread, and one new member's post informed my soul that ignoring that post would be super impolite, so I am going to give this a try.

And I write "give this a try" because I am really not up-to-date on all this search engine stuff, BUT that is the key, to my mind. I am just a simple folk like hundreds of thousands of others out there and if I could see a way to understand the influence of search engines on the Net economics without having to do weeks of careful study, I would be sort of thankful to whomever was able to cause that to happen.

So what came to mind in that other thread and I will repeat here is some sort of chart that would be easy to understand with minimum study that could show very clearly how changes in policy in certain companies also influenced the small Net entrepreneurs.

At least it seems that is a major theme of many posts in some of the other threads.

And how many minutes/hours defines "minimum study" is not clear to myself, for those that might ask that question.

I also made note of the idea in the other thread that there might already be some sort of that style of chart stuff on some other site or around here in this site, but I hadn't done the proper homework to find it and if that is the case an apology is forthcoming from this lazy human.

I've just got this gut feeling that if the average gal/bloke on the Net can't understand the basics of the influence of decisions made by the Giants in this industry those average blokes/gals are simply going to give up.

Of course, there is also that style thinking that this is all nonsense out of my brain and an example might be does the average driver of that fancy automobile actually know how it works? No they don't, but with regard to economics, when it breaks the average folks get really angry and join forces and do weird things like go swimming in some executive's swimming pool after smashing their way in. Those average folks also start smashing up other things.

When that car breaks the average folks just take it to a mechanic, but when there is no gas to be had at an almost normal price the only person to turn to is an economics mechanic, and that mechanic can't stop riots in the streets. Maybe the economics mechanic can explain what went wrong, but can't do too much about it.

Now it seems that in many posts around this site there are a bunch of smaller Net entrepreneurs indicating that something might be wrong, but I think it isn't so easy to understand what y'all are all up in arms about, so I ask about that chart that might make it easier to understand what's going on.

Just how do policy decisions made by the Big Players influence you smaller players? I mean, a kind of summary. And it seems a chart could do that style summary rather than some long bit of writing like this very post where I have already written way too much.

nickZ

1:08 pm on Jul 16, 2022 (gmt 0)



True
I've just got this gut feeling that if the average gal/bloke on the Net can't understand the basics of the influence of decisions made by the Giants in this industry those average blokes/gals are simply going to give up.


Case of overthinking? You should'nt worry about thinks you cannot change leads to a happier live ;)

jimji

5:38 pm on Jul 16, 2022 (gmt 0)



It is very interesting that you would be the first to respond and respond in that manner.

If you are correct and there is no chance for change, then what are all of you complaining about?

Is that "pub" idea another member wrote about in another thread correct? You are all just posting to get it off your mind and you go back to face the same problems and repeat that process over and over and nothing changes?

I'm not looking for a "happy life" or I wouldn't even be here.

I'm looking for change, which is what this new world we call the Internet is all about. New world and new ideas.

You folks can go on beefing about what this or that money leader giant in this industry is doing that may be harmful to each of you and do nothing about it, or you can try to affect change.

And those easy to understand charts are the first step toward that change.

By the way, I have terminal cancer and if I get one more year of life I will then be happy, because I will have been able to finish my posts like this very one that I hope will make some of you younger folks rethink what you are doing in this new world.

Are you here to chart a new path in human history? Or are you just looking to make a buck or two?

Now, don't get me wrong --- just being in this new world to make a buck or two is just fine. No sweat. Good for you. Good for your family. But if the giants of the industry are doing bad things and all you do is post complaints and do nothing to stop them, then you can't complain when they stomp on you because you made them angry.

I ain't here for the bucks. I made my buck or two already and was in a retirement mode before I ran smack into the giant called 'G' and realized I had to come out of retirement and affect change because nobody was paying attention and the giants were eating up all this new property and soon you small folks ain't gonna be around because the giants will eat you up. Unless you start to actually create change. Now!

nickZ

11:00 pm on Jul 16, 2022 (gmt 0)



I agree still I can't change that.
I can only change the people surrounding me, otherwise we are kinda impotent

But if the giants of the industry are doing bad things and all you do is post complaints and do nothing to stop them, then you can't complain when they stomp on you because you made them angry.

jimji

12:43 am on Jul 17, 2022 (gmt 0)



Funny about brains and especially the human brain, but once an idea enters, even if in some sort of negative way, it sorts of is floating around in there and at some point in the future when you are least expecting it the idea pops back up because you see or read something that makes you give consideration to a possible answer. Or some sort of positive result of what you may have thought was sort of a negative thing. Might just be somebody close to you that offers an idea. You never know. Brains are weird pieces of equipment.

Don't sell yourself short. You've obviously taken the time to read my awfully long posts and you have the thought in mind, so someday down the road you may spot something that reminds you about this thread and ...

Well, we'll see, yep?

EDIT: Take care in that heat alert I read about.

[edited by: jimji at 12:44 am (utc) on Jul 17, 2022]

tangor

12:43 am on Jul 17, 2022 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



What would this proposed chart look like?
What parameters would be tracked and displayed?
What trends (legal, social, economic) are envisioned?
How will this chart support the user for future actions?

Webmasters are used to charts for tracking income, adsense, hits, visitors, etc, but will this proposed chart actually provide them with any usable information?

jimji

12:55 am on Jul 17, 2022 (gmt 0)



Outstanding! You're asking exactly the right questions.

BUT, I was super hoping that somebody already had designed something kind of bordering on close to what was needed.

First thing, it seems to me, is to go back to those threads and posts where there seemed to be the complaints and find a common denominator of the complaints and see if something there can be charted. Also it probably would have to start with groups of like small businesses. A single chart for a single business might be way too difficult to handle in the early stages.

10 that do this business. 10 that do that business. 10 of another. And so on. Or groups of 20 in the same business. There'd have to be some sort of "Before" and 'After" parameter.

My business was going like this '''CHART''' before this happened and then my business went like this '''CHART''' ... Or lines showing 'before and 'after' on a single chart.

I'm just tossing out ideas. I'd bet one of you or a group of you could do better. Remember, I'm the simple, average bloke and you folks are the wizards.

tangor

3:56 am on Jul 17, 2022 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



I am not a wizard, just an old phart who's been doing this for a very long time.

The "trends" are that the big get bigger and the pie gets smaller as the number of players continues to expand exponentially. Now we have governments getting involved. We have social politics being inserted here and there. Myths continue to be believed, even when debunked. "Rights" are being claimed when there is zero mechanisms to empower such.

On the other hand, the capitalism of the web is the "train kept a-rollin'" (cue the Led Zep licks) and a very fortunate and VERY few can make some Cents by the hour. :)

A list of grievances, which this is beginning to sound like, wouldn't be that useful in my web experience ... and expanding beyond the web experience would hold no interest for me at all.

Almost forgot!

@nickZ .... Welcome to Webmasterworld!

jimji

8:45 pm on Jul 17, 2022 (gmt 0)



So I'm making time to start digging into a homework phase on this and I go here:

    https://www.webmasterworld.com/ppc/

And I see that the latest post was in November of last year and all threads are locked because of the age thing.

Is the Pay Per Click advert program some sort of recently dead dinosaur? No longer of much interest to the average site owner?

I saw a link in one of the threads:

    http://training.seobook.com/tracking-results

And most access all over that site is restricted to paid-money folks, so not sure what value that has in my homework on this, BUT if there is not interest on this site in that sub-forum noted above maybe that SEO School place isn't making so much money themselves.

Has something recently happened in the industry to make that Pay Per Click a non-issue?

Just starting to do my homework, folks. If the questions seems stupid, then I'm only proving my point I think I made in another thread that I ain't too smart, bordering on stupid.

jimji

9:04 pm on Jul 17, 2022 (gmt 0)



And, tangor, you have me a tad confused about something, if I may:

"A list of grievances, which this is beginning to sound like, wouldn't be that useful in my web experience."


I thought the primary purpose here was to get beyond the grievances that have/had already been posted in so many other threads (not by myself) and seemed to cause some quality members to leave this community; - - - but those other posts of grievances were of no value to communications/discussions in this community? All that which caused at least two respected community members to leave was just garbage posting. I didn't post all those.

I mean, if that is the view of most of our members here, then I am certainly wasting my time, aren't I?

I thought there were genuine concerns posted by a fair number of folks here that something was amiss. I've got that wrong?

I'll be happy as heck if that is true because I can then remove this project from my list and get back to other stuff.

I think you are a respected member around here, tangor, so can you speak for many others, or are you possibly just voicing your own views and I need to wait for a few weeks to see if others chime in here and so put my homework, as shown above as being started, --- put my homework on hold?

tangor

1:30 am on Jul 18, 2022 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



I mean, if that is the view of most of our members here, then I am certainly wasting my time, aren't I?


Perhaps I am unintentionally obtuse. What are you trying address, and how does your effort relate to benefiting webmastering?

The INFLUENCE of search on the web is well-demonstrated by daily activities and the growing concerns of governmental agencies of an increasing number of nations around the world. Search is what it is... The question for most is "how can I successfully work in this business model?"

WW, among other sites that deal with search engines are in place, many for decades.

ASIDE: I don't know that I am "respected", but I do have personal opinions. Also have a professional background in various businesses before I even heard of the web (working BBS since the 1980s, musician, brick&mortar, computer tech, insurance, accounting, and a stint in the military as a medic). I speak for myself, I DO NOT SPEAK FOR OTHERS.

nickZ

1:08 pm on Jul 18, 2022 (gmt 0)



@nickZ .... Welcome to Webmasterworld!

@tangor + thx

Markets move and Google will loose a little over time.
Search Words have morphed into keyword frases.
Even though the pie gets smaller we are able to cut out a niche if you work well above average.