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Bit of background on the situation first might help.
Now I have a new company which I will call abc. This is indexed in yahoo and google for the MAIN KEYWORDS that people use to buy this product (tradesmen).
In yahoo its top spot and in google its around 43rd not good. Yahoo is hardly sending any traffic my main traffic 90% is all coming through adwords.
The site is 6 months old.
Now for that same set of keywords I also have the domain name with them keywords in it. Eg
www.bluewhitewidget.co.uk
Do you think that I should do a re-direct from the branded website (ABC) to the new keyword domain and just have the same sites on both domains?
Sorry for the bore but its really important to me.
many thanks for your professional replys ;)
You talk about companies as well as web sites, and you don't give the same info for each, so it's hard to compare.
How old is each site?
How successful is each site?
Is the current content different?
If you have not yet used the widget name, why would you want to throw away 6 months of work on the company site?
I hope I've got this wrong, but are you really hoping that having 'widget' in the domain name is going to be an overnight SEO success with no effort?
If so, WRONG!
The domain name is one of 200 factors that influence the rankings of your site - and nowhere near the top of the list.
Sure, widget1.com does really well - but look at the BOTTOM of the search results, and find widget2 through 2336.
Think long term, and pick the domain name that will work best - but don't forget you stand to throw away six months work if you don't pick abc.com
The content would be same on eaxh site using re-direct.
I believe the keywords in the domain to be very important as my other domains with key words in rank in the top 5 for their chosen searchs.
The comapny website is not doing well in rankings at all so I think it may be worth the risk. Only on yahoo but thats bringing in very very little traffic!
What you need to understand is that not many sites rank well in Google after just six months. For many it can be easily 12+ months before new sites rank for important/competitive keywords; often longer.
You're on the right course most likely. You just need to adjust expectations a bit. ;-)
Im going to take the plunge but say it does not work out I can always go back right?
Yes, there are some advantages to having a kw-oriented domain (especially exact match domains). But you've got six months of site existence already, so if you're doing a good job with site marketing, you should start seeing good rankings in another six months or so very generally speaking. Plus redirecting to a new domain will probably set you back.
If you were starting out from scratch, and cared more about short-term traffic than long term business building, I might be on the fence. Given the situation as you've outlined it, it would be a no-brainer to me to stick with the branded approach. Get good backlinks, build up your content quality, seek out partnerships, etc. A year or two from now you'll be better off for it.
Once a URL returns a redirect, it no longer has any content to be indexed, and the URL it redirects to is the one that will be indexed.
The domain I have is an EXACT match 3 keyword domain.
My most popular searchs on google are for these 3 keywords.
How does that sway things?
the product is bought by tradesmen. The product is branded to our company now.
But what the competition is doing <snip> mainly advertise the product on there main sites but NEVER sell.
Im thinking maybe I could use our main site and direct our customers (wholesale) there.
Your making me think hard here lol.
[edited by: caveman at 5:51 pm (utc) on July 8, 2008]
[edit reason] Removed specifics per TOS [/edit]
The domain I have is an EXACT match 3 keyword domain..
Domain name is NOT an overriding consideration in search engine optimization. It is one of about 200 factors, and NOT by any means the most important.
Really.
You'll not find anyone who knows anything about SEO telling you much different, and no-one will even suggest that a nicely matched keyword domain is the be-all and end-all. It just isn't.
It's sweet, it's neat, and it can help in brand building. But it is NOT a short cut to the top of Google.
Think about it; if it was, why doesn't everyone buy hyphenated three-word domains? And why do the rest of us bother at all?
Put it behind you and make your decision on ALL the relevant factors - as advised above.
[edited by: caveman at 8:33 pm (utc) on July 8, 2008]
[edit reason] Edited per TOS #4, #19 [/edit]
It is one of about 200 factors, and NOT by any means the most important.
Quadrille, you know there are quite a few around here who might disagree with the above. While it is NOT the most important, it is by all means one of many factors that can have an overall impact depending on the goal. The ultimate goal is to have a company name and domain name that naturally targets the primary keywords. What some might set up as a /d/b/a/ or "doing business as".
You'll not find anyone who knows anything about SEO telling you much different, and no-one (bar some self evident idiots) will even suggest that a nicely matched keyword domain is the be-all and end-all. It just isn't.
Oh-oh, you may be treading somewhere here. I might take offense to the above and I have a great deal of respect for you. ;)
It surely isn't the end-all, be-all, but I'll be darned if its not a "major" determining factor in the long run, it really is. There are three ways to look at this equation for me...
1. Brand
2. Keywords
3. Brand + Keywords
I'll take option #3 any day over #1 or #2. And, these days, if option #3 isn't viable, I'm going with option #1. The keyword market is saturated and in some instances, long term Brand should be given careful consideration. It would be much easier to brand "a name" than it would be to brand under a keyword phrase that everyone else is using.
Think about it; if it was, why doesn't everyone buy hyphenated three-word domains? And why do the rest of us bother at all?
I missed the [snip], was there something to do with hyphens? Those are the Kiss of Death for many. There are always exceptions to the rule. < Added for protection.
Search is not the only way to gain a new client. Particularly in narrow niches, there aren't enough search queries to support a keyword driven approach. In that situation it's about establishing brand awareness in the minds of those inclined to buy the product, through reviews, product placement where the demographic gathers, sponsorships, etc.
None of my favorite sites have keywords in the domain.
#3 - WebmasterWorld.com
#3 - martinibuster
I just cant ignore what im seeing in that my keyword domains are heavily heavily outranking my branded website.
I do understand what you are saying though.
Im going to go at it for a month and if it does not work out then you can say told you so.
I think a better idea is to build 2 seperate websites with the view to make the branded website a more information based site and then link of to the keyword rich domain.
mmmmm...
I think a better idea is to build 2 seperate websites with the view to make the branded website a more information based site and then link of to the keyword rich domain.
That is one good way to go -- often employed by those with the time and/or resources. But, you need to know you're adding lots of extra work (IMHO, usually justified).
Also, it's important to give each site a clear and different reason-for-being, clearly distinguishable from each other, and conservatively cross-linked.
@POR: Nicely stated. Agree with pretty much everything you said. One small difference is that regarding your option #3, I tend to go with a clean branded domain name, but build the kw's into the site's generic description and/or tag line so lazy linkers help me out. ;-)
2. The nice thing about exact match domains is, for logical reasons, search engines may give them a small "+" somewhere in their automated analysis. Not all keyword domains are created equal in this analysis.
3. The nice thing about exact match domains is that they form natural anchor text and the exact match of the domain reinforces the fact that the anchor text isn't bogus or contrived. An algorithm that strives for intelligence might consider the exact match a validation of the inbound anchor text.
4. The nice thing about exact match domains is that they are easy to remember. When you are getting started it's a plus to be easily remembered. Yes, branding is nice, but branding is about driving name memorability based upon user experience and user experience, as the basis of branding, takes (rare)intelligence, creativity, talent, timing, sensitivity, skill, time, money and probably a healthy PPC and linkdev effort. Good for you if you have access to all those resources. If not - all other things being equal - would you rather launch your yellowpages website as YellowPages.com or Superpages.com, even though one is generic and the other "is a brand"? Up to you. I say "ease of memory" is another factor tweaking out another small advantage in SEO.
5. Built-in credibility? Give me the generic and you have the cred to blow. Built in brand - "what you do" - recognition? Yep. All there to blow away. It's like having a building to build with the foundation already poured. Please don't tell me you can't build a great brand upon the likes of YellowPages.com or many other generics. The greatness is there to fritter away.
6. In an increasingly crowded and competitive WWW will the generic be a disadvantage? I somewhat doubt it. If my own type-in traffic stats are an indication direct navigation isn't going down, at least not for rock solid generics, it's stable and/or going up. Why? Perhaps, in part, direct navigation is on the rise due to the fact that more and more generics are being developed. Development is the buzz of the domaining world and more domainers are moving on to development. As more generics resolve to actual websites then it's logical that direct navigation will increase. (And the domain landers themselves are doing a much better job of not scaring people away.)
7. SEO and generic domains? See 1-4 above.
A good domain doesn't win the day but in many ways a good exact match domain is advantageous. I'm not saying any exact match domain will offer advantages of #1-#4. Like SEOs, some domains walk the walk whilst others merely talk the talk. The end result, in both cases, is usually measured in profitable traffic. :)
P.S. Caveman, P1R and Martinibuster are waaaay more search engine savvy than I am so I'd listen to them.
[edited by: Webwork at 10:17 pm (utc) on July 8, 2008]
If I have an established Brand that has diversified into many different product groups, I may or, I may not, go the Microsite route. It is a common promotional strategy and works very well for many brands. Again, there are many brands online that are driven by this domain naming strategy. Its a 241 Special!
Affiliates love the Brand + Keyword strategy and so do the manufacturers in "most instances". Ya gotta be careful when treading into "Brand" territory.
- My old aff sites leaned towards only kw's in domain .
- My newer aff sites are like POR's option #3 (brand melded with kw in domain).
- My more informational sites are either pure brand or brand + kw.
- The only sites that get branded-only domains are the ones in which I expect to invest a lot of money and effort over time.
I too love the branded sites, but branding is also in my background which helps a lot. And as POR implies, it helps to know what you're doing or get good help (or have really good instincts) when going down the branded path.
Back to the OP's issue, one factor not very well established is whether or not the branded site represents a company that is reasonably well funded, and is intended to become a long term thing (or be sold at some point) ... or not. That may not be the deciding point, but I would be factoring it in.
In this case, I'd go for two sites if I had the resources. Hard to lose with that approach.
P.S. Caveman, P1R and Martinibuster are waaaay more search engine savvy than I am so I'd listen to them.
Oh wait, no you didn't! You don't think we "reread" these topics over and over again? Huh? Tried to sneak the above in. Here, let me give you some "influential" credit dude...
Webwork - Developer of Extraordinary Domain Properties [webmasterworld.com]
The above is my new procedure moving forward. Its called "establish the Influencers in the Community and/or Social Network. Whereas..."
But, I do think you happen to be "outnumbered" in this particular topic, eh? Those regionkeywordkeywordkeyword.com domains may not work in this instance. But wait, I know you are going to prove me wrong, it never fails... ;)
But the premise of the OP was that there is already a branded business online, six months live. That is no small thing. The more he cares about the "brand" the more IMO he should stick with the branded domain. If it's all about short term versus long term, with no particular concern about building up a business over time, then I'd lean kw domain. And if it's possible to go both ways... :)
It is certainly a long term business. Well I hope so anyway.
I have a product that is up there with the best just cheaper.
All of my competitors DO NOT sell direct. Strictly through tool shops and other online merchants.
I think thats where I can make a killing!
If you are relying on search as your primary marketing channel then I might take the opposite position.
But, only an entity with a weak or non-existent brand strategy would consider this option unless the keyword was a brand signal.
I agree with caveman and the other posters. 6 months is not enough time to rank well with Google. They seem to favor mature domains. Attempting to force premature results will likely be more damaging to your long-term goals.
If you wish to purchase KW rich domain names and redirect them to the existing site in the hopes of obtaining some traffic then you could do that. The greater value in most caseshowever is in obstructing competition.
You mentioned creating sites with the same content - well, that could trigger duplicate content filters which could result in issues for all of your sites. And, as at least one other poster pointed out, when you redirect a domain the end point would be the domain that would be indexed. Duplicate content would not exist.
Unless you have sufficient resources to build out some unique keyword domains (as caveman pointed out) you would be best off focusing your resources on one site. If you have the resources, then it might be a great idea. But then you run into other potential issues.
Edit: forgot to mention that I observe some benefit in using KW domain names but the difference is negligible when compared to truly important factors including producing excellent content, well written title tags, and link building.
[edited by: Excellira at 3:25 am (utc) on Aug. 3, 2008]
