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Will Google dilute reliance on Title tag

How different is Title tag abuse as compared to Meta Keyword abuse?

         

seoRank

12:32 am on Jan 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Meta Keyword tag has lost its patronage from most search engines due to its easy manipulation and spamming in the hands of a webmaster, or an SEO expert for that matter. If you really think about it, title tag is no different in its handling. Except that its charater length limits some abuse.

Considering title tag is given a very high importance in search engines like Google, do you think at some point Google may downgrade its reliance on title tag?

pageoneresults

12:41 am on Jan 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



Considering title tag is given a very high importance in search engines like Google, do you think at some point Google may downgrade its reliance on title tag?

My opinion is that it would be the last thing an SE would discount. The <title> element has always been the most important area. Most would not even think of thrashing their titles (like metadata may get thrashed), it serves no purpose. Relevancy, proximity and a few other things come into play with the <title> element.

Knowing how to write effective titles and then marry them to the on page content is the key to using titles successfully.

fathom

12:58 am on Jan 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



I'm on the same page as pageoneresults here.

Spam is in the eyes of the beholder (e.g. every competitior who out performs you "must be a spammer".) and a good title is one ingredient of this.

Short of Googlebot becoming an artificial lifeform so that she can see precisely what the visitor sees, the title will remain important.

However, the title is only one part of the equation - thus "spam the title" all you want it doesn't produce much by itself.

Incidentally - I have pushed a blank page to #1 to prove a point, but a "blank" page isn't blank to the bot - and the title element alone can't do this.

unless the phrase is >> white elephants in china doing the google dance <<

seoRank

2:28 am on Jan 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I agree with the second part of pageoneresult's response.

However, for the first part, your assumption is that everyone will prudently shape their title tags and not abuse/spam.....just like webmasters were expected to do for Meta Keywords?

fathom

2:41 am on Jan 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



hmmm... as I pointed out - if a page actually has content relevant to the query... then this isn't spam... regardless of how spammy the title looks.

If I am at #10 with a title Find Blue Widgets at Widgery.com

and the 9 sites above all have a title

Blue Widgets Blue Widgets Blue Widgets Blue Widgets

and all 10 companies are actually direct competitors complete with their own "blue widgets" for resell then there really is no spam. (It does not matter how I feel about their titles - it only matters how the searcher feels) did they purchase or search further.

On the other hand if all of the sites above were actually selling "peanuts" then I agree with you. This is abuse, and Google should stop false advertisers.

From Google's perspective though - a title is only 1 of 100 ranking considerations - thus I believe they have taken care of this.

<Added>Your position assumes that you are not at #1 and don't like the fact that someone else is.

The searcher cares less about who is at #1 as long as they have what they are looking for.

Google's cares less about who is at #1 as long as they provide the best possible results to the search.

Everyone assumes "they have the best" information, product or service, but in the end the searcher decides who is spamming and who isn't</added>

[edited by: fathom at 2:54 am (utc) on Jan. 30, 2003]

pageoneresults

2:53 am on Jan 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



It does not matter how I feel about their titles - it only matters how the searcher feels.

That's the key right there. Your titles are supposed to be written to entice the visitor, not scare them away. You can entice both the visitor and the spiders with just the right balance. ;)

olias

2:55 am on Jan 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I find that the most important thing that you should concern yourself about when doing page titles is are they what the searcher is looking for and therefore will they click them.

So my style is to try and have a title that matches my main search phrase for a page and try to pick up rankings on other search phrases by using the words on the page rather than clutter up the title. That way you have the best chance of a nice bold title in the SERPS that instantly makes sense. Although I'm sure the professional Adwords writers are biggest experts in that field!

seoRank

3:06 am on Jan 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



We seem to be drifting from my point. I realise it is a good practice to keep your titles relevant and appealing to the users. The issue is, if the users don't like the rankings which are weighted heavily by title tag, then as competition (and abuse) grows, would Google not like to be sensitive to the users who are being served 'Peanut' pages instead of 'Widget' sites, and adjust its alogrithm to weigh down the importance of title tag?

olias

3:09 am on Jan 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Well yes, this is where linking and pagerank come into it though. The site with a widgets title that is selling peanuts will only have links saying 'peanuts' and not 'widgets', so even if it is in the title it shouldn't rank well.

fathom

3:12 am on Jan 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



The issue is, if the users don't like the rankings

Exactly!

Google users do like the results, or they would start searching at Atlavista... thus Google defines this as successfully curbing spam, why change?

From my personal point of view (vice professional) I can find everything I look for at Google.

deejay

3:17 am on Jan 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



If you really think about it, title tag is no different in its handling

Nope. They are entirely different. The meta keywords tag was never seen by the user. The title tag is the first thing seen by the searcher on the SERPs - before they even enter the site.

This in itself at least moderates most sites to the point of using words in the title tag that reflect the content of the page, and therefore the search terms that the user was looking for.

With the keywords tag, a page about widgets, toggles and doohickeys could toss 'Anna Kournikova' into the tag a few of times and perhaps draw a nice number of additional though untargetted Anna fans, without damaging the credibility of the page in the eyes of serious widget, toggle or doohickey enthusiasts.

With the title tag, adding Anna to the title will perhaps still draw in a few extra untargetted Anna fans, but it is likely to be at the expense of some serious widget or doohickey buyers who would bypass the page as 'poppy'.

Losing highly targetted buyers for random pop-culture shoppers is a pretty poor trade.

Of course there's still the issue of poorly written titles - "Widget-world Widgets - cheap widgets free widgets blue widgets large widgets small widgets widgets widgets widgets widgets widgets widgets widgets".... but at least the user can see the title in the SERPS and make a judgement before clicking.

seoRank

3:35 am on Jan 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Well yes, this is where linking and pagerank come into it though. The site with a widgets title that is selling peanuts will only have links saying 'peanuts' and not 'widgets', so even if it is in the title it shouldn't rank well.

I think sometimes PageRank works against the purpose of relevance. Consider this - search for the term 'smoking' on Google and the #1 site amongst 9 million pages has NOTHING to do with smoking. I guess since PageRank plays a 'Multiplier' effect, it compounds the error.

I'm not suggesting that Google results are way out. Not yet. I love it the most, but do we see a writing on the wall?

Robert Charlton

5:46 pm on Feb 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Administrator 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



but do we see a writing on the wall?

No, not with the title tag. Again... it's visible and highly prominent. It's the most prominent thing you see in the serps; and if it's tied in with other algo factors, as it is, then it's perhaps the hardest part of the algo to spam.

To oversimplify... if you look at the Google algo as has been generally scoped out here, you'll see that Google emphasizes what is visible and prominent to a site visitor (titles, headings, high word placement on a page), and what is confirmed by other sources (link text, PR, etc).

In a way, a title is all of these... it is in fact the anchor text from the engine to the site.

Jack_Frost

8:09 pm on Feb 2, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



While I agree with what has been said here, I think the Google algo has already lessened the weight that it gives the title. There seemd to be that real noticaable change in October. I'm not sure it got enough recognition becuase of the Yahoo change, but I think that it was pretty clear form my research.