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There are rumours that Google is now not showing true PR values in an effort to make it difficult for SEO. Even more rumours abound that PR is broken and coupled with Googlebot's heavy duty spidering of the last few days we would all like to know what's going on. Webmasters are beginning to realise that PR may not be as important or that Google is possibly fooling us all. However there is a more important issue here.
There are no doubt several million ordinary folk using the Google Toolbar by now, what do they think? Do they know that Google is fooling them or do they just think Site A is less important than Site B?
Does out of date PR influence a users browsing? I would think certainly on information sites it does.
Google is great and with greatness comes responsibility. Larry Page wrote "Serving our end users is at the heart of what we do and remains our number one priority".
Does he refer to the end users that are being shown outdated or incorrect information?
There are no doubt several million ordinary folk using the Google Toolbar by now, what do they think?
Most users ask, "What is PageRank?" In other words, most toolbar users (i.e. Joe Surfer) don't know and don't care. What do they think? They don't care.
Do they know that Google is fooling them or do they just think Site A is less important than Site B?
Google's purpose is [google.com]: "...to organize the world's information and make it universally accessible and useful."
What matters is the serps. Providing a PR green bar for webmasters to use for SEO purposes does not fit within Google's stated mission to organize and present information. Telling you why they rank a website is not important. Ranking the website is what matters.
Does out of date PR influence a users browsing? I would think certainly on information sites it does.
No influence because the average web surfer has never heard of PR and doesn't care.
"Serving our end users is at the heart of what we do and remains our number one priority".Does he refer to the end users that are being shown outdated or incorrect information?
Oh, you mean the webmasters who are using the toolbar to help them optimize websites so that their websites interfere with Google's algorithm? No. That's not who he is referring to.
However I still feel that PageRank is of some importance to the way an average user browses. By average users I am refering to those that actually have downloaded and installed the Google toolbar. I would think that most would have also taken the time to read the finer details of PageRank technology.
"The heart of our software is PageRank™, a system for ranking web pages"
Google did not launch it's Toolbar as a tool for SEO's. It was made for the public, those ordinary folk searching the web. IMO most users will be fairly up to speed on the finer points of the Google Toolbar.
I apologise if I did not make my point clear in the first instance: If Google places such emphasis on PageRank, then brings a product out that clearly displays this PageRank, surely it has obligations to inform users of significant changes or problems.
As a webmaster, I am simply obsessed about PR and backlinks. I don't like the randomized backlink serps and I am eagerly waiting for the next toolbar PR update. I started to fear that toolbar PR is becoming more of a way to confuse webmaster rather than a tool to inform users.
Originally, wasn't the toolbar PR display meant as a way to compensate users for the privacy infringement that it caused? It was a deal between G and its users: The surfers let Google track every URL they visit and in return Google shares some of its internal algorithm with them.
Google may now realize that displaying toolbar PR isn’t such a good idea after all. The toolbar checksum algo was cracked and is in use on for automated PR lookup on several websites, commercial ones as well as enthusiast’s sites. Today I found myself asking “If toolbar PR is becoming just a big fraud, why did G recently issue a new version of the toolbar and with it a modified checksum algorithm?
I have two explanations: Either G uses the checksum hash internally to identify URLs and they had to change their identification scheme, e.g. to accommodate for larger numbers of indexed pages and reduce the number of collisions (different URLs, same hash), or PR isn’t a scam and the checksum algorithm was modified to protect it from being abused in violation of the TOS.
inaccurate? it's just out-dated is all!
Maybe there is an imminent PR update looming. I wouldn't imagine they can leave things as they are for much longer.
Why not, the only people upset about are SEO's. I don't think Google really cares much what they think.
People need to move beyond the obsession with PR.
--I wouldn't imagine they can leave things as they are for much longer.--Why not, the only people upset about are SEO's. I don't think Google really cares much what they think.
People need to move beyond the obsession with PR.
Though I wouldnt necessarily say soon, I would expect a PR update by say the end of year. First and foremost gg said expect quarterly updates. Second - as pointed out, the toolbar can only gather statistics and, in doing so, violate privacy, so long as there is some tradeoff for the end user. While google certainly dosnt need the black hat type folk, the white hats, people who improve their sites and in the process make it rank well, improve quality rather then degrade it. Moreover the (non-seo) people and the manner in which they browse could, if utilized, improve the index even more.
I agree that many of us are foolishly obsessed with the litle green bar, however this does not detract from the fact that Google for all intents and purposes has released defective or flawed software.
PageRank lies at the very heart of Google yet it appears to millions as outdated at best, possibly corrupted.
Inevitably this can only lead to questions of credibility.
The toolbar is offered to the general public, and having part of it inaccurate is like distributing something to the public that's broken or defective.
I hadn't thought of it that way! As a Mac User, I can't get the toolbar and have never even see what it looks like ... let alone what it does. However, although we may be webmasters, we are all members of the general public too!
In light of the recent IPO, it is rather surprising that Google (who like to be thought of as providing the cutting edge of search engine technology) would allow an obviously glaring defect to remain in plain view for such a long time?
This leads me to ask if the toolbar really is "broken or defective" ... or is it just interpreting data in a completely different way than you were used to? Is it being used to perform a different task altogether for a period of time?
I would imagine if the question was brought up at a stockholders meeting, an interesting answer might be forthcoming.
My guess is that a very big update is in store. Hopefully, things regarding the toolbar info will become clear ... or at least a little less muddy fairly soon. :)
I disagree! I think quite the opposite- it is performing just how google is intending it to perform. That is to say that just like drug addicts going through withdrawal when going cold turkey, so too the webmasters and mistresses who've focused on PR at the expense of content are suddenly getting jittery waiting for their next PR fix.
Google envisaged their search engine as being based on organic links, naively not realising people would try to artificially build pagerank. By showing outdated pagerank on the toolbar they probably expect the job of such SEOers may become harder. From the way some people are posting on this board I suspect it is working just how they planned.
Without the green bar PageRank simply does not exist because it then becomes just part of a mathematical formula (algorithm). All the search engines have algorithms, but by showing the green bar they are giving people like newspaper reporters something tangible that they can see (ahhh so that’s PageRank).
Actually it should be a gold bar.
Some have argued the toolbar PR display is useful in that it can be used by honest webmasters to avoid linking to penalized sites. One of the nasty things about Google is a site can be penalized for linking into a "bad neighborhood". One consequence of this is that fearful webmasters can be scared from linking to worthwhile sites because of the possibility that perhaps they are doing something Google considers shady. That a site has some PR showing in the toolbar can be seen as a Google stamp of approval.
And, YES I am aware that another possible consequence is that webmasters can be scared not to link to honest sites because they are too new, or have too few inbound links, to get better than a PR0. Or perhaps got blown out of Google because their server was down a while, or there was a Googlebot glitch. This slow updating of PR is making this worse. It now takes longer than ever for a new site to get the "Google stamp of approval".
I just think that Google Toolbar was launced for the general public and having obsolete/outdated information contained therein is not much short of scandalous.
I am surprised that Google has not made a statement on this so far.
