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New websites doomed?

How to compete?

         

Fryman

9:18 pm on Apr 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I was thinking about building a minisite to promote a few products as an affiliate. I have a specific keyword I am interested in targeting. I searched for it at Google, and the top 10 results don't have that keyword in the title of the page, so I guess they aren't targeting it. However, they are big monsters with huge PR, one even has a PR9. And they all have thousands of backlinks. How can a new website compete against these monsters? How can a new website get a huge PR and thousands of backlinks? Seems you have to consider a huge investment to get this. Who would want to backlink to a new online store?

THanks

jcoronella

11:45 pm on Apr 16, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Who would want to backlink to a new online store?

Start with DMOZ, Zeal, and Yahoo. Then try directories in your area. I think you'll find a lot if you spend the time looking. Other good choices include the Better Business Bureau, and other online verification sites.

If you truly can't find content on topic, it may not be harder than you think.

Good thread on acquiring links here: They Handy Dandy Linky Getting Guidy [webmasterworld.com]

choster

11:57 pm on Apr 16, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



I'm not entirely sure these mix.
as an affiliate
DMOZ, Zeal, and Yahoo

BigDave

12:03 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



if you don't think you can compete, do something else.

That is a basic decision that everyone must ask themselves before they start a new business.

Is it a good idea to open a small hardware store across the street from a Home Depot? It could be if you are selling stuff that they aren't, but in most cases it would be a really bad plan.

SlyOldDog

12:05 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Depends on how you sell your wares. Comprehensive review sites are definately adding value and deserve links from directories.

I think for small affiliates the way to deal with the big boys is through specialization. For example, you'll get trounced if you take on your local internet supermarket and try to sell a similar range of products. On the other hand, if you specialize in hot sauce and sell 250 different brands of varying potency then you may carve out a market. If there is just one site like that in the world, you become the world's authority on hot sauces.

itisgene

12:31 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Only a few targeted links will get you on the first page of SERP. You don't need thousands of links to be on the top. It would be nice of course but not an necessity.

I have a small site doing well on the first page above other big guys and affiliate sites.

It takes time but not an impossible fight.

BigDave

12:38 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



On the other hand, if you specialize in hot sauce and sell 250 different brands of varying potency then you may carve out a market.

And if you could get me a couple of cases of Inner Beauty Real Hot Sauce, which seems to have gone out of production, I would promise you at least a PR7.

BigDave (who has been going through SERIOUS withdrawl for the last few months without his Inner Beauty :( )

Fryman

12:46 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I agree with Choster. Zeal is only for personal, non-commercial websites. And it doesn't even count as a backlink since it blocks Google's spider.
DMOZ is the same, almos impossible to get in, specially if you have a minisite or an affiliate site.

Yahoo... well, what can I say, they just want your $$

Submitting to other free directories... well, 99.9% of them need you to link back, so you get a backlink that you have to reciprocate.

mayor

1:35 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



You'd be surprised at what ranks these days. That's if you can get your new site indexed.

A few good links from lower ranking sites to your small site with focussed content can put you right up there with the biggies, at least for the targeted keywords that count for you.

You can compete, but don't expect a stampede of traffic without working for it and, above all, being very patient.

jcoronella

2:16 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



I'm not entirely sure these mix.
'as an affiliate'
'DMOZ, Zeal, and Yahoo '

oops... don't know why I missed the first sentence... was looking at 'Who would want to backlink to a new online store?'... assumed was it's own store.

This thread still applies: They Handy Dandy Linky Getting Guidy [webmasterworld.com]

Revamped response:
Your doomed, you'll never make it, give up trying. ;)

Patrick Taylor

5:57 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Go for it. A non-competitive keyword - or more especially keyphrase - can work wonders, even with very few backlinks. Obviously your chances depend not just on whether your big competitors have them in their page titles but elsewhere too, but I do believe with careful research and page construction, size isn't everything. And I know for a fact that there are some DMOZ categories where you can get in within a week or two.

steveb

7:32 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



"Zeal is only for personal, non-commercial websites. And it doesn't even count as a backlink since it blocks Google's spider."

Not anymore. Zeal backlinks do show up.

valeyard

8:32 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I think for small affiliates the way to deal with the big boys is through specialization. For example, you'll get trounced if you take on your local internet supermarket and try to sell a similar range of products. On the other hand, if you specialize in hot sauce and sell 250 different brands of varying potency then you may carve out a market. If there is just one site like that in the world, you become the world's authority on hot sauces.

Absolutely. Go for the niche(s). Use tools like Wordtracker to find out what people are searching for.

You probably don't have a chance against the big boys targetting "widgets". You might even have a fight with "clockwork widgets", but how about "antique clockwork widgets"?

Are the big boys just stores with no information? If so then perhaps "widget reviews", "widget information" or "widget buying guide" might help. "Widget facts", "widget history" and "widget trivia" might get people into your site. Don't forget a "widget FAQ".

Don't waste your time on a battle you can't win - choose your fights.

Good luck.

MHes

8:33 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



The only way to compete is with 'keyword' + 'word not on other sites but relevant and searched for'

In otherwords, research how the product is searched for and include more text with more broad match words. Make your site/page more informative and helpfull.

More content = more potential search phrases that will be picked up. A major keyword often will get only a small percentage of the traffic gained from a collection of obscure search words on your page.

MHes

8:35 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



valeyard - you beat me to it!

PatrickDeese

8:41 am on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



when a "widgets.com" rules the SERP for "widget" there's always room for a wwidget, wigdet, and a iwdget ;)

jackson992

8:38 pm on Apr 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Not true. The only site of mine that didn't get burned during The Ides of March is the one that has 84,200 backlinks. All the others don't rank well and one has 21,800 backlinks which I guess isn't enough:)