Google Updates and SERP Changes - August 2012

[Martin Ice Web]

< Continued from [webmasterworld.com...] >

Today is very low. I don´t know if its weather or vacation related? From what I see is that most product related serps will show #1-#10 price compare sites, not one informational or ecom site.

[edited by: tedster at 6:04 pm (utc) on Aug 1, 2012]

[Martin Ice Web]

Didn´t we see reports about increasing and decreasing traffic before every panda update, did we?

[backdraft7]

Still seeing slightly higher traffic, but greatly diminished conversions. Traffic is coming is spurts, then shuts off. Something seems to be churning again.

[starkseo]

I'm seeing a systematic meltdown of my top two sites since last Friday. I'm dropping by about 10-20% per day and it doesn't look like levelling out any time soon.

Prior to this dropoff we were seeing a steady increase week to week since March.

I literally cannot pinpoint the reason why this would be occurring. I have decent on site stats which have actually been improving(4.5 minute average time on site, 15% bounce rate, 3 actions/visitor). I cannot possibly see how I could have been effected by Panda.

Secondly there is no way I have been effected by Penguin as my backlink profile is completely relevant to my own sites, I mix up my anchor texts and I NEVER use any spammy techniques.

It's really scary when you start to see a decline and you literally have no direction to move towards.

What on earth is happening?

[londrum]

I have decent on site stats which have actually been improving(4.5 minute average time on site, 15% bounce rate, 3 actions/visitor).

they probably are good stats (i wish i had them), but have you considered that they might actually be the opposite? a high time on site, together with a low bounce rate, might suggest that the page they land on doesn't contain the info they need, and they spend some time on your site searching for it. if google is seeing it the same way, then they might demote the original landing page for whatever term it's ranking for.

[tedster]

Welcome to the forums, starkseo.

I mix up my anchor texts and I NEVER use any spammy techniques.

If you are controlling your backlink anchor text, Google can consider that to be spammy all on its own these days. They want to see a high percentage of "freely given, editorial" backlinks that you clearly did not arrange in any way. Do you have lots of such backlinks?

[Alex997]

Also, just because Panda/Penguin doesnt hit you directly, doesn't mean the sites that link to you haven't been affected, and the ones linking to them haven't been affected too etc etc - thus decreasing the backlink values further upstream...

[Alex997]

Tedster - the top page of my primary target keywords are now completely populated by sites with only a mix of about 3 or 4 differently arranged anchors in their backlinks.

Me with my much richer anchor diversity however has been dropped by 3 pages after getting up to #4 spot a couple weeks back. No idea why other than the theory that other linking sites have been penguined. So just have to wait now until they recover - as do I (already back up 1 page after a week without making any changes).

[SevenCubed]

...might suggest that the page they land on doesn't contain the info they need...

If the engineers at google think in that manner it's no wonder things are so out of control. By example when I search for something I am unfamiliar with, and find it, I still go back to search and scout around for 2 or 3 more opinions that agree with the first one as an indicator of reliability. If they are interpreting my return as "he didn't like that page" they are so very much on the wrong path.

[londrum]

didnt they say once that they dont rely on things like bounce rate too much, for reasons exactly like that

[starkseo]

@londrum I've never considered that no. But I'm yet to read any information to suggest that could be the case. I was always under the impression that more interaction on site is seen as a positive thing as far as Panda goes no?

Do you know of anyone who has tested this theory out or any articles to suggest this might be the case?

@tedster Awesome to be here, I don't know why it took me so long to join. I'm not controlling it as such, but trying to use anchors that don't seem forced within the content both on my sites and on others. In that sense I believe I am sticking to the model of "freely given, editorial" backlinks.

I don't know, it just smells like something fishy is going on. The hard thing to come to grips with is whether you should just continue work as normal or sacrifice a week spent researching and making changes that you aren't sure will reflect positive results.

[netmeg]

but trying to use anchors that don't seem forced

Are you talking about internal links or external?

Basically if you are controlling or influencing your external links to almost any degree imaginable, it could be an issue. At least that's my take on it.

[starkseo]

Alex, really good point regarding other sites where your links appear being effected.

I only just read Google's latest updates where they released 2 months worth of changes for June and July at the same time. I just hate how cryptic they make it like -

"ng2. [project codename “Other Ranking Components”] Better ordering of top results using a new and improved ranking function for combining several key ranking features."

Or

"#82367. [project codename “Other Ranking Components”] This launch helps you find more high-quality content from trusted sources."

How on earth are we supposed to decipher any of these and move towards developing our sites and promotion in line with these changes?

[starkseo]

Are you talking about internal links or external?

Basically if you are controlling or influencing your external links to almost any degree imaginable, it could be an issue. At least that's my take on it.

There's no influence going on at all really. I'm not attempting to control the anchors on any of my links, internal or external.

The only conclusion I have been able to come up with is that the recent changes which came out on the 10th have severely effected the sites which hold my backlinks and therefore my sites have been directly influenced as a result.

If my sites were to have suffered a direct penalty, I would imagine I would see an immediate and severe reduction in search rankings, but the nature of my decline is slow.

This might indicate that the sites which hold my backlinks are slowly being hit by the updates this month as they roll out.

One last thing I wanted to get everyone's take on is the PR toolbar update which came out this month. I was always under the impression that page rank is constantly changing, but am I wrong to assume that is the case?

ie. if my site was shown to have a PR5 after the update, will it stay a 5 until the next update or will it constantly be changing, only not revealed until G updates their toolbar?

[Sand]

ie. if my site was shown to have a PR5 after the update, will it stay a 5 until the next update or will it constantly be changing, only not revealed until G updates their toolbar?

You're correct. Real PR is always in flux, but the toolbar is only updated a few times a year (and only shows whole numbers).

[gehrlekrona]

Usually Bing and Yahoo makes up for lost Google traffic but where are they today?

[backdraft7]

It's days like this that I wonder if the problems are not simply network related. Today I'm even seeing less spam coming in (none all morning). My serps look OK, but traffic and paying visitors are non existent. Can't say we can always blame it on Google... BUT, I also notice that G is currently very slow on the uptake of new posts (usually takes under 5 minutes for my blog). That's another sign that the pot's being stirred again.

[imbckagn]

Is this thread for people to post daily updates of their personal websites or general observations? I don't even like coming here anymore to much crap in the threads.

[starkseo]

I'm sorry imbckagn, but it's obvious you're referring to me with your comment. Did I not just add value to this thread by offering a suggestion as to how my site may have been effected my the updates going on this month and what I'm going to do to rectify the situation?

Perhaps that alone could help out a lot of people on this forum no?

[backdraft7]

@imbckagn - if you don't like it, then "don't come back again". daily observations are the only way to get any kind of a handle on the daily flux. Any other discussion of algo's here is pure speculation, so I'd rather hear the actual observations than guess.

[tedster]

It is becoming clear that problems with sites that link to you can bleed through to your own rankings - and with some ranking changes now coming on gradually rather than all at once [reference [webmasterworld.com]] it becomes very hard to know when an actual "update" takes effect these days.

There were a number of "hot spots" in this thread earlier in the month - dates where a number of members spotted larger than normal changes. This past weekend seems to be one of them. Did anyone else notice changes around August 17-19?

[starkseo]

Yep I saw the effects starting last friday.

[Sand]

tedster,
My experience the last few days has been pretty interesting. I don't remember having so many highs and lows in such a short period of time.

Saturday was absolutely abysmal for me. I felt sick when I woke up and checked the stats. Definitely a new low. I couldn't look at them for the rest of the day.

Sunday I saw a little bounce back. Nothing incredible, but more in line with a typical Sunday.

Monday, I got a huge lift and it's even stronger so far today. This site was hit by Panda first on April 19, and then periodically with refreshes after that.

[HuskyPup]

Did anyone else notice changes around August 17-19?

Definitely for my trade widget directory site, traffic way down on normal even for a weekend.

I'm even seeing less spam coming in

Now this is interesting since I'm experiencing the same and since I seem to have been on every spammers mailing list since the last millennium I thought it rather coincidental that the less traffic I got the less spam came in!

[Wilburforce]

Unusually quiet on the spam front here, but I hadn't read anything into it. It isn't likely to have dropped because of something Google did last weekend.

[netmeg]

Roger Dooley posted something on his site about Gmail turning up the dial on the spam filters last week - are you people reporting less spam using Gmail?

[HuskyPup]

Don't use Gmail, could they be clamping down on Gmail senders?

[netmeg]

I was thinking maybe.

[backdraft7]

Definitely saw the upset over the weekend. I actually had the highest level of traffic in 4 months on Sunday, yet an anemic conversion rate, so again, obviously poor targeting and poor quality. Bounce rate also jumped during the traffic peak. It makes me wonder whether G is losing control of the myriad of updates and if some are actually fighting each other.

Here's and idea for them...scrap it all, start over with version 2,000,000. Maybe it's time to do a rewrite, consolidate the complexity and regain control (but don't forget those who ranked well and still provide great content). Honestly, updates should not bring about economic upheaval for those who have been "trusted" for many years.

If there are better sites out there, let them rise naturally instead of forcing them to the top. With all due respect, they usually get it wrong anyway. When I'm doing a search, I prefer to get the whole enchilada on the topic rather than one poorly written paragraph and one photo surrounded by 5 ad units.

[dreamache]

Noticed at the beginning of Monday, SE referrers to my main site dropped by almost 20%. The trend is unfortunately continuing today.

One thing I'm noticing that is strange, referrers I get from other sites in my niche aren't sending as much traffic either. I'm hoping it's just due to kids going back to school this week, which could possibly account for the drop in traffic/activity/searches.

[gehrlekrona]

Here's a stupid question. If I have almost the same searches finding my site that I had a year ago, why are my hits from Google only 25% of what they used to be? To me it doesn't make any sense. I doesn't make sense either that there is so much shift from hour to hour so you have hundred hits for example one hour and only 10 the next hour even though you have 100,000,000 potential searchers for what I have to offer and that is a rather common thing to search for. I have information that spans the globe but get very little hits from other countries. I even, years ago, registered a UK domain and that worked for a while but after a while Google stopped sending traffic and I am guessing it was because it was hosted in the US.
Another interesting thing as I have mentioned before, 3 days in the last 7 day period I have had the same number of visitors! Hoe is that even possible? Some days the landing pages are inner pages and some days it is just the main page, today it is inner pages and long tail.
Some people are talking about recovery but my guess is that there is no such thing anymore. Where we are at now, that's where we will stay and the only option now is to start generating web sites and see what sticks. If it doesn't stick, oh well, we've lost 10 bucks and a few hours. If it sticks, it might last for a couple of months and hopefully you got your money back. You can have a great web site, but if Google doesn't like it, nobody but your friends will find it if you don't spam FB, Pinterest or other social media sites.