Forum Moderators: Robert Charlton & goodroi
I would like webmasters views on the following please?
1. Recently (following BD) i noticed that on one of our long established sites a number of pages were dropped from the index. On close inspection of the pages dropped i found that a collegue had at some point in the past been to lazy to use the correct code to center some text in a box and had instead used <------>Text Words<----> to centre the Text words and had then used the font FFFFF (color white) tag on the <----> text in front and after the text words so that just the text is shown in the box. This code follows the bgcolor FFFFF (color white) tag hence in effect its hidden text?. I have now removed this code from the pages and centred the text correctly.
Question:-
a) Would this be enough for it to cause google to drop these pages? (the pages could have fallen in the index due to other reasons)
b) Would Google class <----> as text?
c) Is googles new infastructure picking up this kind of thing from pages now when previously i dont think it did?
2. On another site we work on a previous webmaster has perhaps over used the no script tag on a number of pages which have also been hit with a penulty we think. Ie where the page was 5 in the seprs its now 90+!. I genuinely dont think it was done to decieve but more likely to tidy up the pages so they looked better than having links showing on the page all over the place to the end user. I have seen many other sites (some very large corporate ones at that) doing this i think for seo reasons. ie within the page code:-
<noscript>
<a>http.....Link 1> Blue widget</a>
<a>http.....Link 2> Black Widget</a>
etc, etc
</noscript>
We are now working on tidying up the sites layout and correcting these issues on the pages concerned.
Question:-
A) Do you think the new google Infastructure is now looking for this kind of thing?
B) Could this be the cause why these pages lost position?
C) If google thought it was spam wouldnt it just black list (grey bar) the site?, or does it apply a penulty just to the pages concerned so that they dont rank?(well not in the top 20 anyway.
3. On another site the webmaster was displaying sponsored adverts in a Java box on various pages (seen this on loads of sites)again these pages were hit with a penulty and dropped right back in the index. A thought came to me that perhaps like msn were testing not so long back that google was now somehow comparing cashed pages in ie with cashed pages in mozzilla firefox with java disabled to compare if a page was displaying something different to what the bot viewed.
Question:-
A) Do you think im in fantasy land and that Google is not that bothered about adverts in Java? and that to compare this way would be to much effort/ strain on resorces?.
B) Do you think google now reads/ follows Java script anyway? (i suspect it does, but could be wrong)hence it knows if the page has adwords or anything else on it or not anyway.
C) Do you think google would put a penulty on a site or the pages concerned JUST because it displays adwords in Java? Sounds like madness to me?.
Sorry if this post has gone on a bit but im trying to widen my experience, so if any webmasters or if GGs about would like to comment on any of the above i would be most gratefull.
Thanks in advance
Certainly could be. Google can spot such tricks at 74 miles, and has done for several years.
b) Would Google class <----> as text?
<----> **is** text.
c) Is googles new infastructure picking up this kind of thing from pages now when previously i dont think it did?
Google can spot such tricks at 74 miles, and has done for several years.
2. where the page was 5 in the seprs its now 90+!.
That is not a penalty, just a drop. Not likely to be connected with the spammy stuff. - But if a rival reports you, your could well be in trouble, if, as it 'sounds like' it's being done to game google - that's not what noscript is for, is it?
A) Do you think the new google Infastructure is now looking for this kind of thing?
My feeling is that the jury is still out on that; but abuse is getting much more common, so justice can't be far off.
B) Could this be the cause why these pages lost position?
Unlikely, see above.
C) If google thought it was spam wouldnt it just black list (grey bar) the site?, or does it apply a penulty just to the pages concerned so that they dont rank?(well not in the top 20 anyway.
There are signs that in some cases, Google applies penalties short of a ban, to help confuse spammers - they don't know if they're banned or not! But in this case, I really don't think so, for what that's worth!
3. A) Do you think im in fantasy land and that Google is not that bothered about adverts in Java? and that to compare this way would be to much effort/ strain on resorces?.
There are signs that Google can read some javascript ...
B) Do you think google now reads/ follows Java script anyway? (i suspect it does, but could be wrong)hence it knows if the page has adwords or anything else on it or not anyway.
... but not apparently very well ...
C) Do you think google would put a penulty on a site or the pages concerned JUST because it displays adwords in Java? Sounds like madness to me?.
... But no reports yet of action following. But Google has reserved the right to act against any kind of pam, so I'm not sure why that would be madness?
Interesting questions; I have to say it sound like you are pushing the boundaries in many directions. How will you know what causes the *real* damage when it happens?
[edited by: Quadrille at 9:01 am (utc) on July 30, 2006]
Bottom line is that the sites involved need to be and are being cleaned up. Its certainly not worth the risks of a ban or ranking penulty from google but im amazed to see so many sites when you look at their page source code clearly over stepping the google guide lines and still ranking well.
I would say however that Google despite its current serps issues has fairly clean serps compared to msn and Yahoo where some of the more basic forms of spam still continue.
Thanks again for your thoughts on these issues anyway, i hope your right that the page drops are not penulty related on the site with the over use of the no script tags and hope that once the code is cleaned up that they return to previous levels.
As for the site with the <---> in white this has been cleaned up already but no sign of a return for the pages - will have to give it time i guess, a lesson learned i think.
Cheers
