My Car died this morning

Best course of action?

[limbo]

Had meeting this morning at 8am, got up early to avoid traffic....

But my car was dead, one pathetic turn over and then it completely died, not a jot of energy. I had left nothing on, not the lights, not the radio, nothing. So I'm guessing it had something to do with the weather? It's bloody cold (relatively speaking) and damp to boot. No room on the street for a one man bump and too early to wake the neighbours for a jump. So I took the bus

Is there anyone here got tips for keeping the your car in good working order during cold weather? I know that many of you experience VERY cold winters so might know a thing or two.

Thanks, Limbo

[curlykarl]

Join The AA, RAC or similar :)

I hate touching cars, especially cold wet ones.

Karl

[macrost]

Limbo,
Back when I used to live in Wyoming, we had what were called block heaters that kept the engine block warm, so you wouldn't have to idle so long to heat it up. I know that doesn't solve your battery problem ;), but what you should do before winter is to check the water levels in the battery (if you can). Also go to a garage and see if you can borrow a battery meter so you can test the battery itself.

If the battery is fine, but runs out of juice in a day or so, have your alternator checked/replaced, that's the culprit there.

[sem4u]

Joining a motoring organisation is a very good idea as getting picked up by a breakdown truck can be quite expensive.

When I had my old car, which was about 10 years old, the battery just went flat one morning. I'm pretty sure that it was the original battery and I didn't leave the lights on or anything like that.

I would get it jump started and drive it to a garage where they can take a look and fit a new battery. This should solve the problem, but I am no expert...

[lZakl]

ex mechanic of 6 years here ;0)

If your car isn’t starting in the morning, it could be the result of a dead cell in the battery. (This can be caused by several things, but the main cause is the battery being ‘jolted’. You been over any rough roads lately? ;0)

Anywho, if your battery isn’t ‘maintenance free’ you might check the water level in all the cells. In cold weather, low water can cause the car to not want to turn over until the temp comes up... simply the sign of a ‘normally’ weak battery.

If that fails, run simple battery check if you have a multimeter sitting around. An open circuit test (everything is off and negative poll disconnected) on a 12V battery should be at least 12.65V at 100% state of charge. Now if the battery isn’t fully charged, the testing numbers will vary. So charge the batt before testing.

If that is good, you will still need to do a “load test”. Every battery has a specific number of amps it is meant to output in order to turn the motor over. If yours has the voltage, but lacks the amperage, it will not turn the motor over. You will need to take this to a parts store, or a mechanic for this. (Unless you want to but a load tester, mine was $3,500 ;0)

Furthermore, if the amperage is good, have the battery load tested “in car” This could indicate that there is too much impedance (measured in ohms) on the battery polls, positive starter cable, negative ground cable, or subsequent connections. This could be caused by corrosion, bad connections etc...

.... All good? NOW you can move to looking at the alternator. If a battery is bad, it will often give the impression that the alternator is bad... being the alternator is not being allowed to charge to it’s maximum capacity. Turn the car on, (make sure your battery is charged) and test the alt voltage. It should be no lower than 14V. It should be at 14.4 preferably, and around 13.5 is considered ‘weak’.

If the voltage tests o.k., then turn the headlamps on, your heater and defrost, this will put an ‘every day’ load on the alternator. If the voltage drops to below 13.2, this is considered ‘undercharging’. At this point 3 things normally cause this: 1) a bad alternator 2) A bad diode / regulator 3)loose alternator belt/electrical connection, corrosion, etc. There is more involved, but that is the basic rundown.

Regulators, nowdays, compensate for the ambient temperature also to ensure that the battery is properly charged under different weather conditions. As the temp decreases, the voltage is increased to overcome the high impedance that batteries have in cold weather. And as the weather gets warmer, the charging voltage should decrease. So this 'could' be a culprit if only cold weather is affecting starting.

This should be your “starting point” for the ‘do it yourselfer’. If all that fails, you’ll be looking for a ‘phantom load’... Chasing one of those can be like chasing a ghost. That’s a whole other chapter.. lol

-- Zak

[shigamoto]

Always and I mean always have a good battery. You notice that the battery might be bad when the car takes longer to start/ignite.

Try to wash the car during the winters in a garage or something so that you get all the salt from the roads off.

Be sure that your cooling fluids are able to sustain cold temperatures. If you are able it's good to hook up the car to an engine heater.

I'm not able to do that since I park in a public parking lot. I usually keep the car running for a while when I have started it so that the engine warms up a bit.

Get your car through the regular service program. Oh and have a small shovel and a nice warm coat in the back for when you get stuck in blizzards :P

[limbo]

Great stuff. Really apreciate the time you have all put in - I've printed this thread and will use it as a checklist tonight - I'll let you know how I get on tomorrow.

Cheers

[Essex_boy]

If its diesel try teh glow lamps, I had two out four blow on me so I couldnt start on Friday.

[Automan Empire]

Have the battery and charging system evaluated in the fall to avoid these problems. Buy a good name brand battery, not cheap. Best general advice is to have a mechanic you trust before you need one.

[rocknbil]

Cold weather + poor cranking = almost always a failing battery OR . . . the posts simply need to be cleaned.

IZakl I **seriously** mean no irreverence, but mechanics these days are total THIEVES. Last tune-up I paid for, which I did only because of a time restraint issue, cost me $460 and came without benefit of non-petroleum lubricants to ease the pain.

I did the same tune-up this weekend and it cost me $80, and I used better parts and did a couple things outside normal tune up procedures. The actual tune up parts were $40.

I recommend that EVERYONE not be afraid to get your hands dirty and wherever possible, get out the manual and perform basic work yourself. It's not all that difficult and manuals are very clear in step-by-step basic stuff.

[nancyb]

years ago when I was so very poor and had old cars with old battery problems that I couldn't afford to replace, I would run an electric light bulb under the hood all night and cover the hood with blankets. Amazing that even in wind chill -25 degrees the old chevy would still turn over in the morn.

[lZakl]

rocknbil,

's ok.. ;0)

Just realize that 80% of what you pay for when you go to the shop is labor. And for $480 I'd say you got ripped. Normally if the belt(s) got changed, cap, roter (if applicable) plugs, wires, even new cam gear (were applicable) would reach MAYBE that if the car was seriously hard to work on. (a good example is a '89-'95 Taurus. Two cylinders in the back are seriously hard to get to.) But for a basic tune-up... The last place I worked, we charge $129 for 4cyl and $189 for 6cyl. That INCLUDED parts. Over $450? The car better have a fresh coat of wax and a detail on top of the tune-up, or it'd better be a hard-to work-on vehicle, or brand new and some sort of exotic ie. Jaguar, BMW, Mercedes, etc..... $480... *gag* wow...

-- Zak

[rocknbil]

^ ^ Yeah. Hence my mention of failure to provide adequate lubricants. :-(

Fortunately (or unfortunately, depending on how you see it) I've been in and under cars most of my life and I decided just this once let a mechanic do it . . . and of course knowing the fragile shell of most male egos I was careful not to act like I actually knew what I was talking about . . . . but it did not good. Never again.

[Automan Empire]

I **seriously** mean no irreverence, but mechanics these days are total THIEVES.

Irreverence, no, but you hit the insult mark pretty hard. That remark was about as meaningful as saying that internet marketers these days are total SPAMMERS!

Thanks, dude!

[mcavic]

The alternator went out once on my old car. It still started, and I had to get to school, so I drove it like that for the day. By the time I was pulling into the garage for service, the battery was so weak that the turn signal was having a hard time. I don't know how much electricity the steering and brakes use, but I guess I was pretty lucky.

That car (my first) was an experience. I drove it until it practically fell apart. The transmission would barely pull it up a hill... it never would hold oil or coolant. The door handle broke at one point. It broke a timing belt (no damage, though).

When I traded it in, the guy said "make sure you've got all your stuff out, cause it's going straight to the crusher." It still looked nice on the outside. Oh, except that my neighbor backed into it.

:)

[limbo]

Did'nt have time to do anything with the car last night - should get home before 9 thi evening.

But I was walking past it this morning (on the way to the bus stop!) and noticed something wasn't right... The local robbing %#*%'s have jimmied the lock and ransacked the interior. Yeah cheers, that's all I need. not only does my car not go anywhere I will have to fork our for a new drivers side door and lock. Worse of all they nicked all my CD's, all of em. If it weren't for the travel distance I'd be back my bike without hesitation grumble, bloody, moan, grumble...

[rocknbil]

^ ^ Oh THAT is awful . . . "one of those days . . . . "

Thanks, dude!

You're welcome, glad I could help.

There is a difference between reasonable financial compensation for a service and outright shafting "just because we can." See Izakl's previous comments for a reputable mechanic's point of view.

Won't touch the internet marketer comment - that one is just too easy.

[svcglobal]

Limbo, buy an extra small boost battery. Keep it at home (it's not sooo big) and use when the winter is freezing like this one.
Easily plugged (and unplugged) in the cigarette lighter.

[cooldoug]

Just every weekend charge the battery, works for me.

[limbo]

Thanks to all that gave advice

I had time for a bit of DIY this weekend so out came the socket set... When I finally managed to budge the offending battery and take it to the local spares shop I was laughed at - seems as though the battery was ancient and was amazed it'd even made it that far.

So out came the wallet - new battery + testing widget + booster, then after a little cadging I installed the new new one (winter hardy) and it works great, touch wood and whistle....