impact of frames in google

[LowCostSoftware]

Hi folks - couldn't work out which forum this should be in but here goes.

I need to get a site into the top 5 in google for the keyphrase "liverpool hotels". The top 3 ranked sites use frames! One uses a redirect. Web Position Gold doesn't seem to be able to analyse the sites. So guys my questions are:

1. How do I check out key word density on framed sites?

2. How come these framed sites made it to the top 3 anyway? I thought frames were a 'no-no' for ranking.

One thing I wondered was whether these sites had a mass of links pointing to them, so:

3. Is this the correct way to check the number of inbound links to a site in google:
links: www.the-domain-name.com ?

Any and all help would be gratefully received.

Tony

[Marcia]

Framed sites are not altogether a no-no, some people have good success with them. But they are more difficult.

To check links:
link:www.the-domain-name.com

[Brett_Tabke]

1- check the target page. Each target document is treated as an individual page.
2- there are a few framed sites. Most of them are using js timers and other "frame buster" tricks to reset the frame on click through. So even if it looks like a framed site, it was just one of the page/targets that was indexed by Google. If you have an example frame that is showing in the Google cache, I'd like to see that.
3- yes. try it with and without the third level extension (www.domain.com vs domain.com)