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Is this legit? If my keyword is 3% density of my description...

         

hulahoop

5:14 pm on Nov 27, 2004 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Hello,

I am doing some optimization on my site.
Hope you can see if what I am doing is legit.

I have a keyword say 'X' and it appears 25 times in my 995 word description - giving it a 3% density. Using a seo tool, it says that anything more than 3% is considered spam. But I am just at 3%.

Just want to be very sure that I will not be penalised by Google or any other search engines as I have pretty good rankings now.

jimbeetle

5:38 pm on Nov 27, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



Welcome to WW, hulahoop,

Let's back up a bit. When you say "995 word description," are you talking about the meta description tag in the head? If so, I'd pare that down by about 975 or so words.

Most major search engines don't give much credit to the meta description tag, keep it short and sweet. I rarely write descriptions longer than 15 words, basically because I just get bored, but they seem to work. Include each of your primary keyword phrases and supporting secondary keywords once and you should be okay.

Now, if you're talking about a site description "page" that's 995 words, 3% density might be considered on the low end; you should be able to work it up to 6 or 8% without any problem, possibly higher depending on your site's niche.

Here's some good reading:
Brett's Successful Site in 12 Months with Google Alone [webmasterworld.com]

Use the keyword once in title, once in description tag, once in a heading, once in the url, once in bold, once in italic, once high on the page, and hit the density between 5 and 20% (don't fret about it).

hulahoop

6:11 pm on Nov 27, 2004 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Opps sorry I mean the body's description.
About the 3% as low, I saw from my SEO tool that anything more than 3% could be spam. Because I am targeting more than 8 keywords in my main page, having about 8 X 3% is 24%. That means 1 in every four words is a keyword. Isn't that much? If it is fine with search engines, I will definately take you advice.

(Extract)"Here's some good reading:
Brett's Successful Site in 12 Months with Google Alone "

...I did read and thought it was very good advice.
However I don't really understand this sentence below.

(extract)Use the keyword once in title, once in description tag, once in a heading, once in the url, once in bold, once in italic, once high on the page, and hit the density between 5 and 20% (don't fret about it).

...What does the italic and bold do to the ranking?

Thanks for the tips so far.

jimbeetle

7:07 pm on Nov 27, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



Ahh, so you mean body text.

I am targeting more than 8 keywords in my main page, having about 8 X 3% is 24%. That means 1 in every four words is a keyword.

Look at it this way, no search engine really knows what your keywords are. In your case I have the feeling you might be targeting two or three different keyword phrases on your main page and are adding the densities together ("Buy Red Widgets" + "Rent Blue Widgets" + "Widget Making History").

If that's the case, don't worry about it, and actually don't worry about making the main page rank well for all the keyword phrases. Use the main page to support separate pages, each optimized for a specifice keyword phrase. Go from the general to the somewhat specific, then down to the very specific -- that's where you pick up most of your organic SE traffic.

If you haven't already, here you'll want to read Search Engine Theme Pyramids [searchengineworld.com]:

"It may be a shock to some, but the index page has very little SEO rankings value."

You can always do a simple one-page "Buy This!" site where the above doesn't apply. However, once you have more than one product, service, category, whatever, it's always best to build specific, targeted sub-sections and pages, depending on how much detail you have to get into.

...What does the italic and bold do to the ranking?

This is basically one way of actually telling an SE what words on a page you, at least, consider to be important. Some -- not much -- weight is given to bold and italic in some SE algorithms.

Of course, the best way to tell an SE what your page might be about is LINKS. If an SE sees a link on a page for "Widget Making History," it considers that a good indication that the page is somewhat, kind of, might be related to that.

Well, time to go out and play for awhile. Do your reading, pay attention to the basics. Build the solid foundation first and then tweak as you start start to see it work.

hulahoop

7:24 pm on Nov 27, 2004 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Hey jimbeetle,

Thanks for your help.
Really appreciate you pointing out those articles.
Really gems. Also will take heed on your advice and work hard.

dickbaker

10:35 pm on Nov 28, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Well, as long as someone else is asking questions, I guess I will, too.

I have certain product pages where I use the manufacturer's name and then the product they make. Let's say, Acme widgets.

On most pages, the word "Acme" is at around 12%, and "widgets" is about the same. On some pages I created today, though, "Acme" is at 20.8%.

Is that getting too spammy?

guitaristinus

11:13 pm on Nov 28, 2004 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



There are pages that will naturally have the same words repeated many times. Google will not penalize these pages for excessive use of these words. I don't worry about excessive keyword density when making pages.

ogletree

11:20 pm on Nov 28, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



The front page should not be a place to optimize for kw's and if you do one is the most. The front page is a place for PR distrobution. You need to dedicate one page per kw phrase. Do not worry about kw density it plays such a tiny role anyhow. It is good to get the phrase in as much as possible. Just make sure that you can still read the page without it looking bad. Remember you still got to convert this visitor. You can do better putting links to other pages on your site that use some the same root of your phrase. Also have those pages link back giving you an internal anchor text boost.

jimbeetle

11:20 pm on Nov 28, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



There are pages that will naturally have the same words repeated many times

The key word here being naturally.

If "Acme" is at 20.8% and the copy reads well, then there's no reason to worry. On the other hand, if you're simply plugging "Acme" into every conceivable spot you can, then, while maybe not tripping flags at the SEs, you might just chase visitors away because of poor, awkwardly phrased copy.

dickbaker

4:58 am on Nov 29, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



[Joe Pesci voice]
Ok, ok. I got one page for Acme Widgets, and links to every model of widget that Acme makes. I have links that say "Acme model 1028 widget," "Acme model 1029 widget," etc.

Is that spamming, or just natural item descriptions?

[/Joe Pesci voice]

ogletree

5:07 am on Nov 29, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



I keep my links to about 80 per page for sitemap pages and to about 10 for normal pages.

hulahoop

10:36 am on Nov 29, 2004 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Does that mean spiders don't look at all at kw density on the main page?..only inner pages?

guitaristinus

11:52 am on Nov 29, 2004 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



dickbaker,
Those are just natural item descriptions.

hulahoop,
Spiders look at kw density on every page.

ogletree

4:31 pm on Nov 29, 2004 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



Spiders read everything on a page. The problem is what does G do with the data once they got it. The spider has nothing to do with the SERPS they just collect data and throw it into a db. The algo is what we are concerened about. KW density plays such a tiny role in on-page SEO I would not worry so much about it when it can hurt your conversions so much.