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I got fully spidered by FreshBot on the 15th of this month. I'm not listed in the regular serps yet. I had #10 for my most important kw along with a couple of #1's for other kws. Well, like normal, it didn't last, got dropped. So, stupid-impatient-retarded-obsessive me went in and tried to change a few things on the page, hoping to get Freshy to come back. Well since then, I have NO idea what I did in the first place to get the ranks from before and I have changed the page so many times, that I am all lost. I've tried Brett's KW Density Analyzer, tested different %'s, tried different kw's, and all of the suggested tips.
NOW, Freshy decided to include me today, but now I'm on PAGE 12. So, I've really messed up a good thing, especially since the whole optimization thing confuses me in the first place. So here's the million dollar question..... :(
I have a Gateway PC, which has Adaptec's Go Back. What do you guys think of saving all of the other additions and changes I've made since the 15th - on to a cd, and set my pc to go back to the way it was ON the 15th. I think this would bring back the html for the version of my index page that ranked well. I'm a little nervous to try it, but could it be worth it?
Thanks guys once again,
Karen
I made that mistake once and started using a source code repository that keeps versions. This allows for the page comparisons mentioned above if big changes happen.
Just make sure you've backed today's content and the rest of your changed personal documents since that date
Also: the changes you made are all on page stuff. On page stuff does not account for that much of a difference in ranking. Keyword density etc are important, but I really doubt changes there drag you down from #1 to #120.
In other words: I doubt that changing the page back to the previous state is going to bring back the #1.
Make sure you have the keywords in headers, link text, etc. Work on the title. But most important for sure is external factors.
If I were you I would just try to have well optimised pages, not too much dingeling, not too much keyword stuffing, each age focused on one phrase and all of them optimized towards your main keyword ( if that keyword is worth targeting, brings targeted traffic and not just loads of stray traffic) and then work on links and content.
Ann
heini-
I haven't done one other thing though, besides on page stuff. No stuffing or spamming of any sort. Maybe a little heavy on density, but nothing that would get me in trouble. I understand what you say, but I don't see any other explanation from #1 to page 12.
Ann-
Actually when you use Go Back, all of your files do get reverted as well. I have used Go Back before, just not with a live site.
Well, I made a few minor changes and lightened up on density last night before bed, and Freshbot came back again this morning, so if my position isn't any better by this evening, I think I'm going to try the GoBack.
Anyone else have any opinions about Fresh Rank, and how much it has to do with the full index rank? I know some say that Fresh pages seem to get a boost, but it has to give a webmaster some clue as to where you might stand in the long run, I think.
Thanks everyone for your input,
Karen
(p.s. I shoulda just went on a 4 week vacation after finishing my site in the 1st place...lol)
I save pages on my hard drive in a folder with the date. I hardly ever make any big changes all at once, just little bits at a time when needed.
Same here... in addition, any observations that I identified during a previous update and/or identified by WebmasterWorld members...
I add a new folder with an advance date of about 3rd or 4th of the month (after the dance), make all changes that cover many pages here and upload on the date I previously assigned.
The added advantage of refresh bot allows you to quickly identify workable solutions (on major chances) without getting struck across the board on a less adequate observation, or needing to wait a month to revert to a previous solution.
The Gateway my brother owns is always having operator troubles and i have had to use the go back several times....hmmmm, seems I remember his dial up information reverting so maybe it will do what you want.
My restore function on this HP works like I said...no files changed but any recent software you may have downloaded, saved or software installed, even virii are wiped out,(all mentioned activity performed after the date you reverted too).
Ann
Unless you know of specific things that you changed that might have hurt your position, I'd wait until after the dance.
Of course, I'm still naive enough to believe that if we concentrate on providing useful content to our sites, Google's algorithm will give us the position we deserve. While this is not always the position I'd like to have, I've had few causes to complain about Google.
While some tweaking can help our positions, the thing that can hurt it the most (short of no useful content) is over-optimization.
My sites were doing better before I became aware of site optimization. On my main site, the first time I checked with Google, I was a PR7. With a lot of hard work and skillful tweaking, I've managed to bring it down to a PR6. I think I'm going back to adding content.
A drop in PR can have many causes, but not onsite tweaks.
Onsite optimisation can get your pages rank significantly higher.
Adding useful content anyhow is a prime method of promoting a site. It also makes the likeliness of getting inbound links much higher, which in turn will increase PR, which in turn is the best basis to get higher ranking.
My sites were doing better before I became aware of site optimization. On my main site, the first time I checked with Google, I was a PR7. With a lot of hard work and skillful tweaking, I've managed to bring it down to a PR6. I'm going back to adding content.
This really isn't caused by you per say. Almost all sites drop in PR as a natural net wide drop unless a site had a rapid increase in links from previous updates.
I doubt your SERP's and traffic dip as a result either?
hmmm... heini beat me again. ;)
>> This really isn't caused by you per say. <<
Yes, I know. I was being somewhat facetious, my point being just that a concentration on adding content is more likely to increase both my PR (in that more sites will link to mine) and my standing in the SERPS than any amount of tweaking I might do.
Jim
Yes, I know. I was being somewhat facetious
HeeHee ;) ...and look what that got you!
Ok, one more question :)
(Reminder - I'm NOT in the regular index yet, should be this update though)
Was just checking my pitiful fresh ranking, and it's in the same place, Page 12, BUT the fresh date is gone. No date, not there. It just says cached & similar pages. Now I was under the assumption that only fully indexed pages were without the date. Like in my situation where I only get fresh listings, I shouldn't be in there with no date. This is the very first time that the date has disappeared on me, and I've been in there a few times.
Can anyone explain?
Karen
On page stuff does not account for that much of a difference in ranking. Keyword density etc are important, but I really doubt changes there drag you down from #1 to #120.
Actually, I have some pages I've created that went from being in the fifties to seventies to being number one simply by changing the title.
Depending on what kstprod did he might have caused a huge drop in position as he said.
Btw. I think Karen must be a "she" with that name. :-)
Actually, I have some pages I've created that went from being in the fifties to seventies to being number one simply by changing the title.Depending on what kstprod did he might have caused a huge drop in position as he said.
...and you need not do anything at all, and receive the same results since many others chance things regularly.
It's extremely difficult to guage any change you make effectively. You believe that "this" caused it when it could be "that", but without the knowledge of what "that" is... it is still mere spectulation.
It's extremely difficult to guage any change you make effectively.
Good point fathom, and the situation is complicated by the fact that we rarely have the leisure to make one change at a time and patiently wait to see what happens. There are few opportunities for controlled experiments.
You believe that "this" caused it when it could be "that", but without the knowledge of what "that" is... it is still mere spectulation.
In the case of my title changes, I've been able to move beyond speculation by repeating the experiment on a number of pages. I've advised a number of buddhist webmasters to make changes to their titles, and they've had dramatic increases in their rankings with the following reindexing. It's nothing magic -- it's just that they weren't optimizing very well in the first place. But Google places enormous significance in titles, I've found.
It's a shame that tweaking titles is not all there is to SEO, or my own site would be doing better than it currently is :)
Well, I made a few minor changes and lightened up on density last night before bed..
As of today, my fresh listing went from page 12 to page 14 and all I did was change a few of the Meta kw's and lighten the density. Yesterday, my density was 31.03% and I learned that Google likes lower density, so I changed it to equal 15.38%.
Oh, I am so confused. I know now that this fresh rank doesn't have much to do with my more permanant rank after the update, but it's important for me for now, what gives? I seriously am about to the point of giving up...
I guess I am just NOT getting this whole optimization thing and I'm getting more and more confused worrying about it and therefore inadvertently making my rankings worse. Is there a Google Optimization for DUMMIES site or book I can buy? lol
All afternoon yesterday and today, I have been learning about css and design, in regards to optimization. Could the following help me?
1. Switch my left side navigation to the right side, so that my main content is higher on the html.
2. Use css for font stuff, so my code is less bloated.
3. Have someone smack me upside the head and force all of the optimization info into my brain.
All kidding aside though, would #1 and #2 make optimizing a little easier for me?
I know you guys are probly sick of hearing me talk about this issue, and I'm very sorry, but I seriously will go insane unless I talk about it and figure it out. I have read through literally thousands of posts on here, and you'd think I would have gotten it by now...
Thanks again guys,
Karen (and yes I am a 'she'...lol)
No excuses needed. At least for some of us it helps a staggering self confidence to see that someone in this comunity seems to be more confused about SEO and Google. ;-)
Troels
(I'm listening to the late Karen Carpenter singing: "It's gonna take some time this time.")
Oh, I am so confused. I know now that this fresh rank doesn't have much to do with my more permanant rank after the update, but it's important for me for now, what gives? I seriously am about to the point of giving up...
Your subconscious is probably telling you to take a rest and wait to see what happens in a few days when the next update arrives :)
The changes you've made sound fine. Just unwind and see what happens next.
BTW, it worked! I just used Adaptec GoBack and created a temporary drive for the 11th, 12th, and 13th (because I'm not sure which day the good ranking pages came from). Then I zipped up all my html files for each date, saved them in their OWN folder, and deleted the temporary drives.
So, now I can go in and try to analyze what I did on those days that got me good rankings, and what I did that fudged 'em all up. ;)
Might be a useful tip to other people who mess up their ranks by changing html, that with Adaptec GoBack, you can go back into your drive for that day and save your files. Or, maybe I'm the only one who used to make changes and not save them...lol
Anyway, at least I now have something to work with. :)
Thanks again,
Karen
Is there a Google Optimization for DUMMIES site or book I can buy? lol
Beachboy summed it up nicely in another thread recently: (I took the liberty of adding the links myself)
So, in order to assure a first-place finish [webmasterworld.com], pursue top-notch optimization [webmasterworld.com], get a lot of PR [webmasterworld.com], and make sure every inbound link has the keyword or keyword phrase in it, without dilution [webmasterworld.com].
As for payment... this [webmasterworld.com] would be the appropriate place. :)
