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Do you think this could count as links to the page and therefore increase link popularity? I don't know the answer yet until the next google update. Some of the sites have PR of 5, 6 and 7.
This same math lesson applies directly if someone tries to tell you "I'll sell you a link from a PR7 page!" Besides the whole thin ice thing, you have to stop and ask "how many outgoing links are on this page?" If it's a lot of links, simple math is going to tell you that the PR7 link won't matter much. That's one of the many reasons why PageRank tends to work itself out without intervention, and one of the reasons why you have to think hard before you try to take shortcuts to get a better rank. :)
It's along the lines of buying a car: the monthly payment may be low, but you'd better pay attention to how many payments you've got to make. ;)
Say I currently have a PR3 sitemap page that has recently been linked to from a PR8 site, which itself has a dozen outbound links, including the one to my sitemap page.
My sitemap page points to several hundred interior pages, plus 8 links to sites on other domains.
The two-part question is, one, would the links on my sitemap page, which point to the interior pages (in the same domain), count as outbound links, and two, what would any one of the 8 sites that my sitemap page links to expect for a PR, assuming they were not linked to from any other site, and do not have any links to any other sites themselves?
Thanks,
R2R
When I a search on Google for "Find web pages that contain the term XYZ" there are lots of sites that show up that link to my site because
Witness you searched for "web pages that contain the term" not "web pages that link to".
Re buying ads for a PR boost - if these pages have many links which result in a negligible PR increase to your site, why would an ad buyer then be skating on thin ice?
Isn't that like trying to ban a site for trying to spam although the technique is known not to work? Does google currently do this?
I basically love google, I just don't mind stirring the pot occasionally. ;)
[edited by: dantheman at 12:37 pm (utc) on Sep. 4, 2002]
In fact if you do:
Find web pages that link to domain.com -
then none of the PPC links show up, becasue they are not directly linking to you.
Most PPC stuff only shows up under:
Find web pages that contain the term "domain.com"
hope that answers your PPC question.
Shak
1. Do links that go via affiliate networks such as cj.com add to the page rank of cj.com or the end merchant or neither?
2. Do links that go via a ppc search engine add to the page rank of the search engine, or the end site or neither?
Next, if a PR7 sitmap has 250 links, then I might expect it to give a PR4 or maybe PR5 to each page it links. Personally I would not do this, though.
I would like my high PR page to link to the few most important pages, and I would like each of those to link to the next most important, etc. This concentrates your PageRank on your most important pages, which is how PR is meant to work anyway.
Brett's Search Engine Theme Pyramids [searchengineworld.com] article shows how to do this in a way that may help future, theme based ranking methods to understand the context of each page.
profitpuppy, direct links will normally count if they're not robots.txt excluded and if they are from a page that is linked from elsewhere. Redirect links sometimes count, I think it depends on the PageRank in addition to the factors above.
If you try to punch me I'm not bothered if you connect or not, reaction will be the same :) Make sense?
The other point I didn't make is how it's interesting GG tried to play down the PR ad buy strategy due to bulk links. I'd argue if you happen to come across the network and commit to an ad, the odds are you'll know how PR gets passed on. You're only going to buy an ad on a page without an abundance of outbound links.
If you attempt to commit some crime and donīt succeed, you will still be held responsible, unless your trying was emtremely unlikely or impossible to succeed.
If you want to murder someone by shooting him and you just miss, itīs attempted murder. However, if you want to murder someone by painting a picture of that person and then destroying that picture, itīs not attempted murder because it is impossible to kill somebody that way. There was no thread to law and order.
So if it is common knowledge that the technique is known not to work it might at least be questionable whether thatīs attempted spam or not.
Besides the whole thin ice thing
My problem with this is, I buy text ads all the time. I don't buy them to increase PR (I bought them before I knew what PR was!). Text ads, to me, are more valuable on a high PR site, NOT because of the high PR, but because that site typically gets A LOT of traffic. How can Google decide why i'm placing a text ad?
Just doesn't make sense to me why I would potentially get penalized for putting an ad on a site that increases my sales!
Can anyone explain this to me?
Also, Googles reason for using links in it's algo is because a link from another site is considered a "vote" for the other site. Buying votes doesn't produce the best leaders in politics and doesn't produce the best results in SE's. So doing things like this reduces the effectiveness of the algo, which makes results in Google less relevant, which decreases the amount of traffic on Google, which hurts us all, because people may have to resort to M$N, where paying for listings is what it is all about.
there are other people whose reasons are not similar
Buying votes doesn't produce the best leaders in politics and doesn't produce the best results in SE's
I agree. Two small problems though.
1. How can Google say we are on "thin ice" if we buy a text ad? They cannot read minds, so they either penalize all, regardless of intent, or ignore us all.
2. I didn't ask Google to boost my rankings because of text ads. I am just trying to get sales/traffic, and I should not have to adjust that for a search engine.
[edited spelling :)]
I'd agree with that.
PageRank has a limited supply; all we're talking about here is diverting relatively small amounts of it. On the other hand, bad Public Relations can be created in limitless proportions.
Google don't want people to get the impression that their listings are manipulated. The advertising and discussion of PageRank for sale is far more damaging than a few text links.
Finally, I have an admission. I hope I don't get banned for saying this; I've been buying text ads [google.com] for quite some time.
If you try to punch me I'm not bothered if you connect or not, reaction will be the same Make sense?
I don't think so in every case.
Google has to weigh time vs. effectiveness. They can't do EVERYTHING to get rid of spam - as it takes too long and there isn't that much time - time that could be better spent on other things. Most people would say - repeating the same meta tags 75 times is "spam" - the chances of this working on google are about the same as me getting a date with anna kournikova. Why spend time penalizing when it doesn't work to begin with
There is also a problem with false positives. Repeated text, hidden text, hidden links, and almost ANYTHING you can name have a legitimate purpose. Tagging stuff like this will get rid of legitimate sites.
Anyway, I am kind of suprised GG gave the answer he did. Those listings aren't going to help you - and not for the reasons he listed - although I am glad he said that PR stuff.
In order for it to be pay per click - there has to be a way to measure the click (so that they can get paid). For this to happen - the link is usually 9 billion characters long and to the best of my knowledge - doesn't have a SCIH of getting credit.
The one I just checked had six amersands, seven equal signs and a question mark.
