Forum Moderators: open
I feel very strongly that until we have a good grasp on why it exists, it will be very hard to beat.
I don't buy the explanation that it's intended to be a method of stopping spam. Why? One, there's too much collateral damage it is doing. Two, if you accept the 80/20 principle (20% of spammers are doing 80% of the spamming), and you realize that there are multiple ways already of beating the sandbox that all of those spammers are aware of, it doesn't make sense anymore.
So, why does the sandbox exist?
The most obvious effect of the sandbox is that it prevents new domains (not pages) from ranking for any relatively competitive term. So, start thinking like a search engine - what would be the benefit of this?
we would be a lot better of if you used logic instead of believing what mfishy says.
I'd pretty much go with what mfishy says, but that's only because I put a lot of stock in people who know what they're talking about.
:-)
"How to avoid it" should lead to the "Why does it exist".
This line of thinking tends to make me feel stupid, so I hope it's wrong. I'm clearly not smart enough to figure it out. Fortunately I'm able to rationalize by telling myself that it's a waste of my time to try, because there are thousands in this community better qualified to get at answers like that than I.
But, here's the flipside: In the drug discovery business, it is often the case that researchers learn *what* works long before they learn *why* it works. Of course *why* is important - *why* helps fine tune, and often leads to other discoveries. But *why* is not a precondition for success.
This business strikes me as being a lot like the drug discovery business. And as mfishy points out, managing a lot of sites helps when it comes to figuring out *what* works, even if we're not always sure exactly *why.*
...it is pretty obvious that age is a significant factor in this algo..
We believe that age has been important for longer than people say, but it sure seems a lot more important now.
DaveAtIFG, fabulous post!
i'm disappointed in you cabbie. you can do better than this. tell me what facts you are refering to and let's have an intellectual discussion.
Part mechanical, part corrupted algo, which is why no one is able to figure it out.
Renee, what do you think? :-)
i'd say you're an i---t sweetie.
<<<which is why no one is able to figure it out.
I think I like your jokes cabbie, they make decent sense.
Somehow in these threads the word 'and' seems to get lost. Like it's only 'or' that can possible be true. Saying something is an antispam measure does not contradict anything, it's just one more 'and', it's an income booster and it's an antispam measure etc. And is a cool word. If something with more solid causes can then be tweaked to also become a sort of antispam measure that also helps boost income, hey, great!
what makes no sense however is the scenario of google saying 'hey, I know, let's totally drop what made us the number one search engine in the world, fast indexing, upto date results, the latest stuff available faster than anyone else and exchange that for a weird funky model that will expose us to potentially serious long term degradation of market share. It will be great, say with the upcoming election, with our 'lag' we won't have a single political website available that didn't start before 6-8 months before the election, that's a really great business plan, what do you think sergey?'
it's an income booster and it's an antispam measure etc.
I already made the point that no one in their right mind would suggest that to improve spam they should prevent ALL new sites from featuring in the results. To do so would be plain ridiculous.
I would suggest that the same thing applies to it being an income booster. Sure, many people may have been forced to subscribe to Adwords because their new sites have not appeared but this is not the way to do business. If the press got an inkling that this is what Google was up to they would tear them to ribbons, and rightly so.
This is so wrong that it has to be a defect. I believe that it exists because, for whatever reason, Google is broke and they cannot fix it right now.
I just hope that it gets the publicity it deserves. Surely there is someone here with enough influence to get this into the media? Let's hang it out to dry.
this is so obvious it's hard to believe anyone can't see it, all google is doing is trying to work through it, make the best of it, looks and feels like a series of patches implemented for different reasons.
I believe my example of a topical, political website, started 5-7 months ago, would literally not appear in the google serps until well after the election should be more than enough to demonstrate the total idiocy of this stupid lag, assuming the lag is a choice and not a necessity, which is a pretty bad assumption as assumptions go. Anyone who thinks this is somehow a good idea, or was made for solid programming reasons rather than being a severe symptom of a real defect... want a bridge?
[edited by: isitreal at 5:06 pm (utc) on Oct. 5, 2004]
I think that's a crazy thing to say, google would never do that, especially before xmas.
I mean it would be like, like errrrrr well, like last year!
Thanks hon! Except the secret code for 'intelligent' is 'i----------t'. You left out a few "---'s".
:-)
man, of course, you're totally right, what was I thinking. Pre IPO income rises dramatically, shares go for many times what they are worth... of course this was just a coincidence, all those shirts they brought in were just rearranging the cafeteria and parking assignments, man, how could I be so darned stupid?
caveman, why and what are both very powerful methods to use, most genetic engineering is focusing on the why currently in case you aren't keeping up with this stuff, 'traditional' western pharmacological type medicine more on the what, as you noted, both methods are good, but if you know why the what is very very easy to get to. If you don't, all you have is endless trial and error, this is why science always goes for the why through the whats. Traditional chinese medicine works much more off the why, that's why it's still here today, by the way.
[edited by: isitreal at 5:35 pm (utc) on Oct. 5, 2004]
