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Does it need to be a directory type of site?
Which kind of backlinks does it need to have?
I would like to build an expert site in my category, but i'm not sure what exacly i should place on it in order to google ident it as an expert site.
What do you guys think?
I would like to build an expert site in my category
Are you a true expert on the topic? When you ask the next question, it makes me wonder.
...I'm not sure what exacly i should place on it in order to google ident it as an expert site.
Uh... How about expert information on the topic? Links to other sites who discuss the topic. Reviews and feedback on the topic. Books about the topic. etc etc etc
Here's some stuff worth pondering about (I don't have an answer)
How do those other people declare you an expert?
Not by you declaring them an expert and they scratching your back. (reciprocals)
Someone who is not an expert or has no credibility cannot declare you an expert. (low quality links)
Can someone who has been declared an expert by another expert create one more expert? (distance of link from the authority expert site)
What's the determining factor in what the difference is, if any, between an "authority" site and an "expert" site?
The other part that the content plays is that it gives people a reason to link to you, and it gives a place for those deep links to go. While authority sites will have lots of links to the top page, they will have more than their share of links to deep pages.
And as the first reply stated, you really should be an expert on the subject if you are hoping for your site to gain that sort of status.
And don't expect to gain that status overnight. Instead, build a site on your subject, and then keep building it. Give the best, most unique information possible on your subject. Explain it better than anyone else.
That will give the community that deals in that subject some very good reasons to link to all your great content. Over time, those links will build. Then some of the other authority sites will notice you and link to you. And so on ...
That is all it takes. Good luck.
Since we are talking about expert "sites" vs. pages, as anyone considered the significance of deep links?
It strikes me that an expert or authority site would have many links to articles contained on interior pages, rather than everything to the index page. If I link to something on an .edu site, I am more likely to go to the page/article in question than I am to link to the main page.
WBF
[edited by: willybfriendly at 2:43 am (utc) on Aug. 10, 2004]
I agree content doesn't immediately make you an authority. But if you build content into something strong you will be working towards that authority status.
Strong content has a snowball effect.
How do you spot a loaded with information site, algorithmically.
There has to be an external factor, other than the amount of information which makes you an an expert.
BigDave, I agree with you in certain aspects. However, it does not always work out like how you put it. While you have good points, you leave several undefined areas..
How do you define community? Are we talking about a Teoma style definition or are we talking about forums and idle bloggers?
You mention "keep building content". You have to accept the fact that there is only so much you can say about (for example) bedsheets if you're a bed and bath store. Do you want the owners of these stores to turn into creative writers? Why wouldn't you be happy with just the manufacturer supplied information?
Now what seperates you as being the best bed and bath store when compared to Amazon? The 80s and 90s are filled with examples of how "the best" mom and pop shops got run over by the megastores and the cookie cutter chains like starbucks. Do you still think that hand crafted mom and pop sites (like you suggest, using the words build and write stand a chance algorithmically).
I'm NOT debating the value of original content. I'm trying to find out what are the algorithmic factors that make an engine belive you're an authority or an expert on an area.
Even if you get perceived as an expert today? What prevents an engine from changing the rules of the games?
(Random thought....)
Politicians rezone and change the rules about who can vote, all the time. Search engines do that too....
How you link, depends on who you are. Different sites link differently.
1) Dmoz will only link to the home page (unless you're epinions -- sorry had to say that). There is usually one sentence in the proximity of the link which defines the context of the link.
2) Specialist directories might link into departments. Usually you might get a sentence or a paragraph with this link.
3) A bloggers and people who actually write content on the other extreme might link deep and to the home page and more (>Company so and so< has these >incredibly cool widgets< that I happened to see in a >store on high street<).
4) CNN.Com / BBC type sites (not sure.. do they still do this) provide a related website with articles. Usually to the index page of a well choosen site.
All of these are authority / expert votes. Which one can you algorithmically isolate? 1 and 4 cannot be err ... automagically created but need human vetting. The effects of 2 and 3 depends on their own authority / expert status.
From where I stand, there are certain areas where the expert / authority definition falls apart.
We define an expert page as a page that is about a certain topic and has links to many non-affiliated pages on that topic. Two pages are non-affiliated conceptually if they are authored by authors from non-affiliated organizations.
...We believe a page is an authority on the query topic if and only if some of the best experts on the query topic point to it.
How do you spot a loaded with information site, algorithmically.
By the size and number of files, along with other stuff that I don't know about.
Mind you this would only be one factor in the calculation.
There has to be an external factor, other than the amount of information which makes you an an expert.
Of course there is. Read the part of my post about the sort of linking that content would naturally lead to.
They aren't looking for a site that was set up to be an authority by an SEO, they are looking for factors that would make the site look like a real authority.
BigDave, I agree with you in certain aspects. However, it does not always work out like how you put it. While you have good points, you leave several undefined areas..
Of course I did. I was only posting on content and the bits that are related to it. I'm not going to get into my whole theory every time this comes up. Anyway, I don't work for Google, so it is only an educated guess where I consider how I would write the code if google would open an engineering office outside of metropolitan hellholes.
How do you define community? Are we talking about a Teoma style definition or are we talking about forums and idle bloggers?
I am talking about the real life community of people that are involved in the field. The people that run the other websites. The people that do the research. The people that are obsessed with the subject.
Some of them will be on listservs or forums about the topic, some of them will have real live events where you go and meet them in person.
You mention "keep building content". You have to accept the fact that there is only so much you can say about (for example) bedsheets if you're a bed and bath store. Do you want the owners of these stores to turn into creative writers? Why wouldn't you be happy with just the manufacturer supplied information?
Stores will almost never be able to have a high authority-like score. It is not their job.
On the other hand, a true authority or expert on sheets could bore you to death by talking about the different cottons that are grown around the world, different processing and different weaves. And don't forget the dyes and how they hold up to washing and whether they can cause allergic reactions.
You may not believe that it is possible, but you would not believe how long some conversations have been that I have had with sock makers. But all the wonderful information that they love to share would cause the average sock buyer to have their eyes glaze over. But, if that sock buyer was having problems with pressure points caused by the toe seam, the report on the companies that have come up with a nes sewing or knitting method to eliminate that seam might just be incredibly interesting.
The authority site is the site that those stores will point to when it comes to any sorts of questions about toe seams.
Now what seperates you as being the best bed and bath store when compared to Amazon? The 80s and 90s are filled with examples of how "the best" mom and pop shops got run over by the megastores and the cookie cutter chains like starbucks. Do you still think that hand crafted mom and pop sites (like you suggest, using the words build and write stand a chance algorithmically).
What does any of this have to do with building and expert or authority site? Amazon certainly is not an authority site. It is a very rare store that would qualify.
What I am suggesting is that building an expert site takes a lot of knowledge, a willingness to share that knowledge, and the opionon of others that you are an expert. All of this takes time and effort. It has noting to do with stores, megastores or mom and pop stores.
And you have no guarantee of succeeding even if others seem to think you are an authority. Just like everything else, Google may just decide that they do not like you for some other reason.
But I do believe that a single person can hand craft a site that will be considered an authority. There are people on this board that have done it. In fact, I would bet that a very large percentage of the authority pages out there are put together by people that are obsessive about the topic instead of those that are just trying to make money off of it.
Even if you get perceived as an expert today? What prevents an engine from changing the rules of the games?
Nothing.
But just like with everything else in site design, being well rounded helps protect you from such things. And the site of a real world expert would probably naturally have most of the features that would be in the new algo too.
The luck aspect is that you are frotunate enough to have someone from an authority site link to your site. OK if your site is on bed sheets I suppose it might not be too difficult. But if it's in a slightly more crowded area not all the sites are going to be able to achieve this status even if they all have great content.
The closed shop point is this seems to favour sites that have been around a while from the days when the web was a little less crowded. You could say these sites have been in the game a long time and have built up quality content etc. This does not seem to always be the case. I know sites (as you probably do) that started as the original regional guides for my area. They had loads of content about what to do and where to go. Now however, most of the content is stale and they are simply glorified affiliate sites. But because of their "authority" status they are untouchable.
I don't know what the solution is but I'd like to see a more level playing field for those of us who weren't back there in '96!
1) Dmoz will only link to the home page (unless you're epinions...
Not true at all but truly funny.
The problem with the whole authority/expert thing is it isn't really fair i.e. there is a pretty large element of luck in it and also it has maybe turned things into more of a closed shop.
So? It isn't supposed to be fair. It is supposed to show sites that have attained a certain status. A status that is not available for everyone to attain.
It also is not the only way to rank well. It is also rated on a scale, like PageRank. It is not an on/off switch. So a store can have a higher authority-like status than another store, but it is not likely to have a higher authority like status than the manufacturer.
It would probably also be a bad plan for stores to try and rank well on the hub-like score.
What a store might want to do is to try and rank towards the top of all the stores in the sector in both the authority-like and hub-like scores, while not becoming either an authority or a hub. You just want to rank in the top half of your sector on each factor and you will do very well.
And complaining about the advantage of the sites that have been around a long time, and their natural advantage, is being unrealistic. Old stores have a natural advantage over new stores. Part of being an authority on something is being around long enough for others to learn that you do indeed know what you are talking about. New graduates can rank well on the "smart kid" scale, but they will rarely come up when there is discussion of authorities on an issue.
