Paid Ads and Rankings

[erich17]

Up until 6 weeks ago I had a #2 position at Google for "widget" keywords and related....and had held these positions for over 3 yrs.

Several times during that time I had brief periods where my site would be dropped but it always came back.

This time I couldn't afford the loss in income so I started running Google ads.

Since I did that and google has sucked me into paying literally thousands of dollars... my rankings have not came back.

Why should they...Google is all about making money now and why would they allow a company paying them thousands (over $10,000 per month) rank well again and take the chance on losing the ad campaign.

Of course I emailed them and they denied their is any relation to paid ads and losing rankings.

They also denied that my site was penalized. They said my positions were lost due to normal Algo changes.

I asked them this for which they couldn't reply?

1. How can a normal algo change drop a number 2 site under a competetive keyword phrase to being completely gone on ALL keyword phrases related to that?

2. How can a normal algo change drop a site with over 300 quality backlinks from separate domains to ZERO backlinks from ZERO domains? They essentially wiped out the credit for all my backlinks on their search engine.

3. How can a normal algo change drop a site from being updated in the cache every 2-3 days to once every 5-6 weeks?

4. How can a normal algo change drop one site optimized at #2 (and very similar than all other sites in top 20) and keep all the other sites right there in the rankings who aren't using paid ads?

Google has become very very sneaky in how they do business.... and regardless of what they tell you there are people behind the scenes manipulating the sites normal rankings for their own income benefit!

If they can get $10,000+ per month out of a small opperator like me...just think of how many other there are all over the world in all the different phrases that they are manipulating the same way they have done me.

Yes at first I was niave and thought this couldn't be happening...but after I added up all the factors...there was no other conclusion to be made!

[Brett_Tabke]

A fairly common set of questions and I can't answer them all, but it sounds like you were filtered for cross linking (one of the older filters that Google has).

1: very easily. You may have lost a critical link somewhere that was previously proping your entire site up in the rankings.

2: cross linking. Not uncommon for google to nuke a whole set of cross linked sites [google.com].

3: freshbot updates are based on pr. It sounds like you lost your pr, and thus lost your freshbot updates.

4: nothing to do with the other sites, and everything to do with 300 back links that were discounted.

Get more backlinks from more diverse and higher quality sites and I'd bet your site could come back in short order.

I've yet to see any evidence that g cross checked ads to listings.

[Ledfish]

In short for those having a tough read, what erich17 is suggesting is that those who buy adwords will be effected negatively in the regular serps.

This is a conspiracy theory that has been around for a while. I too have also been a believer in it.

People say it isn't so, GG says it isn't so, yet I have never found anything official saying it isn't so. If Google would issue something official, then most likely I would remove it from the back of my mind completely.

Because, if at some point, some lawyer feels he can prove it, most likely he would want to profit handsomely by way of a class action lawsuit and my guess is that if proven in court or even settled out of court, that the amount would be so staggering that most likely Google would be out of business. No doubt, it would be the largest amount ever for a class action lawsuit.

I can't imagine that Google, with all it's PHD Talent would do something that absolutely stupid. Then again, we have lately seen all kinds of corporations, big corporations, doing some really stupid stuff lately out of sheer greed and Googles silence can only make you wonder.

Here in the US, Lawyers have become legalized extortionists, so it really surprises me that a lawsuit hasn't happened yet. I think it's really a ticking time bomb, just like the tobacco suits where.

[Leosghost]

At the risk of being told by everyone including Brett that my 2cs worth is rubbish ..?

I would have thought that the important point would be just where did you place your new ads...

If the results from the last 6 months are any guide you only needed to put 4 on your own site to ensure that they never would "lose" you....

In all except one of my own categories ..8 from 10 of the first page sites are running "ads" ( they are all zero content aff' dirctories ).....

The other two sites are ..

One of them is mine ...and I 've had to make it sooooo
spammy just to hang in there that I'm ashamed of it...even though it ought to be there due to content ( tried just that alone ..wound up on page 18!)

The other is in each case an invisible text ,text in no frames, redirect , cloaked .....you name it they're doing it ..one word title with the same alt text etc etc .....
BUT ....The back link ( there is only the one ) is from *bay .........

So ......?

[erich17]

Brett

Thank you for the input! I honestly didn't even know what "cross linking" meant. I had to look it up...and didn't know there was anything wrong with it?

Anyway, I removed every single cross link from all the pages I own. Do you think that will get Google to give back my link credits?

Should I email them?

Thanks

Erich

[Ozdachs]

Since February I have had clients with AdWords and without AdWords drop from the top 5 into the black hole. None have cross links with other sites – they are independent small businesses for which we got inbound links from third-party professional associations, chambers of commerce, tourist bureaus, etc.

I would not do major reworks of your pages based on what might or might not have caused Google to drop your site. First, I truly don’t think there are new rules to follow that pass any test. They are simply reactions and reiterations of general good practices that should work. Second, I have started using other search sites for my personal searches because Google is just not giving me information like it used to. I assume that I am not alone in starting to supplement Google searches.

Of course, I still am looking for a theory that truly explains the real world inconsistencies I see in Google’s SERPs. In fact, looking for ideas that match what I am seeing at Google is why I’m spending so much time here!

[John]

I thought I was alone on this one.

We sell "red widgets" and red widgets only to people who need red widgets and put exactly that term into google on about 85% of occassions they search. We used to be in the top few pages on Google for exactly this two word term plus hundreds of derivatives.

Yesterday I drilled down 300 pages! basicaly until my little monitor tool blanked out and we are gone from Google on this term. But they are still taking my my
money to put up my Adword in position 4 for Red Widget.

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and sounds like a duck.......

I think we have to believe the evidence of our ouwn eys on this one. Google has decided to play where the money is and has blanked access to the obvious search terms in order to make vendors scrabble about and burn money trying to find their way back to where the punters are.

The dumbest part is that punters are still putting in red widgets but we aren't "allowed" to be represented where they expect us to be.

"He who controls the information controls the show"

Joseph Goebbels.