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The New Google?

     

aek

8:11 am on Jul 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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1. The continuous google update has began and there will be no more monthly updates.

2. Pagerank is all but finished, and in the next toolbar update it will be removed.

3. Incoming links will be changed once in a while but will have no affect on the SERP's due to no.1

What does everyone think to 1,2 and 3?
Yes, No or maybe?

8:38 am on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Let's look at this first, before going any further:

2. Pagerank is all but finished, and in the next toolbar update it will be removed.

How can PR be finished, when it's the very foundation of Google? And how do we know that there will ever again be a "next update" in the same sense that we've come to know updates?

Then, secondly:

1. The continuous google update has began and there will be no more monthly updates.

Quite possibly, and it sure does look that way, doesn't it? But let's face it, that doesn't preclude the inclusion of PR as a pertinent factor, and for that matter anchor text, in computing a given page's position in the SERPs.

We'll all need to be very careful in the assumptions we make, more so than ever before.

10:13 am on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Pagerank is all but finished, and in the next toolbar update it will be removed

We do know that Google is updating on a regular basis now, but what about the PR factor. When do you speculate that it will update: once a month as previously or perhaps in future, more frequently & possibly weekly.

10:20 am on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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there is no true continuous update yet.

A traditional update will be coming any day now.

All you see is a deeper freshbot.

10:21 am on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Pagerank is all but finished, and in the next toolbar update it will be removed.

If the Pagerank bar-o-meter was removed - why would anybody install the Toolbar?
10:21 am on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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That's the $64K question - how will PR be updated? Will it be done as it always has been, except for being done on the fly based on calculating inbound links on a constantly updated basis? Or will it be done periodically as it was all along?

Will it be done in a segmented fashion, based on broad sectors of keyword sets a section at a time? How close are we coming to seeing topical PR calculations?

Now that we can no longer see anything, anything at all is possible - and how will we know if major changes happen down the road, or even if they're happening right now?

10:29 am on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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most of people instaled toolbar becasue of PR check and qucik search tool.Me too.But if they remove this feauture i still might use it - since it has now very good pop up blocker.smart move google.

but here is my question - is pr check even remotelly usable now? my site is back to results but pr is 0 for all pages.then i have one good site and 3 months old new pages have pr 0 too.also tons of sites i visit have pr 0 and they are in top results..so the main reason why i use PR tool(to check pr on sites that i will link to or they link to me) is no longer reliable - that is so for FEW months now.

so:

1.yes, no more monthly updates
2.could be.

[edited by: JonB at 10:30 am (utc) on July 30, 2003]

10:29 am on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Why do you think PR will change its way of updating as it is now. It does not affect the google searcher as much as the most updated files do which would be reflected by a continuous rolling update.

If PR really is a method of evaluation no matter how controversial all methods of evaluation take time, and points need to be earned over that time.

10:37 am on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Seems like each question about Google only raises more questions in turn.

Dave

10:49 am on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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It is only 5 1/2 weeks since the last proper update.

This came following some very turbulent times and a few weeks after this, SERP's returned to something like normal.

When I say normal, I do not mean just my own rankings.

Hence, I feel it is too early to suggest there will be no normal update, it might be just around the corner!

PR & backlinks have to be factored in - when they are SERPS will change.

Yes, SERPS have been fluctuating over the past week or so, but what's new with that - things have been moving around for months now.

My opinion, Sit tight and wait!

11:09 am on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I really have no clue what's going on right now. I know they did bring in some backlink data the last couple days. You can check it using the allinanchor.

One of my websites had zero backlinks so I added about 50 links (pr4 and above) a week after the last update, all having the same anchor text. Starting yesterday, if you do a allinanchor: search on the keywords in the anchor text it ranks very well. But when you do a link: search on that page it stills says zero.

Same thing on another one of my websites.

11:19 am on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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>>> there is no true continuous update yet. A traditional update will be coming any day now. All you see is a deeper freshbot.

I'd be inclined to believe this. There has been way too much deep crawling and nowhere near enough SERP shifting for the equation to balance. IMO the up coming update will be the "daddy" of updates, it will once and for all correct all errors and problems lots of members have been mentioning in these forums and that will mark the beginning of the continuous rolling update.

I bet GG will reappear then as well.!

Discalaimer: The above is pure speculation.

12:11 pm on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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IMO removing the PR from the tool bar can bring about a major positive effect on Google. Why?

Whilst no Webmaster would want to see it go (what easier way can there be of finding sites that may positively impact on your own PR and therefore promote you up the rankings) the PR bar is being manipulated by webmasters that purely pin point sites (whether relevant or not) to link to for the relevance and therefore power of site's page rank.

If you are not able to see the PR bar (even though the PR is still very much alive) then more and more webmasters will be forced to generate links with sites that provide relevant and useful content that YOU believe will add to your site.

You will always be able to see the backlinks and therefore have a good idea of what's good and what's not but at least everyone will need to do a bit more research - thereby benefitting those willing to put the time in (this could be very bad for me as I have too much work already?)

What does everyone else think?

;)

12:35 pm on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I have a new site that has tooons of high PR backlinks and it is nowhereville - if backlinks were being factored in continuously then the site would already be in the top 10.

It has not moved at all - it is still in 400 range.
It has been 2 weeks now.
This is all the proof I need.

12:47 pm on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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No one knows what is happening and what will happen (except Google of course). We've all got theories (some wild some sensible). It makes us feel better if we exchange and debate our theories. Its frustrating but perhaps more realistic to say 'I don't know whats going to happen, when it happens I'll look into it'.
12:49 pm on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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The continuous google update has began and there will be no more monthly updates.

I believe that Google ranking is based mainly upon links back, and as far as I can see there is no continuous update with the links back. So I have to disagree with this assumption.

aek

1:51 pm on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Numbers 2 and 3 were just slightly educated guesses on my part and are probably wrong. But I believe number 1 is happening. Of the 3 sites or mine I watch regularly. The one that I have added incoming links to over the last few weeks has steadily climbed up, the other two that have stayed the same have moved slowly down the ranks. I also know of a particular site that shows very strong evidence for this. If anyone wants it please stickymail me.
4:24 pm on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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If the Pagerank bar-o-meter was removed - why would anybody install the Toolbar?

Have you used toolbar 2.0 beta? The pop-up blocker is simply AMAZING! I have never used a pop-up blocker as good as google's new toolbar, I install it on all my computers and it has blocked thousands of popups for me. I think there are more people who use the toolbar than just us starving SEOs. But still... I agree that they won't get rid of PR meter.
4:27 pm on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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>1. The continuous google update has began and there will be no more monthly updates.
>2. Pagerank is all but finished, and in the next toolbar update it will be removed.
>3. Incoming links will be changed once in a while but will have no affect on the SERP's due to no.1
>What does everyone think to 1,2 and 3?
>Yes, No or maybe?

1. NO - I expect a normal update soon.
2. NO - Page rank will continue to play a role.
3. NO - If not link text of incoming links then what?

4:30 pm on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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> If the Pagerank bar-o-meter was removed - why would anybody install the Toolbar?

I use the Mozilla version even though it doesn't include Pagerank.

4:40 pm on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Have you used toolbar 2.0 beta? The pop-up blocker is simply AMAZING! I have never used a pop-up blocker as good as google's new toolbar, I install it on all my computers and it has blocked thousands of popups for me...

You need to stop surfing those adult sites... LOL ;)

5:25 pm on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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1. The continuous google update has began and there will be no more monthly updates.

As someone already mentioned, what we're seeing now is a very powerful freshbot that's acting like a deepbot.

I still expect at least one or two more traditional monthly updates.

Although I still don't think Google is totally switched to the new system, what we are seeing right now is somewhat of a continuous update. Personally, i'm impressed with what i'm seeing. But a lot of people seeem to hate it....

2. Pagerank is all but finished, and in the next toolbar update it will be removed.

As a webmaster I love being able to check pagerank on the toolbar. However I can certainly see good reasons for Google to remove it.

But what about the Google directory? For those of us with sites in DMOZ, we can still check our pagerank that way. So if Google were serious about keeping PR a secret, they'd have to alter the Google directory as well.

I doubt Google will make these changes.

3. Incoming links will be changed once in a while but will have no affect on the SERP's due to no.1

Backlinks and PR will be changed once in a while on the public end, but will be rarely updated and wont be a big concern for Google.

That's my guess.

5:37 pm on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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First, I agree that we have not started a continual update. I have seen overwhelming evidence to prove the oppisite. I am not really sure we will see one anytime soon. I just don't buy it.

The page rank bar on the toolbar is a way for normal searchers is a sort of trust meter. It is a good little tool to see how much a site can be "trusted". We as webmasters forget that the PR bar is not meant to show searp ranking, but to help surfers get an idea of how valued a resource is considered on the web. Sure we try to manipulate it, but it does give surfers an idea of what is hot and what is not.

9:22 pm on July 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

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>>No one knows what is happening and what will happen (except Google of course)

That's because google sucks. Face it, most of us are NOT happy with google anymore. I pray for another contender to step in and take some of their market share. They plainly don't deserve it anymore.
From the best search engine they became just another advertisign medium for advertisers. Their focus is now adwords and revenues and not providing the best search tool. THAT is obvious.
Go MSN go!

6:52 am on July 31, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I also believe that "The continuous google update has began". I got at least 1 new site up once a week, so pretty sure of this observation. You don't have to wait for one month before your site gets into the index and new site no longer appearing and disappearing in the serp as before Dominic. With good quality links to the new sites, you can get into G index pretty fast. The fastest one that I see takes only 3 days - perhaps faster than that.

PR toolbar and backlinks report do not seem to reflect the real situation, so perhaps these two would be updated periodically - just guessing once a month. As the time since last G dance till now is too short, we have not seen repeated behaviors of Google so it is premature to draw any concrete conclusion or observation.

8:08 am on July 31, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Some of the SERPS I am seeing would indicate that old links are no longer being counted.

Esmerelda still had links visible that were 2-3 months old and the SERPS reflected that these were still being counted - not now I don't think.

However, I am not of the opinion that NEW links are being counted yet.

Obviously just my opinion based on the SERPS changes I have seen the past week.

If anybody has any example of sites they strongly feel are having new - post esmerelda - links counted, I would be interested to see these- please sticky me

2:44 pm on July 31, 2003 (gmt 0)

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I find myself rooting for MSN too Luke. I think it'll give the market a push. Interested in seeing what happens with Northern Light as well.

mat

2:58 pm on July 31, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Haven't been in here for a while, but to find people looking to MSN as a saviour ... dear oh dear oh dear.
3:30 pm on July 31, 2003 (gmt 0)

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Haven't been in here for a while, but to find people looking to MSN as a saviour ... dear oh dear oh dear.

MSN can send decent traffic, sometimes more than Google. Some feel it also converts better. These findings have beeen echoed by others on the boards here.

The smart ones diversified a little and looked beyond the free google traffic. Pay attention to MSN, Looksmart, adwords, overture etc..

3:30 pm on July 31, 2003 (gmt 0)

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It pains me to hear anyone rooting for MSN. I think Yahoo has a better chance of competing with Google than MSN. At least Yahoo now has the technology to do it and I think they will make a run at it whenever the Google contract expires.
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