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For reasons unknown to me an editor has decided to list a small personal portal of mine in a category where it definitely does not belong... _and_ given it an uncorrect desciption... _and_ spelled its name wrong...
When I saw this I immediately used the form for changes to a URL and submitted a message expressing my desire to have the portal removed. That was a couple of days ago. So far nothing has happened.
As stated above I don't know how this editor has got the idea of listing my portal. I might venture a couple of guesses though.
1. Someone has submitted the portal to ODP. I consider this to be extremely unlikely, but I must admit that it's possible,
2. An editor has been surfing and found the portal and decided to list it. I have heard that such things do happen.
3. There are six websites on the portal. To of them are correctly listed in another category. One is listed in the mentioned category. Three are not listed in ODP. All of these three would belong in that same category where the editor has listed the portal. A couple of weeks ago I submitted one of them to ODP. It's possible that the editor has visited the portal and decided _not_ to list the submitted website but the portal.
I have to say that I do not like this situation at all. I am aware that if the editors of ODP decide to keep their listing of my portal in that category, then I can do nothing about it. And I have no wish to make those editors into my enemies. I would like to have the _websites_ listed and I don't think that my wish would be helped that way. But I am _very_ dissatisfied with this uncorrect listing and I am not going to just sit quiet and let them do it. If my speaking up will cost me the possibility of having those three websites listed, then so be it.
What should I do?
Should I send an e-mail to the editor, a person who in my opinion already has made an editorial mistake and shown incompetence? I simply do not trust this person. It is quite all right to show incompetence and make mistakes. I personally do that frequently :(. But if you make incompetent decisions that overrule the suggestions of competent people then you may expect them to speak quite openly about their disrespect for you.
Or should I write to an editor higher up? I don't like that possibility either. I feel that it would be going behind the editor's back.
Any advice?
PS. I might add that in the next couple of months I intend to put three more websites on the portal. This plan is several months old. None of these websites belong to the mentioned category. They will make ODP's listing look more and more ridiculous.
Any advice?
I would suggest you stop using words like "incompetance." It's a guaranteed way of making sure that what ever you're asking for won't get done.
As for the site itself what is the portal and what is the category? I have a hard time believing an editor put your site in a completely unrelated category.
You could always block Robozilla when it comes to check the validity of the link and it will raise a flag in the category.
If you want it listed in the ODP you could submit the site to the correct or more appropriate category indicating that it's already listed incorrectly elsewhere.
[edited by: engine at 6:30 pm (utc) on Jan. 19, 2003]
Possible. Anyone can submit a URL
>2. An editor has been surfing and found the portal and decided to list it. I have heard that such things do happen.
I'm an ODP editor. It is perfectly acceptable and normal to do this. In fact, when you apply to be an editor you *must* list at least 2 sites that you want to add to the cat.
>Should I send an e-mail to the editor, a person who in my opinion already has made an editorial mistake and shown incompetence? I simply do not trust this person. It is quite all right to show incompetence and make mistakes. I personally do that frequently . But if you make incompetent decisions that overrule the suggestions of competent people then you may expect them to speak quite openly about their disrespect for you.
One point here. Before you go flaming someone for incompetence, you really oughta make sure they were the one who did this. The editor who is listed in that cat is NOT the only one who can edit there. Any editor higher up the tree can edit in the cat, along with editalls and metas. In fact, it is not at all unusual for editors higher up the tree to edit in lower cats. And, if this was added by an editor on his own initiative, almost surely they would just directly add it themselves if they could, rather than kick it down to a lower editor.
Unfortunately, unless you happen to be an ODP editor no way of knowing exactly what editor added this. You need to submit this change request from the public submission form, as you have. The nasty thing here is with the ODP backlog, it often takes over a year for this to be looked at. Thus, the fact it has been a few days and nothing is done is typical.
I'd suggest giving this a few weeks, and hope something is done. If not, then try going up the tree to a higher editor. If this listing is as botched as you say, if I were the higher editor I'd immediately change it. Wrong cat, wrong site name, and incorrect description? I can't see any reason to hesitate acting if that were the case.
Yeah, this definitely isn't the best of ways to start a communications exchange. ;)
I would suggest you stop using words like "incompetance." It's a guaranteed way of making sure that what ever you're asking for won't get done.
I don't know...
If indeed the site is listed in the wrong category with an incorrect description and with the name spelled wrong, then the word "incompetence" seems fitting.
Either way, in my day, I was probably the most hardnosed editor in ODP, and even when insulted, would make changes such as those.
An editor who would ignore changes like those mentioned simply because he/she didn't like the choice of words would not be acting in the best interest of the directory...or anyone else, for that matter.
I hope you're wrong.
If indeed the site is listed in the wrong category with an incorrect description and with the name spelled wrong, then the word "incompetence" seems fitting.
Let's begin by with the fact that editors and submitters often disagree on title/description/placement issues. Just because a submitter want's a site in a certain category, with a certain title and description doesn't necessarily make that the be all and end all.
As for the editor being called incompetant. . if it was a borderline case then I sure as hell wouldn't make the changes. Ditto if I wasn't the one who listed the site in the first place.
If indeed the site is listed in the wrong category with an incorrect description and with the name spelled wrong, then the word "incompetence" seems fitting.
If I read the original posting correctly, it calls the (alleged) wrong category an editorial "mistake"; and troels_nybo_nielsen is cool about that sort of thing happening.
The incompetence charge comes from "overrul[ing] the suggestions of competent people". That is, either disregarding troels_nybo_nielsen's request to have the portal removed, or not yet having even read it.
As troels_nybo_nielsen sent the request just a couple of days ago, I'd say raising a charge of "incompetence" is a little early.
Unless we define "incompetence" as "not responding appropriately within a couple of days" -- in which case troels_nybo_nielsen has about 24 hours to comment on this thread before we can apply the term to him/her :)
As a European citizen myself, I am acutely aware that the original poster's first language is not English, so he may not be 100% aware of the exact usage of some words used in that posting. I have seen several people flamed for using slightly inappropriate words before; lets give people the benefit of the doubt if their first language is not English. Let's not focus on the usage of this one word, and the exact meaning, but rather on the site and the placement of it.
So lets leave that personal stuff and talk about what's happening here and what would be the best course of action.
The problem is an incorrect listing in the ODP can actually harm a site. As we all know an ODP listing carries a lot of weight on the web.
If I understand Troels problem right this listing is not only incorrect for the site listed, but is likely to prevent his other sites from being listed in the ODP.
First I must agree - waiting more than just a couple of days seems very reasonable.
A second step, after filling out the change form, would for me be mailing the editor of the cat, regardless if he made the listing or not. It's simply a question of courtesy. And yes, I'd be friendly and relaxed - no use to make a big fuss before it's neccessary.
Mistakes do happen and sometimes the directory software screws up. It could even be that the editor enterered the URL incorrectly and isn't referring to your site at all.
[edited by: NFFC at 6:26 pm (utc) on Jan. 19, 2003]
[edit reason] Per forum charter [/edit]
But that will have to wait, perhaps untill tomorrow. There is a life outside the Internet. And _on_ the Internet my first priority still is to create (and hopefully in a competent way) content for my websites.
I understand your worries. I presume you are referring to the effect a bad listing can have in the Google show-up.
In a way, a listing in a volunteer directory, is just another listing in a volunteer directory. Very little traffic comes through DMOZ and their clones.
Though with a bit of luck it passes through more than average Pagerank.
The problem with a wrong DMOZ listing lies in the fact that Google relies on it quite stronly. As far as I have understood it, Google takes the highest Pageranked (non-World) listing and displays that category when someone does a Google search for "mysite". Furthermore it uses the DMOZ description.
With Google's prominence on the web, this fact can lead to wrong impressions of your site to searchers, and this can last an undefined period.
It would be nice if you could submit a site at Google and temporarily opt out of the DMOZ category show up and description if you feel it does not cover the real meaning of your site.
The first person to contact would be the direct editor of that cat. He may not have been the one to list it, but is the most responsible for handling problems. Particularly in the case of sites that are initially submitted to the wrong cat, it isn't unusual if that editor has privs in both cats to just review it and add it. Thus we may have such a case here.
If the listing is a botched as is suggested here, I'd suggest doing both #1 and #2, and in the feedback mention you submitted an update. The problem is with updates those will sit in the queue alongside of new submissions. With the backlog at the ODP, things can easily sit in the queue for well over a year. Personally as an editor I'd consider correction of blatant errors in listed sites as higher than handling a new submission. If his site really is in the wrong cat, with the wrong title, and also the wrong description, I'd say that is a priority. For example, if in the cat for California substance abuse centers I edit if I was told that listed there was [webmasterworld.com...] as "Weeebmastre Wurld", and the description was this site was about blowing soap bubbles, I'd think such would deserve prompt attention. ;)
We don't care about search engines (who, after all, pull their descriptions from your site when they spider it).
A DMOZ description is for directory viewing, not for search engine keyword searches.
For all those concerned about the quality of descriptions in human edited directories, I have a suggestion.
In a company or about us page, why not write your own short, non-promotional description with a request that those linking to your site with descriptions can use it.
I only speak for myself, not for DMOZ, Mozilla nor any other editor in any other human powered directory, but I can tell you if something like that was available I would at very least read it, possibly use it...provided it fits the guidelines for the listing I am editing.
If you want something done right....do it.
