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lost AV #2 rank



9:26 pm on Oct 13, 2000 (gmt 0)

We were listed for about 3 weeks on AV at the #2 spot and POOF we're gone as of this week. We can't find where we went to and when checking rankings, we're not even in the top 50. Anyone else having this problem?


10:02 pm on Oct 13, 2000 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member

They just had an update at the beginning of the week so alot of positions got shuffled. Do a search for your domain name to make sure your still in their database, if you are, it's time to go back to the drawing board and try some different optimization.


10:03 pm on Oct 13, 2000 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member

Oh....and welcome to Webmaster World Miss Reddy!


10:13 pm on Oct 13, 2000 (gmt 0)

Thanks, Seth. This is all very exciting and interesting to me. I'm learning so much. I got on the internet and computers 2 years ago and am fascinated by it all. Can you recommend newsletters,etc. to keep on top of a lot of this?


10:24 pm on Oct 13, 2000 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member

The only free newsletter I recommend is here [searchengineworld.com]. A good paid newsletter is Planet Ocean's [searchengine-news.com] but if I were on my own and the company didn't pay for it, I wouldn't spend the money.


11:41 pm on Oct 13, 2000 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member rcjordan is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member

[originally posted by Seth deleted duplicate and both went -RCJ]

You'll always find the most current information in the forums, but it is definitely a good idea to keep up with the newsletters.

I'll have to agree with James on his selections, I make it a point to always read both of those front to back. (if you subscibe to PO make sure you take a look at the unfair advantage book)

Here's a couple more with short critiques
aim-pro [aim-pro.com] Good info (I'm biased), but as of lately it's rarely sent out
market position [webposition.com] Geared mostly towards beginners, if you stay active in the forums then you'll know most of this stuff before the newsletter is ever sent out
se watch [searchenginewatch.com] similar to the marketposition newsletter, might be a tad more advanced


10:21 am on Oct 24, 2000 (gmt 0)

I would say that this forum is the best source of information that I have found. I think that the "Unfair Advantage" book is very informative and impressive in scope and detail, but lacking in some basic and important pieces of information. For example, they don't give clear guidance on the amount of text (AltaVista), keyword density and other important details. It is very strong on theory and esoteric information, but short on some key details and "how to" instruction.

In a business that changes this fast, stick to the forum.


8:44 am on Oct 25, 2000 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Administrator brett_tabke is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month

The big thing on density and page building is diversity. They are changing the algo's so often at the se's, you just can't build a page that will survive the changes week to week.

One time a big page with high density will rank well, and the next the small page. You have to build diverse pages and sites to do well in Alta over the long haul.

I am running under the 100pages of diverse html theory. I think it takes 100 pages to build a site today. Those hundred should stick to your core kw's and related phrases while spreading out the optimization across all of them. Have 10 pages in the 30k range with varying degrees of density. Have 10 pages with the kw in the title. Have 10 without it in the title. 10 more with it in the heading - 10 without. 10 with high density, 10 with low...etc.

Only that type of a site is going to survive the ups and downs (whims) of the algo. Better to have 100 pages that each pull 2 referrals a day, than have a 5 page site where each pulls 20 per day.


10:32 am on Oct 25, 2000 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member marcia is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member

Hi, missreddy! I got on the net a while before you did, but have been "addicted" for two years. I have to agree that it's exciting, with something to learn every day, and forums have been my primary resource for just about everything I've been learning.

I've also found it very helpful to print out articles that I've found helpful, as well as printing out forum posts that have a lot of relevant info. The "printable version" option at these forums is a very user-considerate feature, too.

If you haven't already found it, here are some articles covering some basic principles that are a "must print":


It's all good, but pay special attention to the step by step tutor.

I'm very partial to crafts and gift type sites, and yours caught my eye - you have a wonderful diverse selection.

Can I ask if you were listed at AV under an individual keyword or a multi-word phrase?

Another question for you--can you use subdirectories where you're hosting? I ask because AV has been very kind to me with subdirectories on product-related sites.


4:00 pm on Oct 25, 2000 (gmt 0)

Thanks for your reply and your compliment of my webstore, Marcia. Re: Your ? on keyword listing: I was coming up on the first pages using: fruit baskets (7), gift baskets (2), etc.. So, it would seem that these are more keywords than multi-word phrases. I do try to use more more multi-word phrases as my keywords, though.

I'm hosted by Yahoo!Store and I'm not sure what you mean by sub-directory, so I can't answer your 2nd ? . You may know if Yahoo!Store has this and that will tell you. Will you please let me know if you find out? Thanks.

PS: Thanks for your reply, too, Brett. Good info.


4:12 pm on Oct 25, 2000 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member nffc is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member

Hi missreddy,

Can you tell me if and when you resubmitted the page/site to altavista?


5:02 am on Nov 17, 2000 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

Hi all,

Our company has been representing clients for about two years now in SEO campaigns. We have found that our positions are only improving on AV. Submissions from 4 months ago has just been indexed. We're going with the theory that two databases are used on a periodic time schedule. When searching for positions, make sure its the same time of day for the most accurate results. data base 1 has the most indexed pages whilst, database 2 has older pages but positions alter depending on the data base in use.

This will explain fluctuations in positions and listed one minute, taken off another, listed again.


1:46 pm on Nov 17, 2000 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

Hi Miss Reddy, regarding your question:

Some time back, pages of mine taking up prominent listings were being bulleted out of the database after 2 -3 weeks

Either a competitor reported them and they were axed (probable in a competative industry)

OR: A check of sorts was performed after a period and these pages did not conform - result: dropped.

The profile of the page was a single gateway domain targeted at a specific key term. very little link pop and not much content to rave about.


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