Cash For Clunkers Seems Successful

they're talking about adding another $2 billion U.S.

[lawman]

Now if only they'd implement a program where those of us who don't qualify can get a $4500 tax credit for ANY new car we buy, the U.S. auto industry would go from being on life support to being insanely profitable. I know I'd rush out and get one.

[thecoalman]

Or better yet not take those taxes in the first place instead pretending to give you something that already belongs to you to begin with.

[lawman]

I think the tax credit would suit my purposes coalman. Consider the following:

lawman to Mrs. lawman:

"Honey I HAVE to buy that 2010 Mustang Shelby GT500 to save $4500 in taxes!"

;)

[swa66]

A tax break to buy a new car sounds an awful lot like subsidizing an industry that fails to adapt to modern times.

It might be far easier and cost effective to just give a tax break to all and let the consumers buy whatever they need most. That way the government doesn't put money in something that doesn't have a future anyway.
The big exception would be to put government money into something that's not yet viable on it's own but that has potential for being for the greater good, basically stuff that needs a bootstrap it's unlikely to get unless conditions become extreme (e.g. subsidize a distribution system for let's say hydrogen, something that's not going to happen on it's own unless the current fuel prices go through the roof, no not double, more like tenfold at least).

[lawman]

Y'all are making this thread more serious than I intended. Please continue. :)

[ken_b]

I'm waiting for the $4,500.00 credit for buying old cars...

I really NEED that 57 Corvette!

[StoutFiles]

It's not very successful for part recycling, they're crushing these cars and only an average of $80 per car can be salvaged. What a waste.

[jbinbpt]

lawman to Mrs. lawman:

"Honey I HAVE to buy that 2010 Mustang Shelby GT500 to save $4500 in taxes!"

But only after Jack Roush adds his seal of approval [roushperformance.com]

[lawman]

Roush, Steeda, Shelby, Saleen - I could live with any of 'em. :)

[dcheney]

lawman,

It could be worse:

Mrs lawman to lawman: I just HAVE to buy a new house to save $8,000 !

[lawman]

Haha, dcheney. But I have a binding agreement. 9 years ago or so I told her to pick out the house she REALLY wanted because I had no intention of ever moving again.

At least I think that's a binding agreement. ;)

[skibum]

It's one way to get old fuel inefficient cars off the road, get some $$ flowing through the economy and get the public to help keep the car companies afloat. Better than just flushing $$ down the AIG drain.

It seems there could be a lot of valuable parts in those cars that they seem to be simply destroying. Maybe they have to destroy them so there is actually something there for whoever checks in on this program to see, so the dealers don't just go, ya we processed 222 clunkers (but sold them all for parts and have nothing to show you), now where is our $1,000,000 check?

[swa66]

If the goal is to get fuel inefficient cars of the road, would it not be wise to make sure it's only the worst fuel inefficient ones that get scrapped ?
And that they do not get replaced by a new equally fuel inefficient cars.

That Shelby Mustang according to Ford does "14 mpg city/22 hwy" that's almost as bad as a Ford Explorer at "14 mpg city/20 hwy". And then to know the Shelby is the most "tame" of that list, they didn't even replace the rear suspension with something remotely usable for the amount of horsepower the engine delivers.

For the non-US audience: 14mpg is 16.8 liters/100km

Fuel economic cars out here in Europe start below 4 liters/100km (in liter/100km less is better)
e.g. a VW polo blue motion is said to use 3,9 l/100km (or 60.3 mpg for those in the US), no hyper mileage, no hybrid, no huge batteries, no plug-in charging, just a fuel economic package, standard out of the showroom.

Even the sports car we have in sitting in the garage is happy with 10 liters/100km in real life. Specs claim it's happy with 7.7 liter/100km combined cycle, guess my right foot is a bit heavier than the minimum required :) - hey it's a sports car: if fuel economy would be important we'd not have it. The SUV sitting next to it is also happy with 10 liters/100km diesel in real life.

[lawman]

But the Mustang gets better mileage than my second choice - Mercedes C63. :)

[Rugles]

And that they do not get replaced by a new equally fuel inefficient cars.

I believe that is indeed part of the program. Your trade-in has to have certain parameters and so does the new car. So yes, this will indeed reduce fuel usage overall.

Maybe somebody here has used this program and tell us the parameters to qualify for the program.

[thecoalman]

Lawman if you had a clunker, trade your clunker in and get the wife a new car. Sell her old car then buy your mustang. Everyone happy. :)

My Dad was actually considering doing that to get a new truck but his truck is worth more than the rebate.

[lawman]

Both of our clunkers are still under warranty. Cars around my house get replaced when the warranty runs out. But if there were a tax credit . . . ;)

[tangor]

Sad thing is the folks who can least afford new cars and have relied on used cars for years will no longer have a fleet of used cars to afford. Ultimately I believe more folks will be hurt by this program than the economy or the greenies hope.

[thecoalman]

I think the bigger issue there is a majority of the trade ins are going to be trucks/vans. They are the life blood of small business. Ask just about anybody that started out small in lot of business's and they will tell you one purchase they made that was absolute must was a used truck/van. You can't haul cinder blocks around with a car and you certainly don't want to do it with a new truck. Just about any small business will need one of these vehicles whether you're laying sidewalks or in the restaurant business.

[D_Blackwell]

'Help' a system/country crippled by staggering debt by coming up with more programs that add more debt. It's 'funny money' - cash borrowed by the US to fund the deal. We are all going to have to pay that back - and I'm not even getting a new car out of it:))

[BillyS]

Someone needs to get fired over this mess. Clearly the incentives are too high.

[segasys]

It's successful to the extent it has prematurely moved a lot of buyers into the market. They did the same thing after 9-11-01. Part of the problem in the industry was in begin with.

Now dealers have cashflow issues. Waiting on money from the government. Vendors like me get slowrolled because of it :(

After it is over in the next month or so the market will be paralyzed again and many more dealers will fold. BTW that is not a bad thing...

[Rugles]

As somebody who lives in an area where cars and car parts are a very important part of the economy, this was just what the Doctor ordered.

Its really scary to drive by these massive factories and see the employee parking lots empty week after week. Knowing that those employees are sitting at home collecting a government check and not paying income taxes. Something had to be done to "prime the pump" of the economy and this appears to be a massive success.

[D_Blackwell]

this appears to be a massive success.

Just another 'printing money' scheme that we are all going to have to pay for. Like the stimulus checks we all got. It was and is money that doesn't exist, theorizing that it will somehow create money. Straw into gold.

[Rugles]

Its Keynsian economics, spend in a recession and save during expansion. Lets just hope they do the second part of the equation this time.

Having all that industrial capacity sitting idle while these workers are sucking on the government teet is just as bad on the balance sheet as paying people to buy cars. So there really was very little choice.

Plus the added benefit of reducing the amount of imported oil and less air pollution because the new cars are more fuel efficient. Sales taxes and income taxes generated from this economic activity will also reduce the real cost of this program too.

[lawman]

Like the stimulus checks we all got.

They handed out stimulus checks?

[D_Blackwell]

Before the big bailouts they did that tax rebate or stimulus deal. $300 a person. Mine was for the max. I don't remember exactly what it was called. Stimulus is probably the wrong word.

Nevertheless, we were supposed to go out and spend this 'money' which, while 'money in the hand', is really just more debt on the government books racking up interest that we will be paying to China or whatever collection of countries owns our bad debts.

Can the USA be repossessed? Maybe they would parcel us out. Midwest to India. Northeast to China. Texas to Mexico (which it is already), California they might just all write off, blast the earthquake fault lines, and let it tip into the Pacific.

<edit>Gave Texas to two countries.</edit>

[lawman]

They handed out $300/person? Neither lawman nor Mrs. lawman received any tax rebate. All the more reason for them to give me a $4500 tax credit on the vehicle of my choice. :)

[Broadway]

This program is just another slap in the face to me.

I bought responsibly 7 years ago. Now I find that my "clunker"'s mileage is too good to qualify for the program. But of course all the housewives that just had to have 4WD SUV's qualify as do the clowns that drive the big pickup trucks with towing packages, who never tow anything.

I also made the mistake of buying a house I could afford and paying it off. Where are the breaks for those who make the right decisions?

I now fully understand that government's only purpose is to provide dole to the masses, in turn for being re-elected. I understand how great it is to get to live here in the USA but I now consider myself officially a non-participant. The fix is always in in terms of a free lunch for evidently any and everyone who's been irresponsible.

[lawman]

I also made the mistake of buying a house I could afford and paying it off. Where are the breaks for those who make the right decisions?

I know how you feel. I have a paid for house and paid for cars (including one of those SUVs). However, I have to admit that I'm feeling the effects of the economy for the first time since 1980. I don't particularly like the loss of income, but I'm sure that not having any debt along with a savings cushion is way less stressful than losing a home and trading down to a Tercel.

Oh, and so far my personal financial situation has helped me keep all of my office help employed - truth be told, I could do with one less secretary, but they've got mouths to feed too.