Forum Moderators: buckworks
thank you all
[edited by: lorax at 2:06 pm (utc) on Nov. 20, 2006]
[edit reason] no email addys please [/edit]
Can you be more specific?
Thanks.
Bek.
i wanna start my own online business and i wanna...
This group is comprised of talented, educated and affluent business people/techies (and some pretty ordinary, but helpful blokes). Their time is valuable. If you "wanna" answer, spend time to precisely craft your question. Then ask it in YOUR best reasonably formal English. Some of the best questions and answers here are from non-native English speakers.
I'm seeing too many vague goofball questions on this board lately. Some are probably from people trying to build their post count in hopes of slipping in some advertising once they become accepted WebmasterWorlders.
As jsinger suggested this is an elite group of individuals that are willing and able to give you sound advice, but you need to provide much more detail.
and...
welcome to Webmaster World
sounds like you "wanna" be spoon fed .."uh uh"
"wanna" gets "nada"
i wanna start my own online business and i wanna know how to procced.
This is if you register as an SARL ..( french limited company ) ..the form "juridique" which most fits your proposed business as oulined by yourself ..you will also need to be able to take money online ..which will require a "vent a distance" ( distance selling agreement ) agreement with your french bank ..and a commercial account with them ..this could easily all take you 6 months to a year to set up ..and you'll need to do a great deal of paperwork with the various parts of "l'administration" ..
[edited by: Leosghost at 3:28 pm (utc) on Nov. 21, 2006]
How many items do you intend to stock?
if he is a french citizen..and
if he wishes to stay within french laws
his options will be
..paypal
..bluepaid
..worldpay
..his french bank
and will actually due to french banking laws ( he is selling tangible goods from a french based business ) come down to ..paypal ( France ) and or his french bank ..
and if he is a french citizen it is illegal for him to have any foreign bank accounts that he hasn't declared to the french fisc ..
this isn't Kansas ..ni Dagenham Rodney ;-) ..donc
I suggest the OP ..va voir un avocat ..et PTF ...which is CYA for the anglophones ..
as to a shopping cart ..if you need it in french?
try "boutika" ..the programmer lives in the south .."haut var" .I seem to remember ..
and need shipping etc calculating and something that doesnt put off french customers ..you can customise it somewhat ..and it's free upto 15 items ..I wont link to it from here ..a search will get you to it ..
First, drop the notion of having your business located in France. Expatriate if you have to. If you plan to target the US...many of our people are still ticked about the French being uncooperative on the geo-political scene and refuse to buy anything from France. Secondly, taxes to support its socialist system will eat you alive.
Make a list of the things you want to sell. Then research your market.
You have to focus on mainly two things. Demand and competition.
Check out tools like Overture search suggestion to find out if there is even demand for the type of products you want to sell. Do people search for the products you want to offer? You can also find out by creating an Adwords account and testing how many visitors Google predicts for certain keywords.
Because it is relatively easy to be successful if there is already demand for your products. However if you have to first create the demand and product awareness you will probably fail unless you come up with some fancy viral marketing idea or something else very clever.
Also think about how you want to promote your site. How do you want to acquire customers? By getting on top of the Search Engine Rankings? Then better watch out that your shopping cart does offer basic Search Engine Optimization features like individual title tags for all products. Or do you want to advertise on Yahoo or Google? or go for affiliate marketing? This has all to be considered before you start because this affects many later decisions like which shopping cart you should go for.
2. If you have made sure that there are even people out there who are interested in the type of product you offer research your competition. How many potential competitiors do you have? Is the market overcrowded? What do the competitors offer (type of products , depth and breadth of product line), how do they acquire customers, what are the prices and so on.
Doing a little research before starting can save you a lot of money. You could also start with selling on ebay to find out if there is a market for your products before you sink a lot of money into a website and your own shopping cart.
You could also start with selling on ebay
again ..in France if you sell more than the occasional item on ebay ( more than one or two per month ) you must register as a french business ( with the financial consequences that I mentioned earlier )..ebay will co-operate with the french authorities if they ask ..and the authorities do monitor ebay very closely ..as they also monitor small ads in local newspapers ..selling new items is a no- no ..means you are a business ..or must be registered as such
our newspapers are full of ..people who have been "caught" working the black economy "travaille au noir" .."sans etre declaré" ....on ebay etc ..
local french conditions apart ..jecasc's suggestions are very valid for anyone starting up ..but not here ..
doing your own "garage sale" is illegal in France ( even to sell your own used stuff ) ..as is participating in more than two car boot sales anywhere in France per year ..you can face major fines ...lose your home and go to jail if you do not obey these laws
[edited by: Leosghost at 9:51 pm (utc) on Nov. 21, 2006]
But surely there is some form of sole proprietorship business you can register in France to start without further expenses?
Niche products you are interested in is probably the way to go. Selling everything under the sun dilutes your customer base and people end up buying from a store which specializes in one particular area. Don't forget to come back someday and get some cheap shots in!
But surely there is some form of sole proprietorship business you can register in France to start without further expenses?
there only is "microenterprise" ..sort of small limited company ( french sarl equivalent to UK ltd or US llc)..it wil still cost him / her around $5000.oo US to be paid within the first 6 months from a pre paid "bond" held in the commercial bank account ..and it is the obligatory social security costs that are to be paid from this ..minimum of $5000.oo per year as a sole proprietor .."up front" first deduction " cotisation" is required to be paid within 3 weeks of opening ..even if you never make one red cent ..
someone has to pay the wages of our civil service and their retirement fund ..compulsory "social" ( health and retirement ) deductions paid to the state from actual turnover are at 74% of pre tax profits ..corp tax is at around 40% of what is left ..
as they dont know how much you may make when you start ..they take a damn good bite out of your "donkey" just to be going on with ..and if you dont make anything ..they dont spit it back ..
you dont pay it on time ..like evn a couple of days late ..you go to court ..meanwhile they have taken a lien on your goods ..and sold them at rock bottom ..at public auction ..organised by a private bailiff "huisier" ..whom you then have to pay for having organised the charade ..:)..
and if you die first they can take it by selling your kids houses , cars , whatever or seizing their wages if they are salaried or their bank accounts ..with no need to go to court ..
and here is not the place to enlighten you about the french administration ..kafka-esque ..and slower than petrified molasses on strike ( which it frequently is ) ...or on holiday ..or at lunch ..
[edited by: Leosghost at 12:06 am (utc) on Nov. 22, 2006]
[edited by: DryFire at 6:28 am (utc) on Nov. 22, 2006]
If all that is true, It’s surprising that the French unemployment rate in only 10.2%. Do yourself a favor and renounce your French citizenship.
Oh it's all true :(
and some of our major towns have unemployment rates closer to 20% with 50% of those under 26 years old unemployed ..
but as long as we can keep strong arming the rest of the EU into paying via the CAP for our invisible cows etc ..and the riots dont hit the rich areas to ften ..and the CRS keep fit ..and the media keep saying it's so much worse elsewhere ..especially in the USA ..their words not mine ..
my passport isn't french ..and I speak more than just the french language ..so I have more choices ..
most french who have ideas and want to make something of a business and can speak english are moving either fiscally or physically to the UK ..and if necessary selling their goods and services back to France ..
and then they come back as tourists ..it is agreat country if you are a tourist ..or a retired expat brit ..whose retirement pension goes further as its so much bigger than a french pension ..
best advice to the OP ..base yourself and your business in the UK ..and buy a house here ( they are cheap ) for holidays etc ..but dont become a resident ;-)
but how does it work in US? how is it different?
Of course my target population is USA because the online business in France is not that developed as in USA or Canada.
Any ideas? thanks all
Really.. I better remove Morocco from by adWords Geo targetting and make sure I don't get invalid clicks on adsense also on my other sites.
This is interesting if true.
international money orders are still only at $500.00 each and if you want more than about 5 you have to ask in writing giving reasons ..
I think your banking like much of your system is based upon our old version ..
presumably you bought your domain name via family who are here ..
no need to reply in open fora to that one :)
[edited by: Leosghost at 4:43 pm (utc) on Nov. 22, 2006]
First, drop the notion of having your business located in France.
I've been wondering for a while, how practical is it to run a US-incorporated business from Europe?
I'd be interested to hear about the experiences of anyone who's doing this... I'm based in the UK so I'd be particularly interested in that viewpoint.
Presumably dividends would be taxed as though I had invested in a public corporation in the US - so no problem there.
You don't have to be a US citizen to register (e.g.) a Delaware corporation, do you?
Best wishes, a.
some of the best programmers in the world begin here ..some even stay inspite of it all ..it has it's charm if one lives away from the cities ..
but "making it" via your ideas or business or intelligence only brings jealousy ..
we have a saying ..translates as "we are the only country that chose as our national animal and symbol the cockerel ..it stands at the top of a dung heap and shouts to the world how great it and the crap its standing in is" ..
the farmer ..encourages this behaviour ..because cockerels always close their eyes to the real world when they crow ..
reminds me a lot of Britain in the seventies ..
But surely there is some form of sole proprietorship business you can register in France to start without further expenses?
There is. I've just set up my business in France and for the first year I won't be paying social charges (health care and retirement). This is because I'm keeping my day job and will work enough hours to be exempt from having to pay. It's also possible in some cases for someone who is unemployed not to have to pay social charges.
the first year "can be deferred" deal is trickier than it looks ..many people get a nasty surprise at year 2 ..some even get a nasty surprise after the first six months of year one ..when it can be revised if the urssaf [urssaf.fr] decide to do so ..
and they frequently do ..
as any "discrepancies" that are discovered or imagined ..result in the official who discovers them being given 10% to 20% of the amount recovered from the offending citizen as a tax free bonus ..and they have the right to see all your adsense dealings etc ( failure to disclose this information to the official who asks for it is in itself a criminal offence not subject to challenge in the courts nor to appeal ) at any time they wish with no need to ask for a subpeona ..the code napoleonic requires the citizen to prove their innocence ..not the the state to prove their guilt ..
if they choose to assume that you are making a fortune and hiding it away ..you have to prove that you are n't ..it isnt kansas ..
I've seen many foreigners wiped out by setting up business in France ..beginning with the micro enterpises proposed under what was known as "les lois Madelin" named after the politicain Alain Madelin who proposed them during the Balladur governments time in the early 90's ..these laws were supoosed to make it easier for people to set up on their own and much less expensive ..people were urged by the govt and the media to come forward and declare themselves and their businesses and they would have minimal state charges to pay ..what wasn't mentioned was that in fact the french senate had not ratified these laws nad so they were not actually in force ..about 300,000 people stood up and said " i'd like to run my own business and have been making alittle money alreadt part time to see if it was viable" ..and then the fisc and the urssaf slammed them all for two years back taxes and cotisations on what was theoretically their turnover in that time ..
( then again they may also look at US citizens such as yourself ..more or less kindly ..depending on all the usual variables!..I am surprised that you dont come under the juristiction of the IRS however even for monies received in France ..all Americans that I know of here still have to pay their taxes in the USA and their cotisations in France and their taxes also ..they get tax relief on what's asked of them in the USA on what they already paid in France )
lots of folks lost their houses etc to pay these invented charges on these imagined figures ..lots of them lost every thing while they hadn't made any money at all from their fledgling businesses ..and some civil servants got rich ..and Madelin said .."ooops ..sorry , the annoncement abou lightening the fiscal burden on new businesses was maybe somewhat premature" :( ..
The senate later voted through a much watered down version of his proposals ..Madelin was later sacked for remarks made about privleged civil servants [en.wikipedia.org...] ..
big business is the governments friend in France ..small business is what we call the "vache à lait" ..milche cow ..all political colour'and sides have been bleeding it dry since the early 80's ..
80,000 businesses are put into bankruptcy every year here just by the urssaf for not paying their cotisations obligatoire on time ..the tax people account for another 45,000 or so every year ..and what you cant pay they can take from your kids ..until it's all paid ..many of our SDF's .."street people" are those who were maybe a month or so late with their cotisations ..incurred penalties of 10 or 20% of the sum due ..and finally the bailiffs take it all and throw them out ..or hassle their working kids for the money the same way ..
this isnt politics ..its just explaining how very small business unfriendly the sytem is to those who might think that all systems are basically the same ..
and to those who may task "well why does anyone start a business there ..they'd have to be crazy " ..where else are they going to start a business ..most can only speak the one language ..french ( their english is about as good as the average Americans french language skills )..it's much harder to emigrate to Quebec than it used to be ..you cant set up in french spaeking switzerland unless you are very very rich ..so where else is left ..
60,000 left to set up in the UK last year ..inspite of the language problems ..most of them will come back to retire ..
[edited by: Leosghost at 11:38 pm (utc) on Nov. 27, 2006]
[edited by: lorax at 12:34 am (utc) on Nov. 28, 2006]
[edit reason] removed personal details [/edit]
where else are they going to start a business ..most can only speak the one language ..french ( their english is about as good as the average Americans french language skills )..
The last stats I saw had the French bilingual rate at about 45%. Of those in France I'd guess the majority speak English. According to this list [answers.com] France ranks 10th in the total number of English speakers, at about 16,000,000. There's a lot of Brits, Americans and so on here, but not that many. Most of those 16,000,000 are French. My experience has been that the French are very good at speaking English.
but how does it work in US? how is it different?
I don't know what it would be for a non-citizen, but it's relatively easy for a U.S. citizen to start up a business.
Business licensing is handled by the state/county, and may vary from state to state. In Ohio, you register through your county auditor, and the fee is like $20 or something. If you want to register your tradename with the state, that's another $20 or so. Trademark registration is a federal thing, and that will cost big bucks.
Just don't start your business in Ohio. If you ship to another Ohio address, you have to calculate the sales tax based on the county and city in which they live. There are 88 counties in Ohio, each with a different sales tax. Plus, some cities have their own sales tax, so if people live in the county but not that city, they pay one rate and if they live in that city, then they pay the county plus city rate. The merchant is responsible for figuring out what sales tax the buyer should be charged and charging and reporting the appropriate amount.
So, if you move to the U.S., don't start a business in Ohio. Bad news is that the state governors want to adopt this system across the country, whereby a merchant will have to determine and collect the appropriate sales tax for every city & county in the United States. This is their idea of a "streamlined" sales tax.
I guess politicians are a bunch of greedy twits, whether in the U.S. or in France, or elsewhere.
