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Let list the facts as most people understand them.
1. If you submit a site for review, it takes a long time to get it reviewed.
2. If you apply for an editor position, you will probably be turned down.
If the demand side (sites waiting for review) and the supply side (people wanting to be editors) were balanced then you would have the sites reviewed in a timely manner and people could become editors in a timely manner.
This is not the case and is there a reason. Let me put it another way, why would you have a backlog of demand and keep the supply side low. Since this is a non-paid proposition, then the answer cannot be profit, but lies in people.
Now we are getting somewhere. Here's an organization where the rules are kept secret, where you are turned down if you apply to become an editor of too high of a category, where if your site is turned down there is no explanation. So what's the answer, well if history is to be the guide. ODP operates like a secret sect where the only a few people are in power, and they are going to keep it that way.
I think we are finally getting to the answer, this is a power trip! And for anonymous, controlling people, this is great. They don't have to answer to anyone, they don't have to give the customer any explanation, and they get to keep what they do a secret.
This is the only outcome when you have a closed group that keeps it's procedures secret. This is not an open directory project, this is a closed directory project.
Can anyone join? No, if you read the posts there are many that get turned down for various reasons, some are legitimate. But if there is a need to increase production then why do the people in power, artificially keep production levels down. The last argument is that they would like to keep the quality up. If you have read some of the descriptions and read the posts concerning the trouble people have in getting anything corrected,you would see the quality factor is already low.
What do these power people look like. I'm sure you will see some of them when they answer this, by attacking, as they usually do.
I am not against ODP, but think the original intent has been misguided by a few individuals in power.
How many users actually use the ODP to find information, useful or otherwise? For that matter, how many use the private-labeled versions of the ODP such as the Google directory?
Maybe other topics are different, but in writing and European travel--the topics I've covered with Web sites for the last 6 years--ODP referrals are extremely rare and Yahoo directory referrals aren't very significant, either (even though I've had sites listed in both the ODP and Yahoo for years). Most of my referrals come from spidered search engines--AltaVista and Infoseek a few years ago, and Google (for the most part) today. Yahoo and the ODP seem useful mainly as a way to boost pagerank in Google.
This brings up an interesting question: Are the ODP's longtime editors happy with the thought that their most important role may be to help Google (a spidered search engine) calculate pagerank?
Don't get me wrong--I'm not demeaning the contributions made by the ODP's volunteer editors. But I do think the ODP's role today is a lot different from what it was when it was conceived as "NewHoo" back in 1998.
Side note: For a flashback to the early days of the ODP/Newhoo, see:
[wired.com...]
Directory referrals may be rare, but the directory results show up in almost all SERPs, for example, a search on google for 'environmental law' or 'firewall software' on google show 8 of 10 results from the directory.
Two sites, equal pagerank, one in ODP - any bets which would show up?
The ODP data really gets around. The pages that ODP links directly to on my site are the top performers for my site every month. Plus I think that the ODP data is a pretty big part of how Google works.
Most users aren't clever enough to figure this out but the restrict search within a category feature in Google is absolutely brilliant if the category is well maintained. It does a normal page search but only on sites in that category (and subcats). You can search for picayune words that would normally turn up all kinds of irrelevent results and get just what you were looking for.
>>Like you said, when you search for products you can't find them (thanks to the editors that won't list the sites selling the products and to the search engines who don't like cloaking). <<
Sure, but how often are you searching for something to buy as opposed to searching for information? If free-to-submit SEs and directories like ODP don't continue to exist, the internet is going to become nothing but a really big shopping mall and the company who can afford to pay the most for listings is going to win every time.
ODP could be better but life without ODP would be worse.
Near zero
The search function is used mostly by the editors.
Sites Using ODP Data [dmoz.org]
Over my three highest-trafficked sites, ODP accounts for a little more than 5% of the traffic.
Bret,
I have the utmost respect for anyone who puts in the time and effort that you do to make the Internet work. But not publishing guidelines to becomming an editor is like interviewing for a job, where the job requirements are unknown. This is from a company that screams 'become an editor' on every page.
I think the concept of ODP as orginally concieved is more appealing than the reality of running such an organization. In my experience in companies that have 30k or more employees, there are many problems even if you are paying people.
In an organization that is run on volunteer effort, the reality factor sets in and a stanglehold effect takes over. This is exactly what everyone is saying from what I've read.
I am a great supporteer of the idea of ODP but in actual practice, ODP does not appear to work well. In actual practice, trying to get this many people to work for a common goal is very unlikely.
btw: As someone who staffed an employment office for three months, I can say with utmost certainly, 75% of a jobs criteria is never told to an interviewee.
>The ODP data really gets around.
It does. It is subtle and over looked. That data gets used in ways we can't know. From new search engines such as Teoma and WiseNut that spider the data, or the local topic directory that pulls out your site, the data gets around. It takes on a life of it's own.
There is no magic bullet (there never is) but despite some frustrations with long waits ODP, it would really suck not to have ODP around. As a directory (not a search tool) it's good in and of itself and the way Google uses it is awesome from this searchers point of view.
