Forum Moderators: LifeinAsia
Many people in general think SEO is a bunch of BS. At least this has been my observation.
My first SEO effort won't be realized until the next Google update. I did the SEO during a complete redesign.
Quite confident I'll get the client website into Top 5 of most important key phrases.
All straight up basic SEO stuff- nothing sneaky.
So, how I handled the SEO aspect was to charge initially my hourly rates for competitive analysis and recommendations.
However, the bulk of the payment will come as a retroactive bonus when Google updates and the client can actually see thier site in Top 5.
Now, I can use that potential success by using this client as a case study in SEO. Potential clients can look and see that a site my company made is in fact, on top.
Now, what I am wondering is- are there any guidelines as far as how much to charge to optimize and get results?
I'd tend to look at how much PPC advertising would cost and use that against the charge for SEO. Does this sound...ok?
I'm wondering how a strict SEO company can sell their services without showing proof they accomplished what they stated?
Sorry to have rambled a bit- but I'm rolling out a new site for my own business and need to think about how to incorporate SEO into my services.
I guess it boils down to the question of whether most SEO companies charge upfront or a 'nominal' fee upfront and a good bonus if/when they see results?
Just one more thing- let's say a client that you have done good SEO for does get catapulted to the top of natural Y!/Google results- do you find others in the industry you optimized for approach you to optimize them?
Do SEO companies expect this and charge for not doing SEO for other sites that would want those same SERP's?
TIA for your thoughts/opinions...
AW
Also you can sell clients based on traffic increases too.
In terms of a business model you could charge for the work required (perhaps based on the number of pages requiring SEO work and the amount of redesign involved).
I believe most people charge the same way web designers go.
A percentage up front, a percentage on completion, a percentage on site upload. 40/40/20?
Charging the 80% before upload ensures that you have most of your money before you relinquish the site to the client. The final 20% can be sold as a grace period for minor changes that the client wants made, as well as SE submissions and inbound link acquisition work (it's best to stress the importance of this to begin with!).
On top of which you could incorporate a monthly maintainence fee - generating more links - updating content/adding new content - providing reports to the client - acting as the clients web contact, etc.
Again this would be based on work involved.
In terms of encoporating SEO into your own business:
>Make yourself appear to be an expert in the field
>Theres a lot of negative hype about SEO - although your client is most likely ignorant of it, try to elaborate on the fact that you don't use spammy techniques, etc. (you can use this to have a subtle go at competitors who do! ;))
>With each cost that you charge, make sure you elaborate on why you charge what you do and what the benefits are.
Good luck!
Scott
webwoman,
I don't think there is anything wrong with optimizing for several sites in the same field (competitors). There are 10 spots available on page one - conceivably you could dominate the page with just your clients!
Hmm. True enough. In the case I mentioned though it's a very small niche industry. To be honest my client is a friend. But- hafta state- when his site gets boosted if his competition asks- it is business I need.
As far as how to charge - I researched the cost of seo and then structured my prices taking these into account, as well as the client budget, and the intensity of the competition.
How did you do that? Could you sticky mail me with details? Prefer not to e-mail SEO firms with fake requests because many are folks from this board, and I know it takes valuable time to provide quotes.
AW
Thanks for the comprehensive reply.
Keep in mind companies in the same field can easily target different keywords.
Great point. I suppose when I posted this it was from the POV that the client's industy is very unique and 9 phrases covers everything. Really- 2 phrases are all that is needed for the industry I optimized for. The others are non specific and low volume.
The big phrase which is '[insert service] company' costs $6.00/click on Overture- and gets a 10% click though rate even at position #3.
Curious to see what their results will be via top natural listings vs PPC.
When my client is aggressive in PPC he spends appx $77/day and that's $2300 per month- if the bids stayed constant.
Also you can sell clients based on traffic increases too.
Good point. That must be why you are Marketing Guy. ;)
In terms of a business model you could charge for the work required (perhaps based on the number of pages requiring SEO work and the amount of redesign involved).
Is this standard? That seems pretty low to me. Then again- I may be ignorant of what an SEO customer is looking for.
I'm typically thinking of someone fed up with high PPC charges looking at SEO as a way to cut that out or cut out as much PPC as they can.
Or folks who don't even know about PPC, but want to get higher up in SERP's no matter what the cost. Meaning- desperate people.
No need to take advantage, but I sorta like checking out what their phrases would cost on OV and AdWords and get some baseline off that to price.
I believe most people charge the same way web designers go.
Hmm...one of the things I am kicking around is just how much I should integrate the SEO skills I've picked up into my web design work.
Initially, I thought I'd just incorporate SEO as a 'value add' to my design service with a bonus tacked on for specific results.
But. Now that I see I actually can get results and how valuable those results are...I am rethinking that stance.
A percentage up front, a percentage on completion, a percentage on site upload. 40/40/20?
So, most SEO firms get paid before the client ever views the results of the SEO work?
I would have thought most SEO business models were based upon actual performance
wants made, as well as SE submissions and inbound link acquisition work (it's best to stress the importance of this to begin with!).
I taught my client about backlinks and just explained to request links- created the HTML code and generic e-mail to send to sites to request.
Would think if a Web company or SEO company went to a website requesting a link on behalf of a client the folks you want the link from would feel their links are valuable and attempt to charge for a link. if it's just another related company asking for a link...usually no problem.
I guess SEO is an important aspect of a sites overall Marketing. Design/Marketing/SEO/SEM should be all one stop shops. Ideally. :)
On top of which you could incorporate a monthly maintainence fee - generating more links - updating content/adding new content - providing reports to the client - acting as the clients web contact, etc.
Good idea in general. It doesn't fit my situation though with limited resources. I try to get folks on some type of CMS so I don't need to do misc updates. Would rather have that time freed up to accomplish other tasks. Good for SEO companies though.
I should have titled the subject 'SEO business with Web Design Business Model'. ;)
Make yourself appear to be an expert in the field
I guess as I design sites that get to Page 1 results...that will do it. But tough without being able to show results.
Theres a lot of negative hype about SEO
Even I thought that way before I found this board and a few other resources. Strongest asset will have sites designed by my company in high rankings for good phrases.
- although your client is most likely ignorant of it, try to elaborate on the fact that you don't use spammy techniques, etc. (you can use this to have a subtle go at competitors who do! )
YES. I have no problem linking to Google's page where they list things to look out for in SEO.
With each cost that you charge, make sure you elaborate on why you charge what you do and what the benefits are.
Great basic advise we should all keep in mind.
Good luck!
Thanks. :) Looking forward to seeing where my client lands this next Google update.
>Scott
You broke anonymity!
Regards,
Dean - er, I mean Alphawolf. ;)
I charge by keyword for the monthly seo maintenance...10 keywords, 20 keywords, etc. That way the client can add to his arsenal as you get him to the top of the engines for specific words. It usually will mean you get to charge for adding pages as well - and the client ends up with a site that is constantly being built and created.
AW
