Forum Moderators: phranque
I know there's the Internet tradition that information is free and accessible to anyone who wants it. But... from a marketing point of view, most websites do not NEED to be international.
Most sites do not have a worldwide market. Unless you're a multinational conglomerate (like McDonald's) or information site (like Webmasterworld), you aren't selling products or services to people all over the world, or buying supplies from across the globe, or advertising and marketing worldwide.
More likely, you're a retailer who only ships within your own country or continent, or your website is written in a local language that automatically sets up language barriers, etc.
Nevertheless, people and spiders and spammers from all over the world may enter your index page, browse without buying, and just eat up bandwidth. You analyze your log files and get excited that you receive x visitors per month, but you're not sure what percentage is actually qualified traffic. You purchase sophisticated tracking software and spends lots of time trying to sort out the useful from the useless.
So why not exclude whole swaths of IP addresses representing the regional areas that have no business interest to you? Set up a page that says "Sorry, this website is not available in your area".
(In a sense, this is no different than a 1-800 toll free number which may not be reachable in your area, depending on whether the owner of the toll free number wants to pay x cents/minute to accept calls from your country.)
After that, your website will be a lot less crowded and all your number-crunchings and statistics and conversion rates will make much more sense. What do you think?
Most sites do not have a worldwide market
Actually, most sites don't have a market at all. That's because most sites are not commercial.
(Regardless of the impression you may get from WMW that the only sites that matter are commercial ones, they are in the minority still).
Most sites have not a market but an audience.
The reason for publishing on the worldwide web is to gain access to a worldwide audience.
If you are looking to address a parochial market for commercial reasons, then may be think about not having a website at all -- perhaps a billboard and an ad in the local yellow pages will be better suited.
The reason for publishing on the worldwide web is to gain access to a worldwide audience.
Really? For example, a Korean search engine or a Italian forum is always interested in a worldwide audience?
Regardless of the impression you may get from WebmasterWorld that the only sites that matter are commercial ones, they are in the minority still.
I don't know any statistics that prove that they are in the minority. Websites don't grow on trees.. they cost time and money. That's why even non-commercial websites try to earn revenue through banner space, adwords, etc.
Regardless, I don't want to go off on a tangent, so since you admit that WebmasterWorld users tend to focus on commercial sites, then let's focus on commercial sites for the remainder of this thread.
If you are looking to address a parochial market for commercial reasons, then may be think about not having a website at all -- perhaps a billboard and an ad in the local yellow pages will be better suited.
That's a non-sequitur and you should know it. Go tell every regional-based real estate website that they should get off the search engines and go back to the local yellow pages.
Here's a radical question: Why are websites available to users from all over the world?
People travel internationally quite frequently. It wouldn't make sense to turn away visitors or customers just because they're on holiday or on a business trip.
Moreover, using IP to judge country of origin is unreliable. People use proxy servers for privacy, and some use an ISP that gives them an IP address that may not correspond to their country of origin. That could happen where an ISP is selling internet access in various countries but is allocated an IP block from just one.
For example, a Korean search engine or a Italian forum is always interested in a worldwide audience?
Absolutely, there are MILLIONS of Koreans living abroad with strong connection to their home.
You can disenfranchise this market if you want, but I'll happily let them come and use my site.
I specifically know of one blogger that makes his living writing about his daily life on a south Pacific island. Most of the site's users are not tourists hoping to travel there but Locals who are abroad interested in hearing about home.
Moreover, using IP to judge country of origin is unreliable. People use proxy servers for privacy, and some use an ISP that gives them an IP address that may not correspond to their country of origin.
For better or worse, Rosalind's comment makes everything else a moot point.
I don't know any statistics that prove that they are in the minority. Websites don't grow on trees.. they cost time and money. That's why even non-commercial websites try to earn revenue through banner space, adwords, etc.
Regardless, I don't want to go off on a tangent,
I don't think it is a tangent. The web has strengths and weaknesses, and the original poster is pointing out an assumed weakness that applies to commercial operations. But the question is phrased as if the web exists solely for that purpose. It is not possible to answer the question in its own terms because the web does not exist solely for that.
I don't have stats either. But I do know that the web (like usenet) started as a non-commercial project. I believe that the web (like usenet) is still predominently non-commercial. If there has been a change, then it is for the proponents of that view to gather the evidence.
Children don't grow on trees either. And I am sure there are sites like OrphanageMasterWorld where 95% of the posts are about monetarizing children.
But that doesn't mean the majority of children are born and bred in orphanages. I'd guess the vast majority are still raised in variants of the traditional not-for-profit family, no matter how unlikely the orphanage masters find that.
Don't mistake the focus of this site for the web as a whole. That way leads to the sort of question that started this thread.
Moreover, using IP to judge country of origin is unreliable
Actually it is about 98% reliable.
The other 2% are non-us users on AOL which defaults to
US servers, and a few parnaoid people using proxy servers to hide identity.
Anyway, if you want to block access from any or all countries you are free to do so by obtaining the IP lists.
The most recent example was www.georgebush.com which was not accesible from outside the US (except via Google Cache and anonyminus proxies etc.).
Anyway, if you want to block access from any or all countries you are free to do so by obtaining the IP lists
Is there an up-to-date map that matches IP address ranges with the corresponding geographic area?
Even if we don't actually ban certain countries (this thread was more of a thought experiment) it would be helpful with our webmetrics.
take your server offline and quit worrying about it.
Moreover, using IP to judge country of origin is unreliable
Actually it is about 98% reliable.
The other 2% are non-us users on AOL which defaults to
US servers, and a few parnaoid people using proxy servers to hide identity.
That has to depend a lot on where you are from. I'd imagine that if you're in Europe the percentage of your target audience showing a misleading IP would be much higher.
Actually it is about 98% reliable.
What about the two out of every hundred people you would be turning away? They could be the ones with the big purchase you have just sent to your rivals...
My connection for a few months was determined by google to be in the netherlands or somewhere like that when in fact i am UK based.
1. I live in New Zealand. My best friend lives in Texas and has just bought her first house. She's a mad keen online shopper and will buy most of the materials to renovate/decorate her house online.
We had an ICQ session recently looking at wallpapers and curtains. One website had everything she wanted, and apparently displayed it very attractively, letting her put materials side by side on a page... but when she sent me there to get my opinion... I couldn't view the site.
We went elsewhere. Found what she wanted. She bought from the other sites.
2 A well-respected consultant I work with here was contacted by a professional acquaintance from Europe, wanting feedback on a service methodology described by a site in his country. Apparently an interesting and innovative technique, but when John couldn't access the information here, and was therefore unable to offer a proper opinion. The European contact put the new service aside in favour of tried-and-true because he was not confident without John's support.
Yes, we could have overcome the obstacles in either case. I could have found a proxy to surf through, and John's client could have copied and sent through more information. But when the world is literally at your fingertips.. why bother? The average user won't.
It isn't just industry that is globalising - it's people. I have as regular and as close contact with friends overseas as I do with friends here in NZ.
If your website comes between people instead of helping them communicate more closely, it will be put aside in favour of those that do help.
Actually it is about 98% reliable.
Even if it were that accurate -- which it may be for some markets/audiences/industries -- that's still the equivalent of being offline for a whole week each year.
That's not a course of action I'd be happy to recommend to anyone.
Those little percentages add up - 2% here for mis-identified IP addresses; 5% there for failing to meet an accessibility need; 10% somewhere else for being obstructive to non-IE users; 1% overnight (your time) because the design means it has to be down for backups and servicing; etc etc.
Anything less that 100% in any dimension is a big, big problem.
>> Nevertheless, people and spiders and spammers from all over the world may enter your index page, browse without buying, and just eat up bandwidth. You analyze your log files and get excited that you receive x visitors per month, but you're not sure what percentage is actually qualified traffic. You purchase sophisticated tracking software and spends lots of time trying to sort out the useful from the useless. <<
This is no different than what happens with domestic visitors. If I were getting enough international traffic to clutter up my logs and increase my bandwidth expense, I'd sure consider doing business with international visitors.
In fact, I'm doing just that on one of my sites.
