Forum Moderators: phranque
But what do you do when the Cyber-bully comes after you, the site owner? I have a case where a user was basically scaring off other users due to his threats of violence. We removed the user... numerous times... and he went nuts. I cannot reprint the e-mail threats he sent us, but it was disturbing. We just ignored him. That is our policy. Don't feed wood to the fire.
Well he went off and pretty much defamed me and the site all over the internet, creating user accounts with matching handles of known members on our site that he did not like on every site he could find. Then he went on his rampage of posting awful comments about my site and myself. Note that I never revealed myself the person at any time, and most of the actions taken against the person when they were an active user of my site were done by volunteer moderators.
Long story short... It has been almost a year now... and it is still going on. The same slandering post the user put up last Spring he is still copying and pasting around the web. He now seems to have about 50 different user accounts at various sites and he actually has conversations with himself all day long about the still-active members of my site, and my site in general.
I've received complaints from my members asking if there is anything we can do to stop him from slandering their good name (their handle they have used on my site and other sites). They have made the mistake of trying to argue with this person on the other forums... Where as I have never once responded.
So at what point do you say enough is enough? Should I be seeking legal action? Should I just continue to ignore him? My real name is being slandered around in all these forums... and it has gotten to the point where if you Google me, half the results are this guy saying crazy stuff about my site and me...
I feel like if I go after him, my life will become an even worse nightmare... because now he knows he pissed me off and I'll be a bigger target... and who knows if he is crazy enough will he go after me in person or my family?
Curious what others think?
Thanks
In my case I closed all the doors and banned the abuser and all the ips. I wrote a script to simulate a mail bounce to reject every email so the abuser would think my email address was not active anymore.
As for the noise the guys is making on other sites... complicated as you can't control it.
Have you traced the guy? I mean, geo location? isp provider? you could try that way, closing his options to get online if you complain to the isps
The advice I received from an expert (not tech but psychological) was to ignore the guy. Don't do anything, they try every angle to test your reactions. It took me 1 year and a half of 100% zero reactions to end up the problem. And once in a while I get a "try" from the abuser.
Legal actions seem like a way to deal with it, but you can wake up the dragon... sorry, what you are dealing with is very draining, I hope you can get some good ideas here.
I once came up with this idea, cloaking... so his messages appeared one day, some other day won't... then would appear back... then fade out... It might require time to write the scripts but it will keep him confused "did my messaged made it?... oh yes, there it is..."
Good luck to you
Do nothing UNLESS you receive actual threats you can turn over to your local law enforcement. Let the police and district attorneys do their job. That's what they are paid to do, and they like the public notoriety of taking down a "bad guy."
Mack.
I'm usually pretty good about ignoring such folks, but I just wanted to know if I was doing the right thing. I know (from past mistakes) that one small response or reply to someone like this lights a fire you can never put out... once they realize they are under your skin and you are reading what they are writing... it gets 100 times worse.
Thanks again everyone. As wonderful as the internet is, it is a breeding ground for crazies... ;-)
take the advice of just continuing to ignore him
Wake-up call: That strategy isn't working.
This person is winning the war. He is successfully destroying your online community and your personal reputation. Continue to ignore the problem, and he will continue to damage you.
At the very minimum, you should contact the sites hosting the defamatory material and ask them to remove it.
If he's made threats against you in emails or forum posts, that's a police matter, and you should contact the police. Even if they do nothing, it's a paper trail and a record of the problem.
Seems like a lose-lose situation.
But what if I ask the other sites to remove the posts and they do. And now he is really mad and steps up his efforts ten fold?
If you are scared to have public defamatory material about you removed because of fear of retaliation (online or offline), then you have a huge problem. You tried ignoring the issue, and the result of that strategy is that your name is mud across the internet and your online friends are upset and stressed.
Seems like a lose-lose situation.
How can things get worse? You have every right to take action.
In theory, if he were in the UK, he could be slapped down with an ASBO. Whilst often considered a joke, if you break an ASBO the consequences can be quite major.
One trick you might try... send a fake email "from his own ISP". He'll probably be half expecting a complaint so he may not check the IP address before replying. If you're lucky, he'll get himself kicked off.
Kaled.
Is this defamation costing you money?, ie. lost sales, ad revenue, etc.? Willful torts can have treble damages in some jurisdictions IN ADDITION to CEASE AND DESIST and NO CONTACT.
Not offering legal advice, just indicating there are many avenues you might take with legal counsel IN ADDITION to the ordinary protections that might be obtained via police and peace and order.
The advice to IGNORE THE BAD ACTOR remains. Do not contact or respond to this person. Deal with agents, isps, lawyers, whatever it takes, but do not contact that person. There's legal precedents in most countries that indicate if you are willing to personally contact that person you aren't "in fear".
How can things get worse? You have every right to take action.
These situations are not always so cut and dry. In the past I have received death threats (one user wished my family was aboard the 9/11 planes) all because they were banned from my site for harassing other members. And in those cases not once did I ever respond to the user, not one word.
I have a family now, and a new baby daughter. Opening a door for a psychopath to learn that I am going after him, means I now won't sleep as well at night wondering how far some of these crazy folks are willing to go.
Do you take that chance? Maybe. Maybe not. You can argue both ways.
Thanks everyone for the advice. I'm going to definitely keep an eye on him and keep a paper trail. He has not crossed the line of threats of harm towards me (yet), but if he does I will be ready to go to the authorities.
This is the salient fact. It took me three years to shake off some **&^*&^*& from my forum. They went all over Thai forums saying this, that and the other.... I maintain that ignoring the issue was the best course of action... but it's hard, when these nasty fools are posting pictures of you, your friends and images of the wives of forum staff etc etc (sometimes the images doctored in unspeakable ways)... I assure you, there are some sick minded westerners living here, that think they can hide behind their screen.
I am now married and have a family here in Thailand, where there are some EXTREMELY powerful defamation laws available... my family is off limits and if anyone on Thai soil even mentions my wife or kids online in an unflattering manner, I'll have them in the Bangkok Hilton faster than they can buy a ticket out of the country...
... and in your case maximillianos, I think that time has come for you... go get him.
[edited by: Asia_Expat at 12:32 pm (utc) on Mar. 30, 2009]
Call a lawyer.
Best advice right there. It has already escalated to litigation stages and sounds like it did long ago. Allowing it to continue is only damaging your reputation and those of the people they are targeting. You either step up to the plate and stop it or sit there and watch it destroy whatever you've built. :(
maximillianos: My real name is being slandered around in all these forums... and it has gotten to the point where if you Google me, half the results are this guy saying crazy stuff about my site and me...
Asia_Expat: I maintain that ignoring the issue was the best course of action... but it's hard, when these nasty fools are posting pictures of you, your friends and images of the wives of forum staff etc etc (sometimes the images doctored in unspeakable ways)... I assure you, there are some sick minded westerners living here, that think they can hide behind their screen.
Suggestions from experience... (Perhaps useful for the future)
I don't know how the abuser got your picture or real name, I'm not implying you post your pics on the web, share profiles, personal info or anything like it. Just a related comment on privacy. Take per example one of the most repeated advice on Adsense: Never tell your friends about your sites with Adsense.
By no means I'm saying that this is your fault. There are some crazy people out there who might hate you or "fall in love" with you (dangerous too, take a look at mad fans). Envy is dangerous, some people are driven by this negative energy...
By no means I'm saying that this is your fault.
Ignoring it usually works. If it doesn't you know you've got a hard case, and you should act accordingly.
I do use my real name. It's right there. I use my real pic online, and people know where I live. I get wackos after me every now and then, partly just as a result of the nature of my biz, partly as a result of my sharp tongue. I've got one after me right now. But let's put the shoe on the other hoof. I know of a notorious wacko, fraud, and troll who has been on the Internet since its inception. He is mentioned by name all over the place as being a jerk, a creep, and a know-nothing, and he has left his spoor everywhere. People have actually written spoofs about him and created spoof pics. He is such a bad writer and skeev that no one will even publish his writings; he has to publish them on Lulu (not trashing Lulu, just saying he has no choice). AND YET this guy continues to have a following, continues to sell his crappy books, continues to run a website, and continues to be listened to to the point where he doesn't have to work for a living; he can just troll and be schizophrenic all day on the money he makes. Now, if he can not only survive but even prosper in the face of the world-wide trashing he has received, certainly you and I should be able to, because we're a lot smarter and we're not skeevs.
The only thing I would say is don't get preoccupied with these people. It's bad for your soul.
The lunatic has such poor writing skills that I don't think most folks would take his posts seriously... but you never know how far someone will take it.
I'm going to do a triple-check of all my registrations and make sure my name is as least-visible as possible. I may do away with my company email that uses my name as well... and just stick with the admin account... Or an alias as some suggested.
If compromise and contrition don't work, I'd get a lawyer. Regardless of anything else, he has no right to attack your family and level threats against them. Ever.
You have "red widgets site", also have "blue widgets forum". Some have created the "widgets network" site (small, corporation look with new emails". You invent a logo and create a "red widgets and blue widgets are now part of the widgets network". Then you put the logo on the sites as if the new site is the admin-owner. You clearly disappear and use the new emails.
Its both a marketing face lift that creates noise, expectation and allows people to disappear from the map giving the admin to someone else, be it real or invented.
If your members complain to you direct them towards the proper owner, something like this might work - "yeah, I read that stuff too, pretty crazy. If you feel so inclined let the site owner know how you feel".
If the problem continues your only contact should be with the other sites owner about it's members actions and any of your actions should be aimed towards the webmaster, not the individual. Keep it light, often another webmaster will uphold anti-harassment policies.
You have no way of knowing you're not being messed with by multiple people, don't waste another moment on the guy, protect your site and let others worry about theirs.
