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Do you accept Pay Pal as a payment option?

I am very scared of possible fraud!

         

JunJunJun

12:14 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Hello. I run an online shop and accept Pay Pal as a payment option. I am very new to this. So I would really appreciate any help you can give me. What I would like to know is how much of a risk I am taking by filling orders that has "UNconfirmed" address. About HALF of the orders I have received since I started using Pay Pal have unconfirmed address. I believe Pay Pal has AVS (address verification system) and unconfirmed address means that the AVS result of came out negative (o match).... Are there that many fraudsters looking to screw new pay pal shop owners? I having been using other cc processing company a lot longer than pay pal and I have received orders whose AVS result came out no good.... but not like i have been getting with pay pal... I am sorry if I rambled on... but What I would like to know is pay pal orders with UNconfirmed address should never be filled?

Thank you everyone.

mcavic

8:06 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



The only danger I see is that someone could receive a shipment, then claim that the address was wrong and they didn't get it. On the other hand, it might just be that people want to ship to work addresses or friend's houses.

I'd just make sure you always ship with tracking and signature confirmation.

mivox

8:28 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Unverified addresses just mean they're using a shipping address different from their credit card billing address... For instance, I can use my Verified home or Post Office address, but if I want something shipped to my office it shows as Unverified because I have no credit card bills sent here.

An Unconfirmed member is anyone who hasn't added their bank account to their PayPal account...

I am not too worried about orders from an account showing one or the other, but I wouldn't complete a transaction with an Unconfirmed member asking me to ship to an Unverified address without asking for additional proof of identity.

Can you receive faxes from people? Asking for a faxed photocopy of their ID and the credit card they're using would provide an extra measure of security, perhaps also emailing them a standard PDF to print, sign and fax back with the copies, where they have to fill ing their CC number, address and signature along with a statement authorizing the transaction, so you can prove to the CC company that the DID sign for the purchase.

MsHuggys

1:34 am on Jul 18, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I don't think you can say, in a lump sum, that the risk is with unverified paypal users. In fact, any problems I have had were with verified users. The risk is more than just that label.

You need to watch for warning signs, verified or unverified.
If the order is too big, the customer is in too big a rush, you call them at home, and the phone number is listed for someone with a different name, they refuse to give you a phone number, indicating some elaborate story why you can't call them, using multiple email addresses ... alot of things. If they tell you that they want the order shipped to their office,ask them where they work, and then get that bookmark for whitepages.com and do a reverse address lookup. Does the address match up to company name? If it turns out to be postal drop, like mail boxes etc... don't ship it do a paypal electronic refund. Desks do not fit in a mailbox.

When there is doubt, hold the order for 7-9 days.See what happens. On day 7 once, paypal emailed me. I was heading out the door with a $400 value pkg, and heard outlook express chime. So, I head to the puter, and there is the email. Credit card fraud. I got lucky.

Be sure you are asking for a phone number in your shopping cart checkout process.

claus

1:47 am on Jul 18, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Welcome to WebmasterWorld JunJunJun and MsHuggys :)

This subject just caught my eye. I've been looking for a decent inexpensive payment solution for some time, and almost convinced myself to pay really big bucks for something that the banks in my country is behind. I know my customers, i'd just like to know this:

- can Paypal (the company) be trusted?

I know it might sound stupid, but it's a genuine concern i have. Please don't tell me they have 2 million customers (including WW), i have read their whole website. I just want an outsiders opinion. And forgive me if it's too much off topic.

/claus

mcavic

2:01 am on Jul 18, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



That's a good question, claus. I haven't had any trouble with Paypal, but I haven't used them much either. Do a Google search for Paypal, though, and you'll find sites saying that they can't be trusted.

MsHuggys

2:12 am on Jul 18, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Thank you for the welcome, so nice.

Yes, you can trust paypal. But.... you have to use your head, and take a pro-active roll in your running your business.This means keeping your phone number up to date for both home and business, and reading your email daily.
If there is a problem, paypal will contact you. If you don't respond in 3 days, you have a big mess on your hands. I know I can't walk away from my business for 3 days and not look back, so I don't know what kind of an ecommerce business would. I go on vacation, my clients have my cell phone number. They need to know if the spaghetti hits the fan, I'm in their pocket, and damage control is always best done sooner rather than later

I use a seperate bank account for the one attached to my palpal account. so it limits my liability for trickle down disaster. Never had to worry, but you never know. It's smart to think ahead and plan for the unforeseen.

Also, when I sell a big account, I never run large funds through paypal. First, the fees are too high. Second, you want to watch out for that federal reporting rule for funds over $10,000.Paypal can and will hold funds that come in one large $10,000 payment, and it can take many months to get your hands on it.

I have the paypal debit card that makes running the business a breeze. Last week they called me when my fav Inktomi submit site, processed mutiple orders. I like that.
They are watching my back just like any other credit card company. But... if I was unavailble, my account would be frozen. Pays to make sure the cell phone is listed on your account with them.

claus

9:30 am on Jul 18, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Thanks a lot for the advice :) The purpose i was thinking of involves small payments, so it's not likely i'll hit anything like $10K in any given month (although it would be nice :-) For large amounts i always issue an invoice. The thought of them holding back my money and earning interest on it is not nice though. Also, a separate account sounds like good advice to me.

/claus

MsHuggys

12:00 pm on Jul 18, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Paypal has come a long way since I signed up back in month #1. When they expanded to web payments, it was the kiss of death for many sales, the client found out you used paypal web payments. It was a sign of being 'small time'. But, when I quickly rose in the rankings, and stealing profits from the big boys to the tune of thousands of dollars a month, because my site had a work cart 24/7, and they were still doing phone orders, one by one they each came to paypal to try to get back their share of market.

But, as then, I still do not use the paypal logo anywhere on my site.I don't want to turn the customer off, before I get a chance to pitch them, and woo them with great products and great services at fabulous prices. One the pitch has hooked, and they are in love with me and the product, then who cares if it's paypal. A great deal is a great deal.

The point is, if you have those big 468x60 logos on sites, they REALLY need to come down. If you are looking for filler material for a page, then go affilate advertising and choose a retail icon and ride on his tails subliminally.

MsHuggys

12:43 pm on Jul 18, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



One last thing on the paypal issue... I always say that, and never mean it...

Get rid of the paypal cart button if you are using it.
You can make a proper, custom button, that matches your site theme, with very little effor, upload it, then replace the image location with the paypal image location, in your html, and you are good to go. Very simple, and gives the site a whole new look. Keep the buttons on the small side, but not so small old ladies like me have to use the magnifying glass to read any print on them.

Paypal cart buttons are horrible and have that ecommerce newbie look to them.

Egbert Souse

2:45 pm on Jul 19, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



We have been using paypal for quite some time now. At first I was really hesitant to add it out of fear of looking unprofessional. But when I realized that we could get more sales, paypal was immediately added.

A lot of our sales come from "Unconfirmed" adresses. You can check out the persons history before acepting the payment. I have seen some that are over 100 vendors paid with an unconfirmed address.

Just watch paypal payments like you would when you accept any other payment and you should be ok.

By the way, there are some new scams regarding sending of Money Orders, and Bank Checks. Watch for the watermarks (make sure the money order or bank draft has the watermark), check with the bank to make sure the bank check or money order is real.

We have not been hit with this yet, but I have read about a lot of people who have been. Bear in mind that ** Nothing ** is without risk. Just approach it intelligently, keep your eyes open, and you should be ok.

tedster

3:31 pm on Jul 19, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



I first stumbled over PayPal years ago when looking for a method to send money quickly to one of the more remote islands in Fiji. Since then, they've become one of the big Internet success stories and I have several clients who use their service and their shopping cart.

With their purchase by Ebay (for $1.5 billion!) they really moved past their small time image, and I would say their fraud protection is as solid as any can be. In practice, I've seen more trouble with chargebacks on regular credit card transactions and fraudulent use of various Internet payment gateways.

JunJunJun

2:02 pm on Jul 20, 2003 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Thank you everyone for the useful information! What's great about this forum is you get to learn things that Pay Pal people would never tell you. Thank you. For a while I think I will accept orders from people who are verified
(confirmed or unconfirmed addresses) and watch for the warning signs. I wish I could call every single suspicous costomer, being located in Japan, calling international is quite costly... and there is time different issue as well...

Do you know of any website that might be helpful in finding out about customers? MsHuggys mentioned
whitepages.com and I am going to use it....

also....
Egbert_Souse said
>You can check out the persons history before acepting the >payment.

Can I do that? Could you please tell me how I do this?

Thank you.