Forum Moderators: martinibuster
Any suggestions or tips appreciated
Does that make it a 1 way link in googles eyes from them to me or does google still recognise it as a reciprocal but just without passing pr?
That last part is interesting because it speaks to the heart of the potential abuse of the nofollow tag. You would think that the search engines would have something in place to deal with nofollow abuse. So you ask...
If Brian Boitano was a search engineer... What would Brian Boitano do?
Wouldn't it be interesting if the search engines identified it as a reciprocal and awarded a reciprocal link score (+/- or whatever) to the Linking Page, while simultaneously not awarding a benefit to the receiving party?
OR, how about...
In the case of a reciprocal link, the nofollow tag is ignored?
AND, how about...
If the search engines aren't doing that, maybe they should?
I'm just speculating, that's all. Good question.
Good points and of course no one excpt google knows the answer. I certainly don't want to do anything that could be seen as negative as I already rank nicely but there is always room for improvement. Should I just be thinking of doing some kind of javascript link that can't be followed?
Again the point being these people I link to really don't care how the link is formatted...they just want the service i provide plus the visitors that use that service on their sites.
Nofollow means 'this is an untrusted link'.
nofollow means "I am unwilling to vouch for the trustworthiness of this link"
I should also add that their links to me generally bring me traffic too. They aren't links on link pages and are very visible. I insist on it.So then, would it be okay with you if these people put a nofollow tag on their link to you? As you said, they are sending you traffic.
Then I wouldn't be debating the different ways to fool Google into thinking these are one way links. Because that is essentially what you would like to do. Am I saying fooling Google is wrong... no - but you may not want to do it with a well established, well ranking site you care about.
>>>Should I just be thinking of doing some kind of javascript link that can't be followed?
That's most definitely how I would do it.
>>>The people linking to me don't know or care about my link back.
That's a big assumption. Don't be surprised if one or two install a "tracking system" after they realize what you're doing to return the favor.
My honest opinion is that if this site is ranking well and the relationships with these other sites make sense, then go get some *new* inbound links to improve your ranks - not manipulate Google with the old ones.
To be honest that would not be o.k but then I am the one who dictates the terms. I am providing an enhancement to their website which others charge a lot of money for...sometimes on an ongoing basis. The yearly fee I charge is small (a setup fee to pay for my time in setting up my service for their individual site) as I am trying to get a good takeup on what I offer. Of course I want to get as much out of it as possible.
"That's a big assumption. Don't be surprised if one or two install a "tracking system" after they realize what you're doing to return the favor."
I am not talking link exchange and people getting upset that they don't get any benefit from my link. They are not paying me for a link... that just comes with the territory.
"My honest opinion is that if this site is ranking well and the relationships with these other sites make sense, then go get some *new* inbound links to improve your ranks - not manipulate Google with the old ones. "
These are new links, every week I get several uptakes which result in several new links to my site.
Well....now from all your answers I am leaning towards maybe linking to them in javascript.
To me, a reciprocal where one of the links has "nofollow" seems even less natural than a pure reciprocal.
I think the reason why Google may devalue reciprocals is because they are less natural than one way links.
It is not a question of 'may devalue'; Google does devalue reciprocals, since they are rarely naturally occurring.
Matt Cutts has also said that if you sell links that you should put this on it.
I saw that comment on Matt's Blog and thought to myself "Matt is asking the link brokers to identify their networks".
Personally, I wouldn't go near the nofollow attribute with a 10 foot pole. It was meant to prevent comment spam. Since the inception of the tag, many have taken it much further than it was intended to be used for.
If you want to flag your network of link partners, go ahead and start using the nofollow link. If you have to question whether or not a link to a viable resource is not to be trusted, then don't link.
This whole nofollow issue is a mess. It's turned into a SEO manipulation thing and I'd be willing to bet that 75% of the nofollow implementations are not correct usage, not based on the original plan for the nofollow attribute.
Want to send Google a clear message that you are involved in the whole link thing from an SEO standpoint? Start using the nofollow attribute!
Your customers and comment spammers aren't really the same thing.
nofollow also means (to me, at least) "while I find it at this point in time worthwhile to list this link (for whatever reason), I have no clue as to who will own this page location in the future, what its future content may be, and whether or not it will be part of a good or bad neighborhood. Therefore, I choose to cover my a%^ in the here and now."
'nofollow means "I am unwilling to vouch for the trustworthiness of this link'"nofollow also means (to me, at least) "while I find it at this point in time worthwhile to list this link (for whatever reason), I have no clue as to who will own this page location in the future, what its future content may be, and whether or not it will be part of a good or bad neighborhood. Therefore, I choose to cover my a%^ in the here and now."
maybe but it also screams (imho) "I am using this tag for obvious SEO purposes", which in itself is a statement that your links are there for other reasons then offering quality resources to you site's visitors.
Honestly..... don't bother. If YOU think its not safe to link it, or have doubts, why link to it in the first place?Again......DON'T BOTHER.
I don't see why webmasters or SEOs should bother with such petty techniques.
Or maybe it doesn't. Maybe it just says that:
1. It's becoming more frequent that legitimate domains are being abandoned by their former owners and are getting bought up by adult web operators.
2. it's a little difficult to trust some sites that carry ypn ads or adsense. you never know when they'll slide down the slippery slope.
So, to reiterate, while a page may seem worthy of being linked to today, there's no way to know if it will be part of a good or bad neighborhood six months from now. Sad, but damned true.
I don't worry about using nofollow on links to CNN, BBC news, most .edu and .gov sites. The rest? I wouldn't bet either way.
"If YOU think its not safe to link it, or have doubts, why link to it in the first place?Again......DON'T BOTHER."
Because, the information may seem worthwhile and beneficial, but there's simply no way to forecast the future intentions of most webmasters. With solid sites like the ones I mentioned above, I don't mind casting a "democratic vote", as google puts it. But most others--- Hey, for all you know, the site you're linking to may be a stolen copycat clone that's being operated by some adsense crook. Looks are deceiving and intentions are impossible to know. Likewise the future.
And I think this gets to the heart of what Cutts has been saying: only cast the vote if you're sure. But...even if you don't feel comfortable casting the vote, you can still provide the link for the benefit of your users.
If this link has gotten questionable I will add a no follow to it and revisit after some time to see if they have cleaned up the bad links on their site. If not the no follow remains or I delete them.
I am not in the pratice of hording page rank but I will not help a site that doesnt tend to it's business as it should.
I have found out if I try to help a site and send them information they are linked to a bad site, banned site etc, it offends them and we usually end up deleting links.
I am finding it very difficult to find good partners as most have just to much trash linked to their site for me to get involved with.
I use the no follow in this manner only If i see the site has cleaned up I will take the no follow off the link and pass page rank as well.
