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42% Netscape? UGH!

the tale of the numbers

         

txbakers

1:32 pm on Apr 4, 2002 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



I just did a mass emailing for my product, and people who want the demo fill out a short form, including which platform and which browser. Mac or PC, IE, NN, or Opera. (I didn't track the versions - IE and PC are set to defaults.)

So far the results are giving me ulcers. 42% Netscape on Windows. 38% NN on Windows. And I can almost guarantee that these Netscapes aren't 6.2. I just hope that at least their 4.79, but I seriously doubt that as well.

Ugh. My market is 99% schools and teachers so that would explain quite a bit.

Another late night re-write session coming up. How dumb can I make the software so earlier Netscape users can use it before the program doesn't work at all????

Macguru

1:37 pm on Apr 4, 2002 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



I read sys admin of large networks prefer to use Netscape for security reasons.

TallTroll

1:49 pm on Apr 4, 2002 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Netscape family browsers are strong in the education market. We are having problems with that at the moment, too :)

rcjordan

1:53 pm on Apr 4, 2002 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Expanding on this, I once had a similar experience, but in another niche market (boaters). If you're dealing with a group that uses a computer primarily as an email appliance, look out!

Reflect

2:45 pm on Apr 4, 2002 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



I was just looking through my logs last night for March. NN 4.X checked in around 30%+. I tell you I am bummed. My pages render correctly. However I was hoping to add some new nuances but now feel like should hold back :(.

Brian

richlowe

3:51 pm on Apr 8, 2002 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Netscape is growing again, and there are those who like it and will never change. I think web sites should work in IE, Netscape and Opera, and should at least be readable in older browser versions (although perhaps not as pretty).

TallTroll

4:07 pm on Apr 8, 2002 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Yes, but when does backwards compatibility becomes needless adherence to outdated standards?

The W3C wants to deprecate huge chunks of HTML in favour of CSS. Given the poor support for CSS2 in current browsers, how can older browsers be expected to cope?

Is NN 2.x compatibility required? What about NN 4.x? NN 4.79? Mosaic? Where do you draw the line and say "If you won't update your browser technology, you can't view my site"?

I know the Web is supposed to offer equal access to information to everyone, but we all know that in practice that isn't true, no matter how much we may like it to be

digitalghost

4:08 pm on Apr 8, 2002 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



>Netscape is growing again?

7% market share, down from 12%. 6.2 didn't pull the numbers up as far as expected after the 6.0 debacle.

One of my educations sites gets around a 35% NS browser share. That drops to about 4% in June and starts picking up again in late August.

Compliant code renders well in NS 6+ as well as IE. I don't worry about 4.7 at all anymore. I stopped caring about that browser when validated sites were mangled by it.

As for those people that are hanging on to those ancient browsers, they'll change, but only when people stop catering to them.

DG

txbakers

4:32 pm on Apr 8, 2002 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Well, that's the big issue isn't it? Are we writing software or something else?

Every piece of commercial software available today has a minimum requirements list. If you don't have the minimum requirments, don't expect to be able to use the software, and don't cry about "the need to degrade gracefully."

The web is really many things. I write web based applications as well as public sites. The applications need a minimum requirement. The public sites degrade.

I stopped worrying about anything less than NN 4.79 (not even 4.7) and IE 5.5 (I#E 5.0 works on mac).

It's a tough debate, but the web is big enough for both.

Try as I may, I can't play DVDs in my VCR, and I can't ply CDs in my 8 track player.

papabaer

7:32 pm on Apr 8, 2002 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Growing pains: one of life's brutal realities! ;)

And this too shall pass....

Start thinking PDA's and beyond. Seriously.

tedster

7:39 pm on Apr 8, 2002 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



> I don't worry about 4.7 at all anymore

Just when I thought it was safe to do that, we took on two new clients, and both had over 30% NN4 last month. One is education-based and the other is a gift wholesaler - that one surprised me by weighing in at 34% NN4.

I suspected there were some old in-house browsers cranking up those numbers, but after I looked at the logs, the crusty old browser appears to be spread widely over the uniques. Dream shattered!

Oh my, it's going to be an uphill battle, I can see.

papabaer

8:04 pm on Apr 8, 2002 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Pockets of resistance! ;)

I have talked to a number of school IT people who plan on migrating from NN4 after the current school year. If (when!) this occurs, it will move the transition along its inevitable course.

I am certain that even long after it was proven otherwise, there were individuals who still held fast to the belief that the earth was flat up until their dying day.

If you need to serve a particular group of "steadfasts," then you must... not much can be done about that.

I think much of the remaining resistance may be alleviated once Mozilla 1.0 is released, it seems that those who will not migrate to MSIE, refuse to consider Opera and dislike NN6.2 may be placated and wooed-over with this impending event. Certainly schools might show an interest in a Mozilla 1.0 final release, though from what I have heard, many will be migrating to MSIE. Who can say until it happens?

I am also curious as to MS's browser agenda. The press has been brutal, the competitors emboldened and AOL threatening; even with IE6's phenomenal adoption rate, I cannot help but think MS is working on a number of innovations meant to counter the swell. Early predictions? Maybe... but I would count on some surprises; like unexpected guests, they have a way of showing up at the oddest times.