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it seems that Google ignores links from the <noframes> area of a frameset site.
Example:
I have a site which often uses the following structure: frameset.html divides the screen in top.html and bottom.html. On all 3 pages there are links to www.mydomain.com . This has been established about 2 years ago and all links were shown when searching for link: ...
But since Dominic/Esmeralda the links from the frameset.html so not show up although they have a PR5 and the top.html and bottom.html which have a PR4 still show.
Furthermore there a no links in the frameset.html which point to the top and bottom.html except the frameset. So this would mean that Google follows Frameset URLs but does not use the frameset pages for Backlink and PR Calculation.
Anybody?
Good morning
your browser has frames disabled
Or somethign along those lines. How much weighting exactly I dont know. Personally Google does index links from noframe tag.
regards,
Mark
outrun: sure it is reading but it seems as if it does not take them in count for backlink calculation.
minivip: I had a sitemap in the frameset , so I wouldn't say that this is abuse, but of course I know what ya mean.
So in fact it seems as if Google is ignoring links in frameset pages.
(If it is so easy to ignore those links why not do it with the guestbooks the same way , GG? )
I can see the case for penalizing actual spamming in NOFRAMES but as the tag is presumably valid it would seem wrong to downgrade bona fide content put there.
I have several other sites where it occurs. Best example is a site of mine which has a PR7. Its index.html is a frameset. In the frameset I have written a description of the site, a link to the menu, because Google wasn't used to follow the frameset and some links to other pages. All of course not viewable for the visitor, because it is in the frameset. Now none of those links show up for a search link:www.xyz.com
I know that they used to show up before Dominic but now they don't.
But I think there should be a possibility for frameset sites to pass their PR. So IMHO links in framesets should be counted.
But I think there should be a possibility for frameset sites to pass their PR. So IMHO links in framesets should be counted.
PR is passed to the pages in the frameset.
PR is passed to the frames in the usual way, i.e. each frame inside the frameset is considered as link. Therefore, depending on the number of frames and the PR of the frameset, you can get the same ToolbarPR or a lower value.
He's saying that PR (and/or credit for being a backlink) is NOT passed, for example, by the "index.html" frameset page itself.
He's not referring to the pages that MAKE-UP the frameset (i.e. index-top.htm, index-nav.htm, etc.) he's talking about the page that DEFINES the frameset --for example, the "index.html" page.
He's also saying that even though links from the <NOFRAMES> section of a frameset are followed, they are NOT listed as backlinks.
Looks to me like he might be right.
<noframes> is widely used now, as has been noted, for the purpose of stupidly deceptive cloaking. Can Google detect that? _But_ _Of_ _Course!_ (Even I could do it in less than 50 lines of Perl, and I'm no math PhD by a long shot.) Simply comparing the links in the <noframes> area with the links on the framed pages would show how deep the spam was spread.
Now what Google does with this information, they aren't gonna say. But I reckon they can figure out a way to spit out this kind of cloaked spam, and if they put a penalty on the idiots who try this, up to and including the Permanent_Ban, nobody can say they weren't warned.
So, for people who have a framed index page and put an exact copy of their visible content in the <NOFRAMES> section, those links will be FOLLOWED, but there will be no backlink registered from the index.html page to the target linked pages.
One example would disprove his theory, but I can't find one...yet. ;)
doc_z: PR in the frameset's is not passed in the usual way. Given that top.html and bottom.html are the frameset sites and index.html is the site where the <frameset></frameset> is written, top.html and bottom.html will have the same PR as index.html and this is nit usual. They used to have the PR of the index.html minus 1.
Why they do it? One theory woud be, that now with this system of ignoring links in Frameset-sites, frameset-sites would only be able to pass their real PR minus one, because only links on the top.html and bottom.html are counted but not in the frameset. But as the top.html and bottom.html now seem to have the same PR as the index.html the domain could pass the "real" PR.
By the way I believe that it doesn't matter if you have a high or low PR5 when computing the PR passed. You always get a PR - 1 with a normal link, only those Frameset sites seem to pass PR without drain.
for a page with just two outgoing links (or a frameset with two frames) the probability that the sub-pages have the same ToolbarPR as the main page is high. This has nothing to do with frames. It's part of the PR equations (and the logarithmic Toolbar scale with a base >> 2 and a damping factor close to one).
Assuming that frameset links are counted as normal links this sites should only have PR6 but they don't
No.
By the way I believe that it doesn't matter if you have a high or low PR5 when computing the PR passed. You always get a PR - 1 with a normal link, only those Frameset sites seem to pass PR without drain.
No.
we seem to have a little different imagination on how PR is passed.
Give me one example where a site passes PR to another site without the minus 1.
the are numerous of examples (e.g. google.de). Of course, this isn't a proof, because those pages ('werbung') might have other incoming links which increase PR. However, I think you can easily find other (better) examples. You just have to look for pages with only a few outgoing links.
As already said, there are a lot of documents which decribe PR calculation as well as the relation of PR and ToolbarPR in detail.
