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I was checking out the competitors to see how they continuously beat me in the rankings (the service we provide is very competitive).
I found that 4 of the 7 sites currently above us in the rankings have hidden text, hidden graphic links (all-white graphic on all-white background), cloaking, the works.
I found 6 paragraphs of hidden text on the home page of the site that has the #1 ranking. The second ranked site has dozens of links to it from sites that have no other text on the page, just a link to them.
I knew about the lead site's spamming and notified Google several times. Nothing ever happens. I have sent them 15 e-mails over the last 8 months.
What really bugs me is that I find all of our competitors doing this. After the dance, I'll more than likely get dumped back to page 2.
Has anyone ever gotten a response from Google on spamming? In my case the playing field is NOT level. As far as my mgmt is concerned we are losing business and we need to do whatever it takes to ensure our survival.
Unfortunately one of the big companies have bought loads of domains and done a (double) re-direct to a main site that is at best remotely related to some of the search terms.
Used the spam report three times now and mentioned Webmasterworld and my nick but no luck so far.
Frustrating - but if I use the spam report to many times I feel like I am spamming the spam report :(
Does anyone feel that over using the report just makes you feel like a spammer?
I have reported a site three times now and if I continue doing it I am sure Google will just feel that I am abusing the system (after all - we all hate to be nagged)
I wish Google would devote more resources toward dealing with these people. It will only benefit them in the long run if they do.
End result, I lost a client. Not good. I need the business, but I know that it's not good business and sometime it is going to catch up with these people and they will be tossed out of the index.
I wish Google would devote more resources toward dealing with these people. It will only benefit them in the long run if they do.
I am pretty confident that these items are HIGH priority for Google, after all you do NOT become so big without listening to people who use your service.
Judging by the amount of staff being hired, and other goings on at Google HQ and various offices, i am of the belief that they are way way understaffed at present.
But I am pretty sure as time is going by, things will change for the better.
I am also amazed that a lot of the spammy tactics that you mention are NOWHERE to be seen in realtion to some the most competitive keywords out there.
OK, so a few guys playing tricks for the short term, but NO hidden text type of stuff anywhere near the top.
Shak
Fair enough points and with the incredible growth Google has had then they are bound to have teething problems.
As always it will be harder for a spammer to make an impact in a competitive keyword - as it would be harder for any of us to do it legitamitley (spelling?).
For a site to be top of the really competive keywords/phrases they will need to have more than just hidden text, cloaking etc - no doubt - but for every competive keyword there are hundreds of smaller ones and on occassions it can be seen that it is not so hard to come out top of these results with some very dubious tatics.
To teach them a lesson and level the field to either make everyone behave ethically, or get off the index.
Maybe google should post something on their site that all obvious spam will eventually be dealt with severely and that people who do it are walking on very thin ice. That alone might stop spamming.
We also know that there are many self-righteous webmasters who claim to be holier than the rest and therefore report spammers.
So what do the spammers do? My guess is that they report all sorts of sites (legitimate sites) to Google and to the other search engines.
IMHO this is why the SEs are behind on spam checking and eviction. They simply have too many reports and they have to sift the bogus reports out from the real ones.
I found 6 paragraphs of hidden text on the home page of the site that has the #1 ranking. The second ranked site has dozens of links to it from sites that have no other text on the page, just a link to them.
Are the websites that do that relevant to the SERP? Meaning, from a searcher's POV is it spam?
AW
I'm sure that Google is aware of the problem. As GG has said, Google prefers to handle spammers via automated means. So, we all just wait and hope that our hard work pays off and that Google slams the spammers.
It does make you wonder though. Until Google get's it straight, do you have to cheat to stay relevent?
I guess you have to answer that one for yourself.
Here is another quaint yet now, at least in Google, outdated notion.
"Cheaters never prosper"
The truth is, cheaters kick A$$ in the Google index, at least in the space I try to compete in.
I don't advocate cheating. However, at some point, when cheating becomes the standard.....
They can experiment w/ different spamming techniques to see what works best, later moving on to something else.
Ethicalguy is less likely to "experiment." IMO
webmaster at google dot com
This would mean that more clues to their algo would be given.
To be able to list a site as spam or using spam techniques, the editor needs to have contributed (50?) sites to the ODP until they reach a point where they can also participate in the OSP. This forces spammers who want to skew the OSP to actually contribute something positive (i.e., they need to do some work) to the Internet first, before getting booted out of the OSP for manipulation.
One drawback is that by categorizing sites in the OSP it might teach others to use the same techniques. However, a big plus is that Google and other search engines might one day figure out how to use some Bayesian filtering based off of the massive comparison testing it could do between the ODP and OSP.
Just a thought.
Like project management, actually doing the work takes very little time. It is the procedures put in place to ensure quality work that usually add the time, but improve the service or product.
GG has asked that people turn in spam reports via Google's convention for such. GG says to include "GoogleGuy", your handle here, and specifics about the spam tactic in question.
However, just because you follow directions does not mean that the spamming site will be punished, ever. If you follow this forum for long you will notice that many, many webmasters here have faithfully filled out spam reports month after month and have seen no action taken.
