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QS Questions



2:29 pm on Jul 9, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member


Suddenly 98% of thousands of key phrases are inactive - where they want to whack the bid up to 10 bucks!

Many of these terms are good converters, many have good CTR, many of them exactly match phrases on the landing pages.

Virtually all of these AdGroups are about a week old today.

Anyone else seeing this?


4:26 pm on Jul 10, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member netmeg is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month

But see, I think that might be part of the problem. They're not necessarily telling you that your site is not relevant. They may well be telling you that your AdWords campaign isn't relevant enough to your site.

You might want to work on your keyword grouping and your ads first. Start with one just one campaign, and see if you can recover it.

Go into the keyword tool in AdWords, and instead of typing in a keyword, enter the url of your landing page, and see what keywords it thinks are relevant to that page. Are those the same keywords that are in your ad group and the text of your ad? Are they correct? Are there some missing? If you can figure out how Google actually sees your site, it will help you figure out if you need to alter your landing page, and/or reconfigure your ad groups and text ads.


4:35 pm on Jul 10, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

Cheers for the advice netmeg.


5:11 pm on Jul 10, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

Being a pretty good size adwords spender the above discussion is why I don't use content match. I wish no problems on anybody but using adwords to attract traffic for adsense is a waste of my money. I am glad Google is taking the stand and getting rid of these as they may be making you money but they are as well costing others money.

I would suspect these are very low preforming clicks for the end user and one reason why they are getting wacked as the conversion to the user is most likely very very low so the cost per conversion is to high and the advertiser opts out of content match.

I think google is seeing this and why the accounts are terminated and or raised to a point were they won't pay the price.


5:28 pm on Jul 10, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member netmeg is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month

Actually, these quality slaps are for Search, not Content. Content QS is handled differently.

Oh, I think I see what you mean.

Well, my clients get conversions from Content and even from some select few parked domains. But everyone's mileage may vary.


5:43 pm on Jul 10, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member

I was just thinking of jumping back into the PPC game for some affiliate marketing. Maybe I'll re-invest my time in something else. Sounds like a volatile market.


9:20 pm on Jul 10, 2008 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

as long as advertisers need the Google audience, they can afford doing this. The best thing that can happen for the adwords advertisers is a MS & Y merger.


9:30 pm on Jul 10, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

I don't know guys. All of my keywords are doing just fine.

One of my clients even wanted to target their competitors names to try and get some of their traffic. Those keywords are obviously "Poor" QS, but Google is treating them fine. My Max CPC for them is $4.20, but the actual CPC is only $.20. Maybe this is because the rest of my keywords are mostly "Great"? I don't know, but almost all of my keywords for every client I manage are listed with a QS of "Great" (shouldn't they be anyway if you doing it right?).

I know I had read a thread here about a month or so ago where people were talking about Google starting to crack down on sites that use both Adwords and Adsense (in a obtrusive way). All of those people that set up sites that only use Adwords as a form of navigation in a ploy to make money are about to be extremely disappointed. All they ever do is gum up search results anyway. They may make money for their owners, but they fustrate the visitors and make for bad user experience(not to mention the fact that honest people trying to offer genuine info for the user are getting dumped on!).

If you accounts aren't in this category, I wish you the best.

L8r - Saxman


9:34 pm on Jul 10, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

MS and Y merger with never happen as long as Big Brother "G" is around to force their hand in a different direction. Although now that Mr. Gates has stepped down I am curious to see what new direction MS will take. I still don't have much hope for them. They are like an animal trapped in quicksand... the harder they try to escape the deeper they get. Right now its painfully obvious that they are willing to do about anything to take a step forward, even if that means taking three steps back!

L8r - Saxman


10:13 pm on Jul 10, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

Yes, the last big slap ALL my sites and keywords did fine. Not a single one was touched.

I to was lulled into thinking that if I produce great sites that all have a GREAT QS with .01 bids then I really have nothing to worry about.

So much for that thinking.

Who knows Saxman, the next time around you might not be so lucky.


11:19 pm on Jul 10, 2008 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

arizonadude is right ... I'm still waiting because you never know. The bulk of my keywords are currently "great" but I was slaped in July 06 and again in Nov 07.

Once you've been slapped you can never forget!

Meat Curtian

11:35 pm on Jul 10, 2008 (gmt 0)

Welcome to the world of Google....now you see it, now you dont....

I've been playing this game for years now...

It's Google's world and they dont care about you....


1:53 am on Jul 11, 2008 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

Who knows now. I have a company that does foreclosure loans, no affiliate links or etc. All the privacy notices, disclaimers, contact info, and etc. The page explains foreclosure loans, gives details on certain criteria, and etc. My term "foreclosure loans" that had a click through rate of 6%+ and conversion rate of over 20% got slapped from $3.00 to $10. But the content ads are actually doing great at almost 12% conversions.

Anyway, what I have done before is just get a new .com, copy campaign from adwords editor, and done. 30 minutes and up again.


4:15 am on Jul 11, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

Anyway, what I have done before is just get a new .com, copy campaign from adwords editor, and done. 30 minutes and up again.

Yes, this seems to be the only way to play wack the mole with Google adwords. Highly targeted websites that show up in their top 3 organic search that were worthy of .01 bids suddenly now need a 1.00 to continue.

I'll let the rich unique content sites stand on their own in the organic and throw up wack the mole sites to take advantage of the adwords traffic since that's what Adwords seems to want.

It's all about money and nothing else.


9:50 am on Jul 11, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

Nothing changed here. Good campaigns ok, crap compaigns still crap.

Though interesting to find this on some keywords:

Keyword Relevance Loading : No problems found.
Landing Page : No problems found.
Landing Page Load Time : No problems found.

Quality Score: Poor - Ad Showing? No


1:01 pm on Jul 11, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member

I took a step away from Adwords after the original SLAP in the face.

I launched some new lead gen campaigns - and within 2-3 weeks they SLAPPED each one. Even though CTR was strong, tight adgroups (1 keyword PER ad group!) and a page of text, a video, and images.

(also a privacy policy, contact us, about us, and even a blog to get the site indexed!)

BUT their was a squeeze/ optin there

This to me is 100% a manual review coming along and saying we do not

and slapping (and burned the domain)
and in my experience many time the whole Adwords ACCOUNT too.

I used to run Adwords because it was EASY and CONSISTENT

Today it is MORE volitale then organic!
So instead of re-building camgpaigns (or new accounts) in Adwords - I will just spend my money on more traditional organic promotion AND give cash to Yahoo & MSN.


1:56 pm on Jul 11, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

Yeah, I'm thinking your right about the manual review thing howiejs.

Going from a great QS to Poor and a slap in one day... it just cant be the algo.


1:03 am on Jul 12, 2008 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

As one of the original "slapees" (July 04?) and a significant Adwords buyer across a variety of verticals and domains, I'm 99.9% sure it has nothing to do with quality or relevance. Where I am aggressive in finding bargains, I get spanked. Where I'm lazy in optimizing and bargain-hunting, G leaves me alone. A previous post explains it perfectly:
If you're trying to buy traffic for less than 5 cents per click your time will always be short. You will get nuked for taking clicks away from the big boys no matter what your landing page looks like. Upping their quarterly earnings is exactly what this is about.


9:53 am on Jul 12, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

so the only option is to register new domains?
what would you do with the old domains, if they are getting YSM traffic and started to appeadr on orgnaic serach results? keep them?
could google ban them or soemthing for having duplicate content?
also, what are the odds they would get slapped right away? did it ever happend to you?

Meat Curtian

2:55 pm on Jul 12, 2008 (gmt 0)

Hey BigPat,
I've done it all, new domains, new content, new sites, it all boils down to what Google wants (and know one really knows what that is...). I've had keywords start showing once again, I've had keywords never appear again, and I've seen my SEO collapse. Itís a moving target, and you just need to keep movingÖ.

Yes its Google world, you just happen to live in it...



3:23 pm on Jul 12, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

And what a perfect world it is for Google. They did the right thing at the right time and now have a captive market of competitive advertisers all trying to reach G's massive audience. Like having only one TV Station.

Except we all have powerful computers with a multitude of capabilities that present our information. My competitors have taken to cloaking Google and presenting the content they deem fit. Show Google what Google wants to see and show the visitor the content that sells product and makes money to pay for the ever-increasing cost of advertising.

Google deserves this for their callus attitude towards their income providers. I will also predict that as G continues to turn the screws, more and more advertisers will find alternate, devious ways to circumvent the system until the system breaks.

In a nutshell, how tough would it be for G to forewarn an impending slap or explain the problem ?
Yet they do not, because of attitude, arrogance and greed.


4:19 pm on Jul 12, 2008 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

bigpat ... the last time I got slapped and moved my content to a new domain I re-published every page of the "slapped" domain with different content (new title, no description, and no page text) so Google wouldn't see duplicate content.

I waited until the bulk of the slapped pages were cached before I published the new domain.


4:26 pm on Jul 12, 2008 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

bigpat ... Welcome to WebMasterWorld!


4:41 pm on Jul 12, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

Thanks ralent,
so is your new domain still working good and didn't get slapped?

also what do you mean by "no description" - you removed the META tags and didn't put any? and what do you mean by no page text? so what do the users see?

and why did you waited for the slapped pages to be cached, if by anyway you had totally different content?

I'm not very much into modifying everything, becasue my current content is great IMO, if I can just register another domain and have a duplicate site I rather do that, if it couldn't harm... wondering if anoyone have done this?


5:07 pm on Jul 12, 2008 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

The domain has been OK since November 07 and currently most keywords are "great".

Yes I just removed the description meta tag.

By no page text I mean I just deleted everything that was on the page. The user would see a blank page.

I waited for the slapped domain pages to be cached because the new domain was basically a copy of the slapped domain so Google would see the old domain's content on a new domain name and the old domain's content would be basically nothing thus no dupe content.


5:15 pm on Jul 12, 2008 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

bigpat ... by the way I did make whatever improvements I could on the new domain before I published it. It was not an exact copy of the old domain as it was before the slap.

I changed the navigation and added some new content on many pages that did not exist on the old domain. Also added an about us page and a contact us form page.


5:41 pm on Jul 12, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

oh i missunderstood you at first,
I thought you meant that the new domain that you put up was without META, and without content, and that you left the slapped domain unotouched.. so it didn't makee sense to me :)

and how long did it took for it to cache the slapped domain again?

basically like I've said, the slapped domains are doing good on YSM, and also show a little (well very little, but maybe in future it would get better) on the organic search, so I'd rather not totally delete themq / republish them as blanks...

also someone told me that I shouldn't be afraid of putting duplicate content, since for example there are a lot of article websites that carrie the same article, yet they all appear in the search... on another hand their whole theme is to suplly articles, so that's pretty natural they would have duplicate content sometimes, and maybe google can distinguish that... so i dunno...

Gumball Monkey

11:04 pm on Jul 12, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

Do no evil eh?

Anyone else tired of dodging bullets and jumping through hoops? It's catch 22, you have a site which complies with what Google want but makes peanuts, on the otherhand you have a site which makes huge sums of cash, but gets repeatedly slapped during every update because it's aimed at conversion. It frustrates me that Google can improve their business at the cost of their own advertisers.

This update will no doubt be aimed at improving the quality of their network (yet I still have dating adverts all over my internationally renowned website thanks to Adsense - but not for long Google!) and remove comparison/affiliate/arbitrageur sites - because of course they are the root of all evil. Yet Google are now moving into comparison sites...you couldn't make it up!

Oh, and if anyone's interested - there was an update on the content network around the 26th June.


3:18 am on Jul 13, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member

Has anyone seen the QS updates go the other way? I.e. accounts going from Poor scores to maybe OK or Good?


3:56 am on Jul 13, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member

Has anyone seen the QS updates go the other way? I.e. accounts going from Poor scores to maybe OK or Good? "

Well Actually YES..

Last QS update pushed down my keyword prices down to mostly in the 3 cent to 4 cent range.. Down from 6-7 cents. But that is for my E-Comm site.

And many key phrases and words got activated at 5 cents.. Previously they were all poor..


3:07 pm on Jul 13, 2008 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member

bigpat ... I'm sure there are multiple factors that determine how long it takes for a new page cache to appear but backlinks are certainely a big part of how often you get crawled. My old site had a PR3 homepage and I think it took about 30 days for maybe 60% of the site to be re-cached.

If you don't want to delete the content from the old domain you may want to consider 301 redirects for every page from the slapped domain to the new one. I think I had considered that but I didn't want "any" association to the my old slapped domain and I really had very little organic traffic so I wasn't losing much by totally dumping the old domain. I did give up the PR from my backlinks on the old site though. That hurt a bit. Next time I may do re-directs, I would have to look at it a bit more. Just an option.

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