Want to check with you guys what is reasonable. I have a vendor doing our PPC campaigns (adwords to start with). We will spend 400k over the year in a somewhat competitive industry. Our vendor charge us 12% and will build the complex campaigns on his own account. Just received our first report where CTR is in average is less than 0.5% and that all keywords are broad, short tails as well. No negative keywords mentioned yet.
We are in the beginning of our relationship but I am getting cold feet's for several reasons, above is the last reason, another is that I get the impression they don't know this (its a SEO company).
My questions:
1. Is it too much to ask for that the vendor build the campaigns on my own account?
2. What would then be a reasonable deal from vendors point of view?
I would really like to deal with an expert who can comfort me me campaigns are in good hands.
- 400k annual spend and no negs mentioned as yet?
- All broad? Short tail?
- Is an SEO company?
I would seriously throw on the brakes and find someone more versed in PPC, as it would seem the vendor you are outsourcing to isn't. SEO and PPC have in many ways become two very separate fields of expertise--so if you're looking for PPC management find someone who does just that. A good understanding of SEM/SEO is obviously essential, but paid search requires a lot of very specific knowledge that an SEO-focussed company may not be on top of.
In terms of costing: I currently charge a flat rate for setup (anywhere from $2k-7k USD, depending on the size of the campaigns, etc) and then a monthly retainer plus a % of total spend. This model seems to work well for all of my clients. Unless I have full control of site landing pages, etc I would never agree to a performance-based fee schedule, though I do work with way with some of my older, more established clients.
When sourcing someone to do PPC I have found that freelance specialists who work more closely with fewer clients tend to be more successful than an agency. Also ensure whomever you hire provides you full access to your PPC accounts, at the very least on a reporting level, and take advantage of this. Get familiar with your stats and ask lots of questions--any good PPC'er should be happy to discuss the in's and out's of your campaigns with you.
Good luck.
They want to run it out of their own account? If you decide to fire them, how do you take over control of the account?
Do you have references from this company (clients of theirs you can actually talk to?)
Do they have other clients in your same niche? (while some might argue that that speaks to experience, I personally won't accept multiple clients in the same field, because I don't want there ever to be even the slightest hint of a conflict of interest)
I guess it's become a standard to charge a percentage of the total spend; I don't do it myself. It seems to me like there's not a lot of checks or balances to keep the company from running up the spend, as it's in their best interest, but it seems pretty risky - specially when they're running YOUR money in THEIR account.
In addition, no matter what is your budget, CTR 0.5%, broad match, no negatives…
If you mention all that to them, they will probably tell you that they’ve just started and will build it up based on knowledge they’ve gained from that start. Don’t buy it, freeze all and search around. As someone mentioned, references are the best way of checking it.
Going back to starting the campaign – personally – I always start with exact match (sometimes phrase at the same time) and start from there. Why? Well, at the very beginning you want to know what, how, and where. Then you start building that “complex” campaign. In your case that “complex” seems to be nothing else but “big talkers” that does nothing but talks in order to sell their products/services.
Measure three times before you cut.
Thanks for other suggestions as well, like trying to avoid conflict of interest.
Lets say they build our account on their "Client Management Center" at Google, can our vendor give away control to us? These Google tools confuses me at times.
I will come back here may I get to a point I need help to find a vendor, and what to ask for.
One thing to keep in mind is the history. In certain scenarios you may want to start with fresh new account, rather than with some that was poorly built.
Lately, I found that the most of initial burden is put onto site, rather than history of your keywords.
For example, two years old site (average quality) will do much better in brand new account with no history then brand new site in old account with long keyword history. This is not a firm rule or belief but something I’ve got through sensing some of my new campaigns/accounts.
Finally, if, based on information you’ve provided, we concluded they were doing a poor job, you may use that account as a platform for learning “bad practices”.
Lets say they build our account on their "Client Management Center" at Google, can our vendor give away control to us? These Google tools confuses me at times.
Depends how they set it up and whether they will be prepared to relinquish it. It's pretty sensible these days for any intermediatory to set up different accounts for different vlients, but if they are using a credit card, they run into problems trying to use the same card for several accounts. Many small agencies in this position end up putting our account in as a campaign of their own account, rather than a proper account in their MCC.
Another problem with transferring an account they set up directly is... Do you give them your credit card details and trust they replace their own details or do they give you the log in and trust that you replace the card details already on the system? Given that trust may already have broken down at this point, not ideal either way around.
Other issues arise, because in theory they have agreed to Google's terms and you haven't necessarily. Pedantic but probably one of the rasons Google makes it a pain in the neck when it should be straightforward.
With an overall CTR of 0.5%, maybe best to start again!
With regards to the 12% fee. The fee is a misnomer - a product of the advertising agency model of fees based on a percentage of spend. The ADWORDS model rewards account managers that spend more TIME (or Cleverer use of time) on an account than the next guy.
Look at it this way...I'll do your brick laying for you for less than the other brick layer and work twice as long as the other guy. It'll still take you longer to get a house and it will still fall down quicker.
Best of luck. Glad we don't have any client meetings scheduled for wednesday! :)
Dixon.
Actually one of there excuses for building there campaigns on their own account was the history fact you mentioned. I agree with you, starting up fresh is not too bad. Clearly this vendor did not benefit at all from that. Well, actually I dont know for sure about that as my quality score was not provided :)
Given the experiance I now have I should split the charges in 2, campaign building (flat fee) and maintannace (%)
Thanks all!
it does depend on volume, but i normally see history in my rear view window in hours or 2-3 days max if light volume, and after running for a week or so, i can no longer see it in the mirror at all.
saying what a "good" ctr is, is a tough call - it depends on external things like your competitors and your niche's keywords and more, but their performance sounds way under par. i suggest you ask them what they are expecting going forward - agree to some goals that include timelines and ask them to derive them.
the effects of historical performance are over rated, it takes a very short time to begin trending away from the old towards the new.
I agree with this actually - I've never had to take history into account, and moved things around, opened new accounts, and never had a problem getting a good or great quality score. But for new accounts, I generally have to wait about a month for quality score to settle down. Never had a problem on any of my existing accounts when changing ad groups or urls or any of that.
