Having said that, I do have to say that the punishment does not fit the crime in this case. It's extremely draconian. Even the IRS will not effectively destroy someone's business on a first offense.
But that's a whole nother topic. Google holds all the cards, we all know that, and I need back in. Do you think I'd ever break the rules again? I'm not a fool!
Does anybody have any experience with this? Certainly my credit cards are tagged. That's what tipped me off there was a problem in the first case. And that includes the billing address.
I suspect my url is also blacklisted (though I've not been de-indexed by the search engine). Before I found out I was suspended I tried a completely virgen credit card in my wife's name at a different IP address and it was declined. So it had to be the url.
So, assuming a get a new domain, IP address, credit card and billing address can I expect to get back in? I would think so but you start to get the feeling that Google has eyes everywhere.
Any advice will be much appreciated. Please no condemnation. I don't know a marketer who hasn't pushed limits at one time or another. I have massive losses as a penalty. I've "served my time". Thanks.
I actually had my account "terminated" with a little blurb at the top saying that my account was terminated and there was NO HOPE of getting it turned back on.
I sent an email to adwords pleading my case, apologizing, etc. and also called them doing the same thing. About a week and a half later, I got an email saying my account had been reinstated.
Don't give up...you may still be able to salvage the campaign.
If you know what you did, fix it, and DON'T do it again or it may become permanent.
Mike
I think G gets to decide when you've done "your time" (after all you did attempt to break their on account rule and deceptively succeeded), but it *is* *very* refreshing to hear you explain what you did rather than denying anything and everything.
Rgds
Damon
The problem here is that the offense is outright theft, not something in the grey areas.
BTW, on another webmaster type board, there's a whole lot of people selling these "vouchers" and people advertising they want to buy them.
I don't know a marketer who hasn't pushed limits at one time or another
It sounds to me like you are justifying yourself here, and that suggests you'll find another way to cut corners in the future.
From google's point of view, don't you think it's possible they might see you as a bad risk?
And, as an aside, I'm betting your site/landing pages don't pass the human sniff test, and that may be problematic in getting an account.
"If something seems too good to be true..."
Yes, right! If you did that what else are you prepared to do in the name of "marketing"?
I know you are asking for no condemnation, however, I really feel the need to condemn what you did, but I will attempt to do so in a polite way.
Although you admit breaking the rules big time, I do not see you apologize. You appear to somehow have regrets, but it looks like your regrets are not based on the damage you did to others, but on the damage you did to yourself. And if that's the case, you perhaps do not fully appreciate the gravity of the situation.
You think you have been punished enough because Google banned you and you state you served your time. But buying and using products that have been sold to you as being "unlimited" Adwords vouchers, and implementing this by opening multiple Adwords accounts sounds to me like an attempt to commit very serious fraud. Not only in respect of the Google TOS, but also in a legal way. Not only is this theft from Google, but it is also an attempt to steal from your fellow Adwords advertisers, like myself, who have to pay a higher fee to compensate for your "unlimited" fraudulent clicks. So please don't tell us you served your time. It is us legit advertisers doing time because we are the victims of theft.
Now, I can't judge about how much money you lost. But if your fraudulent scheme worked for a while, at least some of the money you lost wasn't your money in the first place. It was money that belonged to Google and its legit advertisers. Perhaps that also puts your loss in a different perspective.
And then there is the point that probably worries me the most;
You promise us you will never ever brake the rules again.
Now, if Google bans you, it provides you with a very clear sign
it does not want you back in again. If you respond by trying to get back in by using near-fradulent methods again (trying to open a new account under your wifes name) it really gives me serious doubts about your promises. Your statement that you don't know a marketeer "who hasn't pushed limits" adds up to this. It looks like you have chosen to participate in an environment that sees gaming the system as a natural habitat. That choice is yet another indication that feeds my doubts about your intentions.
So how can you expect Google ever to trust you again?
And how can you expect us to want you back in the program again?
The risk is simply too big for both parties.
But let me point out that my subsequent attempt to open a paid account using a valid (but different) credit card is in no way fraudulent.
That's an interesting debate we have had before in this forum.
As you know by now I am a supporter of the statement that using another creditcard/url/name/address/etcetera to get back in after Google banned you, is a violation of their TOS. I think this theory is supported by the fact that Google bans you right away as soon as they find out.
However, I would have asked Google if I am allowed to get back in the program by using a different credit card. What do you think they would have said to you? And why didn't you ask them?
But you did a bit more than using a different credit card, you also signed up using a false identity, pretending to be your wife. I think doing business using a false identity is illegal in about every country in the world. Even if you pretend to be your wife, brother, mother, whatever. Adwords T&C says "Customer represents and warrants that (y) all Customer information is complete, correct and current". That sounds clear to me. You aint your wife.
Perhaps AWA could comment on this to settle things for once and for all: is it OK for the banned ones to attempt to get back into the Adwords program by using a different creditcard/name/url/etcetera?
Google informed me to "refrain from any attempt to open new accounts using promotional vouchers". This could certainly imply that a non-voucher account is okay
No, I would interpret this message from Google rather differently.
Google also did not tell you to refrain from opening a new account using a false address. Does that mean to you that that is allowed too?
I've humbly apologized to Google and maybe I should have to the users in general.
And that's very good. We have had other folks in the forum who violated Google TOS big time but were not even prepared to admit they were wrong. Thank you for at least admitting your mistakes.
Those who don't believe it's possible to go straight are being terribly cynical.
And those who believe that admitting your bad mistakes will purify your soul are terribly naive.
The fact that you admit to be guilty in an anonymous forum does not turn you in a trustworthy business partner overnight. That's far to easy.
And finally, my webpage is a high quality content site
But as it appears, Google thought the quality of your business ethics (back then) were of more importance. And so they should.
But your story really puzzles me. Why would someone with a good site, good traffic and good earning potentials risk everything by committing a kind of fraud that Google is very likely to discover?
How much money were you thinking to gain from this? You must have thought the profit potential was huge.
But to conclude with some advice:
If I were you I would really completely refrain from doing anything that even looks like grey area stuff. So no more trying to get back in without written permission of Google. The only way to do this the clean way is to stay in contact with Google (and you appear to be doing this) and to be persistant. How about making them an offer. No more credit cards but a pre-paid account. How about you making a 50K deposit in advance on that account as an insurance for Google. Every time your account falls below 50K you have to bring in a new deposit. And if Google ever were to catch you on fraud again, they can keep the 50K. If you have become as clean as you suggest, there is no danger in doing that. Just make them an offer. What do you got to lose?
Goodness knows if the 50k deposit idea would even be worth G's time to administer, but it is an idea, and a fairly concrete measure of apology.
Give it a whirl, try it.
But you really should not be astonished if G decides you are simply not worth the risk.
Rgds
Damon
[edited by: DamonHD at 9:36 pm (utc) on Aug. 31, 2006]
