Forum Moderators: martinibuster
1. How will adsense determine whether or not a ppc ad or cpm ad will win a spot on a site? Will the advertiser's proposed CPM be compared to a site's historical ECPM to determine which ad wins?
2. Will advertisers be allowed to completely opt out of the ppc model and just use CPM only?
3. Will advertisers be provided any information about potential "good matches" for their ads and potentially targeted sites? That is, will a site's stats be supplied to advertisers so they can make an informed decision of where to advertise? I would imagine that many advertisers have no clue as to which sites their ads currently appear on. Or will it be left solely up to advertisers to do their homework?
4. "If" adsense supplies a list of good targeting matches to advertisers, what will the criteria be for inclusion on this list? Search ranking by term? Click through rate? Ecpm?
5. Will publishers ever be given an indication of who is appearing on a site via ppc model versus cpm model?
6. Will the url filter allow disabling of cpm advertisers?
Please let us know the approximate date for this development so we can begin saving our pennies, nickels, dimes...
If you opt for an Image only Adblock on a site can you run another content based text advertiser (Eg Image Adsense and Text Adsoner on the same page?)
And will publishers know who is bidding on CPM ads on their sites? Sorry if that question has already been asked.
Please let us know the approximate date for this development so we can begin saving our pennies, nickels, dimes..
Maybe if you put some effort into making your site more valuable to advertisers instead of turning every thread into an AdSense hate page, you wouldn't have to worry about it. I'll be surprised if ASA touches this post.
Ownerrim -- you'll probably be better off fowarding your questions to support.
Adsense Advisor just appeared and reintroduced himself (or herself) in a different thread.
...and made it clear that he or she avoids sticky threads. You don't consider direct shots at AS and Google Inc something that makes a thread sticky?
And, no, I don't really expect an answer to the questions, but I thought it was important to ask.
[edited by: ownerrim at 4:39 pm (utc) on April 26, 2005]
I don't know if you simply have trouble reading or what---if you look at the list of questions I posted, you'll see that there are no "shots" there.
Your questions are totally legit, and ones that I'd like to see answered myself. I wasn't referring to anything in your post. Perhaps reference the quote I made? I'll make it again.
And could you tell us the target date for negative EPC? I can see that since Google contunues to pay us less per click, eventually what we make will reduce to zero, and then we will begin to pay Google for clicks on our sites.Please let us know the approximate date for this development so we can begin saving our pennies, nickels, dimes...
No better way to keep them away than to sink to that level.
My apologies to you. My comment was not only in error but out of line. I will edit it.
The only thing an advertiser would do with this is bid up the prices on a few key hub websites, and either not advertise, or cut rates, on every other site. A small site that gets just a few thousand impressions a day but generates excellent conversions for advertisers would lose out because no-one would have time to find and target it. In the end, that'll reduce the net to a couple of main sites in each category at which point advertisers don't need to bother with something like AdWords, they can just contact the main sites directly.
Advertisers are probably asking for this because Google has done a stupendously bad job of filtering out AdSense sites on its own--there's too many junk and spam sites included. So Advertisers want to be able to filter out sites on their own.
This means Google has blinked: They've admitted they do a bad job of controlling quality for the AdSense program and so they're handing the job to the advertisers--who will do a worse job, in that they'll just target a few sites and be done with it. It's also an implicit admission that "Smart Pricing" hasn't solved the problem.
[edited by: martingale at 4:50 pm (utc) on April 26, 2005]
I'd rather be that than some pompous, self-righteous type of person. Just my opinion.
Geez, lighten up on me people. I have allergies. LOL
I suspect that the same situation will apply in many other areas.
And I also suspect that as with many other aspects of the AdSense program, it will be very difficult to figure out what is going on. Some advertisers will jump into this, some won't, some will test only....
[added] fearlessrick, OK, let's all lighten up. When you point out a problem, could you do us all a favor and suggest causes/solutions, not just blame Google? That would be a good way to start.
[edited by: hunderdown at 4:57 pm (utc) on April 26, 2005]
Back on topic, I'd like to know if the Ad Preview Tool does/will include CPM advertisers targeting individual websites?
I don't get a ton of traffic on my site, I'm a small player, with just a few hundred visitors a day generating a few thousand impressions. I'm too small for one of the giants in my area to look me up and specifically target me. On the other hand, the few clicks I do send through to advertisers (30-40 day, but with fairly high EPC's at the moment, so that I earn $10-20/day) presumably are among their higher value clicks.
The problem is that my 30-40 clicks get lost in the mess of spam and junk they get from all the crap sites that have been allowed into AdSense. The consequence is the advertisers will probably shut down the content network except a few targetted sites--and small sites like mine will be net losers, despite being quality.
Hunderdown, I am in exactly the same position as you. Small niche with the same core group of advertisers that have shown up on the site from day one. The match would be perfect, if they bother to try it, that is.
That last part is a worry. What if those advertisers who decide to switch to cpm seldom ever bother to check out sites that are either new, or have moved up in rankings, or improved in quality.
This is why I wondered in jenstar's thread if google will make some attempt to provide information to advertisers. One metric that would be very useful would be a list of the top adsense sites for specific keywords and keyword phrases. If this list is periodically provided to advertisers, it would not only allow advertisers to stay on top of "who they should be targeting currently", it would also allow new sites and improved sites to be brought to their attention as well.
This means Google has blinked: They've admitted they do a bad job of controlling quality for the AdSense program and so they're handing the job to the advertisers--who will do a worse job, in that they'll just target a few sites and be done with it. It's also an implicit admission that "Smart Pricing" hasn't solved the problem.
I don't think that's it at all. Google is simply trying to expand the market and boost revenue for itself and publishers on pages that don't do well with CPC.
And as a publisher, why would Google place ads on our sites that generate less income for them and for us? Why replace a $30-$40 eCPM with a $2 eCPM? It makes no sense. Google is not in this to lose money. I expect we'll make the same or more with the new system.
"
< It is my impression that Google will be suggesting possible sites to advertisers by category
I confirmed this with Adsense Phoebe at the Google booth at Adtech this morning. AdWords customers fill in two fields to target their ads towards specific sites - one for "Sites" and one for "Keywords."
The URLS and keywords the advertiser enters "generates a larger list of available Google Network sites".
One interesting caveat - Phoebe was unsure whether suggested sites are displayed in alphabetical order, by PageRank, or by relevance (as determined by their search algo).
This is obviously a big deal, as it would be nice to be showing up towards the top of these available site lists, to let the big advertisers bid up your CPM.
If this order is determined by search algo, effective SEO may suddenly have an added benefit."
I think you're right. I really hope it works out that way. Makes you wonder what yahoo has under the table and if this is causing them to make adjustments even now.
Granted, we're small and don't care much about branding. We just want targeted visitors and to be able to control the cost of that traffic. CPC gives us that control, where as impressions do not. So what if I can buy 1,000 impressions for $2? Why would I if we get fewer clicks from it, and it ends up costing more? In 6 years of doing this, I've never seen banners convert better than text ads.
Exactly. CPM ads and CPC ads are for different purposes. If I own Platinum Cruises and I want to build awareness of my luxury cruise product among wealthy travelers, I might buy CPM ads on selected travel sites and magazine sites like The Robb Report that are visited by rich people. If I'm a travel agent who handles bookings for Platinum Cruises, I might buy CPC ads that promote deals and discounts. The two approaches can complement each other, just like national magazine advertising and dealer direct mail.
Google is very cleverly piggybacking CPM advertising on the existing CPC network. This gives Google and publishers two ways to profit from AdSense advertising: If CPC doesn't work well on a page or a site, CPM can step in and fill the gap.
I don't have any problem with the CPM part. There were several initiatives announced. One of them was "Site Targetting" whereby advertisers get to list the specific sites that they want to advertise on.
That is going to destroy the AdSense program. That is what I think is an implicit admission that smart pricing does not work. That is what I think is the result of Google letting too many spam sites into AdSense: Advertisers threatened to revolt and demanded site targetting, and got it.
Had Google done a better job of quality control on AdSense or on smart pricing then there would be no need whatsoever for site targetting.
But as an AdSense publisher I know that means a lot of people are going to do exactly what I'm going to do, dropping off all the little sites. No doubt there are tons of little sites out there that send me high quality traffic--but I can't be bothered to hunt them down out of the tons and tons of spam sites that also send traffic.
My position also. However, we want to get bigger and are making several decisions about how to proceed. CPM looks to be worth the effort. But I am not a savvy advertiser. Fact is, my advertiser hat has much less wear than my programmer hat.
Will I want to target relevant, smaller niche sites? You bet. I'm wondering and waiting to see how the site selection will work out. Will Google keep me informed, as an advertiser, about the quality and availibility of the sites I want to target? I hope so. Again, I am not a savvy advertiser and that sort of help will go a long way to making this successful for everyone.
