Welcome to WebmasterWorld Guest from 54.205.251.179

Forum Moderators: incrediBILL & martinibuster

Message Too Old, No Replies

Google disabled account without any reason

   
1:44 pm on Aug 7, 2008 (gmt 0)

10+ Year Member



Ok, now this happened to us. Working with Google for almost 5 years and earned millions for Google, without any notification we received today an e-mail:
<snip>

We can not contact to Google to find the real reason because we always receive the same answer again and again:
<snip>

Looks like the only reason is that we have own freeware software site with millions grateful users but also there are lot of Google advertisers who sell the similar software and buy advertising at Google, so in order to prevent possible "losses" from advertisers, free software must die.... So pity....

[edited by: Optimizer at 1:53 pm (utc) on Aug. 7, 2008]

[edited by: martinibuster at 9:20 pm (utc) on Aug. 7, 2008]
[edit reason] See TOS. [/edit]

2:04 pm on Aug 7, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



Looks like the only reason is that we have own freeware software site with millions grateful users [...] so in order to prevent possible "losses" from advertisers, free software must die...

You think that advertisers might close shops due to your offering (and thus prevent future ad revenues for Google), and Google terminates your account because of that?

Could there be anything else that may be the reason for the termination? Google has earned millions with you; that's not something that you throw away easily.

2:44 pm on Aug 7, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member netmeg is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



Are you doing any arbitrage? I've seen that email sent to arbitrage advertisers.

(BTW, per WebmasterWorld TOS, you're not supposed to quote emails here)

Basically they're telling you that whatever your business model is, they don't think it's compatible with theirs, and could lead to click fraud.

However, that particular message usually means you get paid for everything up to that point - so you have that at least.

2:52 pm on Aug 7, 2008 (gmt 0)



Isn't it possible that your grateful users are more interested in downloading free software than in buying from the vendors whose ads they click? And that Google is merely plugging a hole that has been draining millions of dollars from advertisers' budgets with very little return for the advertsers?

If that's the case, Google's decision sounds pretty reasonable, even though it may not be in your own interests. (Think objectively for a moment: If you were an advertiser, would you want to pay for clicks that are unlikely to convert because the clickers are really looking for freebies?)

4:01 pm on Aug 7, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



"Are you doing any arbitrage? I've seen that email sent to arbitrage advertisers."

I though that was the incompatible business model? mail..

This seems to be something else..

Too much blending..?
Lack of content?
who knows..what.

5:41 pm on Aug 7, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



I wish Google would send out warnings, or at least indepth reasons why accounts are disabled. Makes me worried that any day my site could just be banned from Adsense and I'd have no idea why.

You were at least given the money you earned before you were disabled, right?

8:26 pm on Aug 7, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member



Maybe your visitors just plain didn't convert....and google looked at those numbers(probably automatically) and decided that your site didn't meet a certain threshold for traffic quality(as measured in % of conversions).

Maybe non-converting traffic over a long period of time will get you kicked out of adsense?

Makes sense to me.

8:33 pm on Aug 7, 2008 (gmt 0)



Maybe non-converting traffic over a long period of time will get you kicked out of adsense?

That wouldn't be too surprising if, as the OP said, the site in question had generated millions of dollars in AdSense revenues over the last five years. That's a lot of money from clicks by users who probably weren't looking to spend money.

IMHO, this incident shows how the right audience can be just as important as keyword targeting.

8:43 pm on Aug 7, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member



So, if a user visits google.com and searches for say "free IM software", Google will show no ads next to the search results?

Actually, when I tried that, I saw an ad above the SERPS and three to the right of them. I guess there might be some other, better, reason.

9:54 pm on Aug 7, 2008 (gmt 0)



We aren't talking about Google search results, so why mix apples with oranges?

(And yes, there could be better reasons than non-converting traffic, but without seeing the site in question, it's impossible to do anything except hazard a guess.)

10:55 pm on Aug 7, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member



We aren't talking about Google search results, so why mix apples with oranges?

You missed the point. If Google disabled an AdSense account just because the owner has a freeware site, and the ads therefore do not convert (see the argument "a person interested in a freebie does not want to buy anything"), then it would be hypocritical if they, at the same, showed ads on Google.com when a person searches for free software. Or, the reason is different. Is it clearer now or do you still believe it's apples and oranges?

1:15 am on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)



If Google disabled an AdSense account just because the owner has a freeware site, and the ads therefore do not convert (see the argument "a person interested in a freebie does not want to buy anything"), then it would be hypocritical if they, at the same, showed ads on Google.com when a person searches for free software.

It would be hypocritical only if the Google Search clicks converted as poorly as the freeware site's did, which might or might not be the case. (A big influencing factor could be how ads are used on the site. Depending on the page design and AdSense implementation, a site could generate a lot of accidental clicks or "confusion clicks" without necessarily violating the AdSense rules. Such accidental clicks should be less of a problem on Google SERPs, where ads are displayed in a separate column from the organic content.)

1:33 pm on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member



It would be hypocritical only if the Google Search clicks converted as poorly as the freeware site's did, which might or might not be the case.

Again, that was not the argument I responded to. The argument was, basically:

"A person interested in (browsing, looking for) free stuff is not interested in buying anything."

Still not clear?

2:31 pm on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)



infp, I said that a person interested in freeware probably isn't looking to spend money. You're welcome to disagree with that, but I'd point out that Google's own "smart pricing" discounts are based on the premise that some audiences or types of content are less likely to convert than others are. Also see my commnts about page design and AdSense implementation.

The OP claims that the freeware site was terminated "without any reason," which really means "without any reason we can think of." If we take the OP's claim at face value and assume that nothing shady was going on, then it's reasonable to conclude that the freeware site was generating millions of dollars' worth of poorly-converting traffic and was therefore an unproductive drain on advertisers' budgets. We can't know that, of course; without seeing how the ads were implemented or knowing Google's corporate thought processes, we can only make educated guesses.

2:43 pm on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)



we can only make educated guesses.

==========================

We can only make UN-educated and UN-informed and irrelevant guesses.

2:55 pm on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)



What does the United Nations have to do with this discussion?
3:17 pm on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



OMG. And I thought those pointless "Google can't be wrong" posts would be a thing of the past. It's like a zombie reappeared from the grave. ;-)

I think that infp has a point when he says that it is hypocrisy on Google's part when they disable Adsense publishers just based on the fact that these sites offer freeware (IF this is the reason), while at the same time they are happy to place ads next to searches for freeware.

YOU may be able to make educated guesses because you have information sources that are unavailable to us, but WE simple publishers can only make guesses that are based on whatever Google tells us (or not) about their beautiful black box. That makes them indeed un-educated, un-informed, and sadly, irrelevant.

P.S.: I'd like to know what the OP has to say about our additional questions. That would help directing the thread back on track again.

3:32 pm on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)



WE simple publishers can only make guesses that are based on whatever Google tells us (or not) about their beautiful black box.

If that's the case, is there any point to threads like this one, other than to let purged publishers vent their frustrations?

4:30 pm on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



If that's the case, is there any point to threads like this one, other than to let purged publishers vent their frustrations?

Not really :)

OMG. And I thought those pointless "Google can't be wrong" posts would be a thing of the past. It's like a zombie reappeared from the grave. ;-)

Almost like the Google can't be right zombie, eh? :)

8:03 pm on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



Looks like the only reason is that we have own freeware software site with millions grateful users but also there are lot of Google advertisers who sell the similar software and buy advertising at Google, so in order to prevent possible "losses" from advertisers, free software must die.... So pity....

In another topic (Adsense eCPM [webmasterworld.com]), back in February, you complained of decreasing earnings:

Another bad day. eCMP went down even more... lot of 0.01 cent clicks. Same ads which gave 0.10 cents per click a week ago now give only 0.01 cent per click. Why?

CRT/eCPM went down by 60% since last week. The same ads, same traffic, but earning went down.... What is wrong with Google?

Obviously, that happened for a reason. Looks like smart pricing [webmasterworld.com] to me. Your traffic may have been converting poorly, and if you got the boot in August after being smart priced in February, that probably means that even smart pricing couldn't fix the problem for Google. I suggest you start looking at, for example, the quality of your traffic, ad placements, etc. Don't blame Google, that's just too easy. Won't get you anywhere. Start looking at what's wrong with your site. It's not necessarily your niche either, there are hundreds of freebie and free software sites running Adsense.

8:18 pm on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



OMG. And I thought those pointless "Google can't be wrong" posts would be a thing of the past.

You have to admit that a great percentage of people who start those "we didn't do anything wrong" threads actually did something wrong upon review, especially new users with low post counts.

9:33 pm on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



Your traffic may have been converting poorly, and if you got the boot in August after being smart priced in February, that probably means that even smart pricing couldn't fix the problem for Google.

Google should send out a warning if that's the case. "Hey, you're traffic isn't converting well and you've got 1 month to fix it or remove our ads, othherwise we will have to let you go." At least warn people.

10:13 pm on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



Google should send out a warning if that's the case. "Hey, you're traffic isn't converting well and you've got 1 month to fix it or remove our ads, othherwise we will have to let you go." At least warn people.

Perhaps. As a publisher, I would appreciate that, but I'm not sure if it's that simple. Also, while getting smart priced is a relatively common thing, I don't think you'll get kicked off the network easily, unless, like koan notes, you've actually done something wrong. I always get the feeling that they have when, like now, they start throwing unsupported theories and accusations around...
11:35 pm on Aug 8, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



We have been with Google for 5 years as well, we have made millions, they have made tens of millions.

Would they drop us in a heartbeat if they didnt like something we did?

You bet. Why?

Seething masses of publishers and 1 Google.

12:37 am on Aug 9, 2008 (gmt 0)



You bet. Why?

Seething masses of advertisers who pay the bills that produce the profits.

1:56 am on Aug 9, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Im well aware of who is paying the bills. I work with many of them directly after they approach us about direct advertising.

My point was that Google can afford to really weed out who it doesnt like now from the publisher perspective due to sheer volume of websites that are now running adsense.

I browse several thousand sites a day, every single one of them runs adsense. Most of my competitors are in the alexa 500 range dealing in millions of uniques per month, every one of us is saturated with adsense and there are at least 200 sites within this range.

So your talking 400 - 500 million uniques a month with 4-8 pvs per unique with 2-4 ads per pv. Thats billions and billions of ads served monthly and this is just one small piece of the web.

The point being that how long you have been with Google or how much money you make gives you some level of preferential treatment is really the point im trying to highlight as being wrong.

3:36 am on Aug 9, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Administrator martinibuster is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



I just surfed to several freeware sites and all of them still have their AdSense ads. So unless your definition of freeware encompasses copyright infringement, I don't think freeware is the reason.
3:57 am on Aug 9, 2008 (gmt 0)

5+ Year Member



Or warez...?
6:05 am on Aug 9, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



Or warez...?

Or the sites that hide the download link in amongst a multitude of ad blocks...
6:44 am on Aug 9, 2008 (gmt 0)

WebmasterWorld Senior Member hobbs is a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



If I provide you with a Hall and decorate it for you.
You hire the entertainment, the catering and choose the guests, then you terminate my contract based on food and entertainment complaints it would be comical.

We build and layout the content, Google's algo sends the visitors and chooses which ads are suitable for those visitors contextually, there is something for everyone, even ring tones and dating sites find three for a cent matching ads.

I'll accept that Google could be weeding out the bottom of the proverbial publishers barrel, but I don't believe it can only be based on converting alone, there must be something else.

This 36 message thread spans 2 pages: 36