December 2024 Google Search Observations

[Whitey]

Huge 48 hrs of overall site traffic doubling on only 3 url's, then back to zero. Top slot's since replaced with G overviews. For a moment I got excited. Looks like an AI smash and grab raid to me.

[edited by: not2easy at 11:38 am (utc) on Dec 1, 2024]
[edit reason] New month, new thread [/edit]

[RedBar]

15+ hours into my Googleday with global site traffic at 23% furthermore no new B2B enquiries whatsoever in December. I'll let this "update extermination" roll-out then, as looks most likely, remove a 31 year old site from the public view.

[ichthyous]

Atrociously bad traffic since yesterday...search is -18% yesterday and -25% today. USA, UK, CA all -31% to -45% this morning. We are the proverbial frogs in the pot and google is constantly turning up the heat...training us all to expect our traffic to just keep declining I think. Let's get real here...there are no valid reasons for these back to back updates all the time, it's just a pretext to kill off organic search entirely no?

[RedBar]

Just checked Dec 1-14 2024 v 2023 and so far -29% and getting worse.

v 2022 -47.6%
v 2021 -64.5%

There's absolutely no need to ask where this is going for my supposed global site insofar as the www is concerned since my realword business numbers tell me completely the opposite story.

For quite a few years, more than a decade, Google has not been a driver for new bulk B2B enquiries. It nailed its colours to the mast of localisation a long, long time ago and I completely comprehend why. For some of my products B2C enquiries would outnumber a B2B enquiry 150:1. As a close friend of mine says, "it's all about the chimney pots" !

[universenet]

Webpages of many websites are just removed, no exist in Google search
Perfect status for google is when not any website will exist on Google search , only will exist ads and with no effect

[gatormark]

It nailed its colours to the mast of localisation a long, long time ago and I completely comprehend why.

That’s it! If you are trying to get business outside of your country, you are going to have a hard time doing that moving forward. In fact, that’s been the case for a while.

[universenet]

This about google is very good example how company what has monopoly in some business can destroy economy, this is reason why monopoly in any business should be controlled, but about internet all is going too late

[RedBar]

@universenet

Nope, you need to understand how the vast majority of businesses distribute their products in many countries. For sure the last 25 years has seen a massive xhange however most business is, believe it or not, still conducted in a similar fashion, for ease of explanation:

Manufacturer > wholesaler / importer > regional stockist / B2C

Even where the likes of eBay and Amazon are conserned this is still the average method however things become interesting whena manufactures or importers / wholesalers decide to go to the consumer direct such as with mobile phones or computers for example.

In general, selling direct to the consumer was a very time-consuming and unprofitable proceedure however developments in websites, computers and the willingness of the public to look and learn, the sales game has changed for many types of products but the buyer still takes the risk that the buyer knows that the product one is buying online is actually the intended one and not one of a lower / higher specification.

Google does not have a monopoly on business but it does have a monopoly in people's minds when choosing a search engine and the unfortunate aspect these days is that Google is little more than a classified ads website ... WYSIWYG ... If one doesn't like it move on and go elsewhere however metrics tell us that G's search customers, realistically, seem to be content with what they are getting ... Bizarre but true!

[universenet]

@RedBar

So, you says it is good that monopoly company exist and do what want and no need do nothing about?

Should to be clear that even if 2 companies like google and Apple made deal about
"hey, put my browser like a default on your devices and I will pay you 20 billions"
That kind of activity is against law and will be punished
And there is many more things
It is not important what people thinking or not thinking
Activity of company can put company what has monopoly out of law and not activity of users

Next example:
2 banks or group of banks can not make deal about examle minimum fee for some activity like credit card or money transfer what they will do to clients
If they do that and regulator has recognizd that and know about so regulator will make them bg fee, this happening every month in many diferent countries

Companies are under rules and not clients or users

If we thinking in way:
"Ah people are guilty because they do not want change search engine",
so in that way companies will newer be responsability for activity because always is "chance" for users change search engine
In real life is not going in that way and big companies, monopoly companies are under special law, and samll companies are not, if you run search engine you can do what you want, but monopoly companies can NOT do and they are under monopoly rules
All that is in the name of FAIR competition

[daniel1213]

All SERP rankings have gone down. It's unbelievable. I'm completely discouraged by this evil system called Google. Personally I don't understand, a website that worked perfectly for 2 years, was at the top of searches, to bring it to the last positions without doing anything wrong, and worse websites full of SPAM were not touched. Do Google programmers write code after the Christmas party?

[Whitey]

The frequency of core updates accelerating is the new norm for 2025 it seems.

[seroundtable.com...]

www.seroundtable.com Google Core Updates To Happen More Often Google held its Google Search Central Live event at its large Zurich office (where the Search Central team is based) and one of the things presented was that Google will be having more core updates, more often. So I guess instead of the three or four core updates Google announces per year, Google may have more of them per year.

[morpheus83]

Google search quality made it to 9Gag as well -
[9gag.com...]

[Whitey]

@morpheus83 - interesting opinions in that link.

Does AI justify the hype we've been hearing, and does the current activity of Google to eliminate human content production in favour of AI have a dead end? Read Ed Zitron's perspective over here: [webmasterworld.com...]

[sanjeevk89]

I have Australian clients. I did not see many fluctuations at the time. But that may change as the week proceeds.

[renatovieira]

Another day of massive drops. Today is clearly the worst of all.

[Micha]

I have nothing else to report either: the ranking has fallen massively from yesterday to today. The traffic has fallen as well. In return, Google is spitting out more and more websites that are not in German. To be honest, I don't understand this.

[christianz]

Ed Zitron's perspective

Entertaining read and I agree with most of it (about "AI companies" basically being borderline scam). But he is too dismissive and negative about LLMs. If all progress in AI stopped today and all we had was GPT4 forever, it would still be amazing discovery with real world applications.

[christianz]

Another day of massive drops. Today is clearly the worst of all.

Usually my drops are awarded with 1 day or half-day delay after you post about yours....

[RedBar]

@universenet

So, you says it is good that monopoly company exist and do what want and no need do nothing about?

Where did I write that? Nowhere do I even insinuate such a scenario, please re-read and understand what I did say:

Google does not have a monopoly on business but it does have a monopoly in people's minds when choosing a search engine and the unfortunate aspect these days is that Google is little more than a classified ads website ... WYSIWYG ... If one doesn't like it move on and go elsewhere however metrics tell us that G's search customers, realistically, seem to be content with what they are getting ... Bizarre but true!

Most people here well-understand my attitude about Google's endeavours.

[gatormark]

One more week until the DEAD ZONE!

[RedBar]

I forgot ... Did someone switch search back on for a few hours earlier today? I had completely "normal" hourly global traffic for nearly 7 hours, we'll see how the rest of the day goes!

[universenet]

$RedBar
ok,sorry seems I did understand you wrong,
but for all of us things will not be good if google will have still 90 pecent of market, will be good only for google
Google should have maybe 50 percent and no more, if more will be greedy, and will be bad for all us, when google have less of 50 percent of market google need publishers
Without losing big percent of market and go back to maybe 40-50 percent , without this will not be good for anybody
It is not easy for now even imagine that, we waiting for new and new core update but exactly without losing percent in market will notihng happening

[gatormark]

@universenet

Yes, in the search industry, Google is not a monopoly. The problem is that the other search engines are horrendous. Bing and DDG are virtually useless and their search results, although not including AI, are 100 times worse than Google‘s.

[universenet]

@gatormark
everyone who has majority in some industry is automatic monopoly in that industry
It is not that automatic bad or good
All depends about activity of that company if will be good or bad
Imagine that google doig all the best possible but will be monopoly again by definition because taking majority of search industry
For me best option is that google become good company like in old years and in taht way can have 100 perenct or search industry, monopoly but good for all

Company can have monopoly that nobody from any goverment do nothing about because if that company come in that status in fair competition way, but that kind example of sucsesfull is not easy in this world, greedy world

[RedBar]

I forgot ... Did someone switch search back on for a few hours earlier today? I had completely "normal" hourly global traffic for nearly 7 hours, we'll see how the rest of the day goes!

I suppose there's no need to say other than "As I expected" ... Traffic came to a screeching halt at UK 15.00 and dead ever since.

@universenet

but for all of us things will not be good if google will have still 90 pecent of market, will be good only for google
Google should have maybe 50 percent and no more,

The thing is that we webmasters made G the go to search engiine since it was so very good, quick and clean, even when they first introduced ads it was understandable since it required funding. I'll conveniently forget the CIA connections etc.

The big question for any G search challenger has to be "How do I make my algorithm different to Google's and give fast, accurate results?" And don't forget all the spam and garbage it has to deal with.

Does Joe Public actually like / approve of G's results? Do we have to assume they must because there certainly does not seem to be any big movement away from it? For years DDG has been my default search however its results the last few months have deteriorated so much I've had to stop using it for United Kingdom selected search since all I've been gettting has been USA results ... Yes, I have complained.

I would like to see a current genuine reason for 4 core updates a year. If I remember correctly they did say why they were going to do this however it appears to cause so much chaos and destruction that WE need a justification for them to continue this utter farce.

[universenet]

The thing is that we webmasters made G the go to search engiine since it was so very good, quick and clean, even when they first introduced ads it was understandable since it required funding..

@RedBar
Yes, I know history of google and adsense
One of my website is more of 20 years old
But things going now in totaly diferent way
Greedy......greedy.....
Greed can even kill people (boeing)

[gatormark]

@universenet

The keyword is “illegal.” in the United States and illegal monopoly exists when one company has market power for a product or service, AND AND it has obtained or maintained that market power, not through competition on the merits, but because the firm has suppressed competition by engaging in anticompetitive conduct.

I don’t have a problem with Google being a “monopoly” in the basic sense of the word (dominant market share). I think people are more frustrated with the search results and the constant changes in those results.

I have been negatively impacted by those changes as well. However, their incorporating AI and constantly making updates to their search results does not mean they are an illegal monopoly.

One thing we have learned from the past concerning monopolies is that when a monopoly is broken up it can often result in a worse situation for the consumer or business partner.

[universenet]

The keyword is “illegal.” in the United States and illegal monopoly exists when one company has market power for a product or service, AND AND it has obtained or maintained that market power, not through competition on the merits, but because the firm has suppressed competition by engaging in anticompetitive conduct.

@gatormark
That is what google did
Google paid 20 billions to apple
This is just one of illegal activity

[gatormark]

@universenet

Yes, Google did that recently and are paying for it, buy that now how they acquired their market share. They simply have the best search engine. Right?

[universenet]

They simply have the best search engine. Right?

If continue in that wat will be only one search engine
Yes, Sundar says they are the best for search for course, the are so magical,
Coca Cola CEO says too for Coca Cola ( and Coca Cola is very healthy)
Amazing
Incredible
Imagine how good google will be when will be only Gemini (if continue in that way)
Will be ultra amazing
Yes?

@gatormark
I will tell you my secret but do not say that to anybody, ok?
Google is my HERO!

[EditorialGuy]

Re Google's payments to Apple for distribution: Google didn't invent "pay for play," and the practice isn't limited to Internet search. For example:

[vox.com...]

www.vox.com The hidden war over grocery shelf space It determines what you buy in the grocery -” long before you get a look at the shelf.

[universenet]

[ftc.gov ]

@EditorialGuy
Monopoly law is only for companies who has majority in some market, like google,
so they can be so powerfull that can kill all other competition, and competition can dissapppear

Up is link to US gov. Monopolization Defined and similar is in many countries

So, some activity other companies can do without problem but google can not do because google is in monopoly position, google has majority of market, and it is observed by regulators, similar is in phone providers market and many more market

www.ftc.gov Monopolization Defined The antitrust laws prohibit conduct by a single firm that unreasonably restrains competition by creating or maintaining monopoly power.

[universenet]

@EditorialGuy
There is many things what many search engines can do and google can not do because
monopoly status, google is just under diferent law because his powerfull status on market so regulators try stop that kind of companies
Similar is in internet providers copanies, internet company what are monopoly in internet bussiness(in some countries) are under diferent law and can not do all what can do small companies, this is just way how regulators try control that small companies will not be totaly removed from market
Google even should not buy any comapny

[saladtosser]

Maybe the Aliens are coming because of AI?! Because it doesn't just pose a risk to all life on our planet but all life in the universe!?

Would be great to wake up one day and find out all the Googlers suddenly disappeared and were being anally probed off world!

[Marian97c]

Some Insights from Romania

Google is delivering a lot of international tech news websites in Google Discover, which drastically reduces traffic to local Romanian-language sites. This trend has been noticeable since August this year.

We are also observing that Google is delivering content in English and even in other languages through Google Search, including in incognito mode.

Previously, when we searched for a phone name, the first results came from Romanian-language websites. Now, we see a large number of "international" sites with content in English occupying the top positions.

I see this update as further emphasizing this issue, even though I expected the opposite—a fix for an unfortunate update. But it seems this is not the case.

I own two websites. One was penalized in September/October 2023 and has not recovered since then. Even news aggregators that steal our content rank ahead of us.

The second website is exclusively in the tech niche, and this update, along with previous ones since August, has greatly impacted me.

I have optimized the website very well. We use GeneratePress and LiteSpeed, we pass Web Vitals, the first ad appears after the second paragraph, and the third is at the end of the article. Therefore, we do not have issues with the experience we provide to our readers.

Unfortunately, Google is losing quality with each update, even for regular users who see a site in English, click on it, and have the browser automatically translate the content into Romanian.

I don’t think this is a good direction, and unfortunately, we cannot change anything.

Good luck with what you do, and I recommend you start looking for another job. In 2–3 years, all niches will be monopolized, and AI will provide users with all the information they need without them having to visit the original website.

[RedBar]

I suppose there's no need to say other than "As I expected" ... Traffic came to a screeching halt at UK 15.00 and dead ever since.

This has continued for me into Tuesday therefore I shall assume that barring core update Xmas Miracle that this traffic level will continue. As such not only have I stopped all work on this global site I have also stopped its conversion into a trade database.

Why? Quite simply this will cost me money and if all I am going to derive is little to zero traffic meanwhile AI bots scrape the site to feed their needs and sell relevant ads, well they can go forth and multiply themselves.

I am going to take all this information and images and create something else for my industry that I considered about 20 years ago. This is what happens G when you start pushing people to the edge, they will retaliate in the most unexpected of ways that you will have never, ever contemplated.

[gatormark]

And like I said earlier, Monopolies are not inherently bad.

I have used every ad publishing service under the sun over the past 20 years and Google has always been the best, by far.

While, I do not like all of their decision (especially recently) it is hard for me to be overly critical of a company that has paid my bills for the past 12 years.

[Dooku]

While, I do not like all of their decision (especially recently) it is hard for me to be overly critical of a company that has paid my bills for the past 12 years.

NO, NO, NO, Just NO! I have heard the above remark(or similar) so many times over the years from many people, it's just mind-boggling.

Gatormark, YOU PAID, your bills, not google. YOU created your website, YOU put in the work, YOU hosted that website, YOU put in the effort by whatever means to attract visitors to your website. You owe google NOTHING! Google just comes along with their bot and indexes your website.
If you, or anyone else did not create websites.....there would be NO search engine.....nada.

Google already makes money through their SE and advertising and believe me, they make money in many other ways you and I aren't even aware of.
If suddenly google decides your website isn't interesting enough than that is nothing more then the display of amoral greed at it's worst.
For google it's now not enough what they earn with their SE, but they want their greedy fingers in YOUR pocket in YOUR wallet and want a piece of your earnings also......and if it was up to them they would grab ALL of your earnings.

The latest end of year (very long) blog article from Ed Zitron describes exactly this. It is far worse then people can even imagine.

[ichthyous]

One thing we have learned from the past concerning monopolies is that when a monopoly is broken up it can often result in a worse situation for the consumer or business partner.

Have we? Not really...there are far more cases of government breaking up monopolies where the public benefited. That's why societies that aren't taken over completely by monopolies are more dynamic and faster growing. There are endless studies by economists showing how monopolies stunt growth in economies and deprive everyone of opportunities they could have had.

The question is how to define monopoly in the current age of tech behemoths. Yes we could all opt out of Google search and go elsewhere, or opt out of Facebook and Instagram, or shop online elsewhere other than Amazon....so it's hard to nail these tech companies as easily as past monopolies. But when one company has the power to suffocate millions of small businesses I would say that that power has now become a threat to the rest of the economy.

I, like you, have made a good living from Google organic search going back to 2003. I even built my mother a small website back then for her real estate business that ended up getting so much organic traffic and so many leads that she begged me to move down to where she lived to work with her ( I didn't do it). So I am grateful for the better days and am just riding this new monster until I feel satisfied I can close up shop. I won't be able to transition my business away from dependence on organic search, I have tried for years and the other options are too costly and ineffective (including paying Google for ads). I am not going to work to death to make no profit, and that's where this is all heading for the past 5+ years with Google...even longer actually. Google insists on having the entire pie now, there is no symbiotic relationship. That is a monopoly and it serves nobody's interest other than Google.

[EditorialGuy]

But when one company has the power to suffocate millions of small businesses I would say that that power has now become a threat to the rest of the economy.

If we're talking about Google Search (as we should be, given the topic of this forum), the tough part is finding a solution. Simply breaking up Google by forcing it to sell off ads or YouTube or whatever isn't going to solve the underlying problem: For better or worse, most searchers prefer Google--even when (to use one example) Microsoft Windows tries to force Bing down their throats.

[RedBar]

even when (to use one example) Microsoft Windows tries to force Bing down their throats.

I've just been setting-up a new Win 11 laptop this week and what an horrendous experience this has been deleting and opting-out of all the MS built-in garbage and to a lesser extent the Google stuff.

One of these days I will get around to Linux!

[gatormark]

@EditorialGuy

If we're talking about Google Search (as we should be, given the topic of this forum), the tough part is finding a solution. Simply breaking up Google by forcing it to sell off ads or YouTube or whatever isn't going to solve the underlying problem: For better or worse, most searchers prefer Google--even when (to use one example) Microsoft Windows tries to force Bing down their throats.

Beat me to it. Also, I was literally just about to mention Microsoft and Bing.

[christianz]

They only prefer Google because Bing is worse. However, during past 2 months gap has narrowed. Not because Bing has caught up - because November and December cores were garbage.

[gatormark]

@christianz

Bing is HORRENDOUS! Basically, unusable.

[ichthyous]

Simply breaking up Google by forcing it to sell off ads or YouTube or whatever isn't going to solve the underlying problem: For better or worse, most searchers prefer Google--even when (to use one example) Microsoft Windows tries to force Bing down their throats.

Agreed, but the fact that users prefer Google (and that Bing is a 2nd rate copy) doesn't mean that it's not a monopoly. The symbiotic relationship between webmasters (content providers) and Google has long been broken. The benefits accrue almost completely to one side now, and since Google has 90% of search market share it's hard to argue that these practices are not monopolistic. I do agree that severing Youtube is not going to change the problem of organic search. This is the entire problem of tech monopolies, it's difficult to find how to rein them in at all...they clearly keep growing and becoming more powerful by the day. They even have the power to warp our political system by flooding it with lobbyists and campaign contributions. They will do anything to preserve their position and weaken the ability of government to regulate them in any way...

[Whitey]

Unfortunately, Google is losing quality with each update, even for regular users who see a site in English, click on it, and have the browser automatically translate the content into Romanian.

@Marian97c - appreciate the observations from a Romanian language perspective. I don't know, but my sense tells me that Google is developing it's adaption to new and uncharted waters of AI related pivots, at lightening speed with consequential major quality issues along the way. Hence the accelerating frequency of the core updates and the mayhem for site owners not knowing where we're headed.

Aside from all the chatter here on this thread, about collateral damage, the impunity of Google's actions and raw emotions for those that are severely disrupted, I think it's helpful to focus on the trends that Google, in it's pursuit of "search quality", is trying to achieve.

What are these accelerating trends that it's locking into? What are we seeing?

I wonder if Google is going to accelerate it's use of browser related translations and AI in multi language in the SERP's, hence the EN results appearing. It would make sense, from a scaling point of view, if it works. The downside, is overall quality.

If you want to run with the beast, first try to understand it, if you need to co exist with it. I think we'll be more productive if we focus on this, but it's hard when folks are fighting for survival to see this. I get it.

[headspace]

The current evidence would seem to suggest that search is not going to get any worse than it already is as a result of AI.
The truth is that people do prefer instant answers to blue links. That is why the answer sites like quora, reddit et al
are thriving. G was using PAA etc long before AI came along, so the realisation about instant answers had already taken hold.
The difficulty for website owners, is that these instant answers need to be on the first page and therefore
traditional links are pushed further and further down the page. The good news is that AI will always need websites to draw
fresh content and training from. However, whether smaller websites will play any significant part in this new paradigm is the big question.
I suspect not. Some smaller websites that do not have dynamic content (information which needs to be updated every day and for which users
will seek out), need to find a new business model other than search to survive. Those smaller websites with dynamic content will need to learn a lesson
from the big news sites and switch to a subscription model.

[gatormark]

The sad and ironic thing about all of this is that, as a webmaster, I often stop at the AI results. So, I’m contributing to the problem.

[EditorialGuy]

The truth is that people do prefer instant answers to blue links.

That really depends on the query. Not all queries lend themselves to instant answers, just as not all queries on YouTube lend themselves to YouTube Shorts.

For example, if someone is searching on "how to replace a fuel injector in a Whatsitmobile," a paragraph of text isn't likely to be as helpful as a step-by-step guide.

Even something that might sound simple, like how to get from Widgetville Airport to the city center, may require more than "Take the number 6 bus" unless the searcher is already familiar with the airport, the transit system, and the city's geography. For the first-time visitor to Widgetville, an article with photos or videos may be much more useful than a quick AI answer or "People also ask" response.

It's also worth noting that Google itself benefits from a healthy Web ecosystem, because--as the dominant provider of Web ads--it earns revenue from those ads on third-party sites. In the third quarter of 2024 alone, it earned nearly as much from the "Google Network" as it did from YouTube.

[headspace]

Yes, I do also, as I suspect most users of search do. The direction of travel is definitely towards instant answers.

[headspace]

@editorialguy
All queries by nature prefer instant answers, although i do agree that the answer may not be instantly deliverable in an AI overview or PAA, but these are probably a very small percentage of the overall queries that G handles.