Anyone using 303 redirections to retain inbound link juice

[richinberlin]

I am auditing a website with courses, where many have been discontinued, but often, there is a similar one.

eg

Japanese Philosophy = gone
Japanese History and Culture = Exists

Right now - they return a 404.... which sux as many have inbound links.

a. I don't want to reboot the pages, and either have them as part of normal navigation or orphaned pages.
b. I don't wish to 301 them to a similar page. They aren't exactly the same.
c. I am thinking to 303 them as Google is on the record saying a 3xx redirection transfers page rank.

Now... I know a redirection to a totally different page is treated as a soft 404... but am wondering... if these are treated as a..... something in between a legitimate 301 and a soft 404?

Or... should I just 301 them to the best match... and hope google goes "Ahhhh, awright,,, close enough.... link juice salvaged."

All comments welcomed, but anyone with actual data gets on my xmas card list.

[Andy Langton]

Google does not follow the HTTP spec in any strict sense. If a 3xx redirect hangs around long enough (regardless of status code) Google will just treat it like a 301 anyway. Your choice is more or less how quickly you want this to happen (i.e. quickly with a 301, or more slowly with anything else).

A redirect from one page which is not substantively similar to the redirect destination will not pass ranking signals anyway.

[lucy24]

If it’s gone, it’s gone. That means a 410, not a 404. Depending on how large the site is, it may or may not be practical to customize the 410 page for different requests. (“We don’t have X, but you may be interested in Y.”)

[tangor]

Link juice? We don't need no ...

Well... er ... whatever you MIGHT salvage would be very short lived as the page redirect is NOT to a similar content. What MIGHT happen is g loses any confidence in "you" the webmaster to be honest a truthful and cares for users...

Oh My!

(As lucy24 says, if it is gone, return a 410 ... or continue to let it go 404... as for the other ... if you have to ask you already know it is sneaky stuff...)

[lammert]

You can dispute the similar content argument. Redirects from "Japanese Philosophy" to "Japanese History and Culture" may still be regarded as similar content, and being redirected to such a page may be in the interest of the visitor.

The problem with a 301 redirect or 410 Gone is that it is permanent, whereas you don't know in this specific case if a course may be added again to the curriculum next year. Semantically seen, 303 may actually be the best choice here, because a 303 redirect does not imply that the content of the original and the redirect are the same, merely that they are related.

You can circumvent this problem by changing the contents of the unavailable course pages by adding the message "This course is currently not available, but look at our courses with similar topics". This is where you can add links to both Japan-related, and Philosophy related courses. You'll add the robot tags "noindex,follow" to these old course pages to prevent them from showing up in the search engines, but the follow tag still lets the link juice flow.

In this case, you have the benefit of both worlds. People arriving on the page through an old link will have the best possible choice with on-topic links to similar courses, and link juice will be distributed as good as possible to on-topic pages.

I see this method used by a lot of webshops. "This product is permanently sold out, but look at our alternatives", with links to similar products. I personally find these pages much more helpful than a simple "This product can not be found in our database".

[Robert Charlton]

Lammert's idea of a 303 as a suggestion of relatedness is intriguing, and I like the way he would reword the text... but I'm not sure that the "noindex,follow" is necessary or desirable.

Google's treatment of "noindex,follow" has changed over the past year, and essentially, over time on a given page, this tag causes Google to treat the page as a 404, which you don't want. Quoting lammert, my emphasis added in the area now treated differently...

You'll add the robot tags "noindex,follow" to these old course pages to prevent them from showing up in the search engines, but the follow tag still lets the link juice flow.

According to John Mueller, discussed here on WebmasterWorld in Dec 2017, and also on Search Engine Roundtable, Google eventually stops following the links on pages where there's a long term use of "noindex"... whether or not you use follow. It's not clear how long, though, "long term" is.

Our thread about the changed view of "noindex,follow" is here (and I should warn that the future tense in the title can be confusing)...

Google Will Eventually Stop Following Links on Noindex Pages
Dec, 2017
https://www.webmasterworld.com/google/4881752.htm [webmasterworld.com]

The video is worth playing, as John M's emphasis clarifies the transcript, which I've taken and tuned a bit from the YouTube page...

JOHN MUELLER:

So it's kind of tricky with noindex... which... which I think is somewhat of a misconception in general with the SEO community, in that, with a noindex and follow, it's still the case that we see the noindex. And in a first step, we say, OK, you don't want this page shown in the search results. We'll still keep it in our index.... we just won't show it. And then we can follow those links.

55:20: But if we see the noindex there for longer than we think, this page really doesn't want to be used in search. So we will remove it completely. And that we won't follow the links, either. And noindex and follow is essentially kind of the same as a noindex nofollow. There is no really big difference there in the long run.

So, if you don't wnat the page treated as a 404... if do want it to be found in search... I'm thinking out loud, why use the noindex at all? In a way, without it, you have a synonym search and also a description of the situation for your legacy users.

Also see Barry's article about noindex on seroundtable here:

Google: Long Term Noindex Will Lead To Nofollow On Links
[seroundtable.com...]

[richinberlin]

Im with Mr Charlton.

a. Noindex follow pages drop out of Googles index eventually and then pass no link juice.
b. I think my intended use of 303 is perfectly legitimate. Similar but not the same. Would equally apply to a course "Python for beginners" which no longer existed... however there might now be a course "Python 101". Its not the same. A 301 is not really accurate, as the content has not permanently moved. Its gone. Its just being substantially similarly served by alternate content.
c. I am unsure about simply leaving the pages in place with a "this course no longer happening try these similar courses" page, as these will either have to be orphaned paged that are likely not valued by Google, or otherwise they will need to be left as live courses, able to be navigated to.... thus providing site users with a bad experience.

So... my question is. With Google on the record as saying 3xx passes page rank, and I think my usage will pass the correct usage of a 303 test... is there anyone out there that would( or has used) use the 303 as I am thinking to, as opposed to just 301ing to the best fit content and hoping for the best.

I can't see a case for a 404 or 410. There is an inbound link. In most cases, there is a substantially similar page.