Google Updates and SERP Changes - November 2019

[engine]

---

System: The following 8 messages were cut out of thread at: https://www.webmasterworld.com/google/4966830.htm [webmasterworld.com] by robert_charlton - 4:01 pm on Nov 1, 2019 (PDT -8)

---

Not what i'd seen, it wasn't even that.
I'd class myself as an experienced searcher, and, sometimes, when I look at Google's serps it's trying to pre-empt my intent. More often than not, it's presenting either highly-optimised sites, or, in this case, it was all wrong. Something's broke.

It works that way these days.

I don't ever use "best" as that is spammed out.

[topaz]

Confirm no Discover/News traffic for the last 3 days.

[seomotionz]

All of a sudden we are getting loads of traffic from Baidu. But unfortunately their BR is 100%.

@MayankParmar I thought you recovered. Then again you lost traffic? Don't worry you will recover again.

[BushyTop]

Something happening again in the UK... really big!

[Martin Ice Web]

Very very big drop since monday. Traffic keeps coming iun surges with big periods of no traffic.
Conversion cut down to 5%.
We get hits to pages that we normaly donīt get much traffic to. Google finally has erased all traffic to our main traffic pages. Serps are now full with gerneric non trustable und rubbish shops.I canīt think of any scenario where this could be good for google searchers.

Similar to this amazon and ebay sales did grow about 150% since monday.

[MarvinG]

Traffic keeps dropping. Did not make any dramatic changes to the websites since the last update, where I gained traffic. Don't know what the **** Google is doing.

[koan]

If I understand google's position, you're supposed to put nofollow tags on that type of link.

And the people asking links will probably insist that it is dofollow because their intent is to manipulate Google for their own benefit, with no care if Delta3Girl gets penalized.

[UpdatePains]

I (UK) keep getting fluctuations of the mobile format SERPS (Favicon and URL on top) and standard desktop SERPS whenever G is up to something.
I personally prefer the mobile format as it makes clearer what is a paid listing and what is organic, so I guess G will do away with that soon.
Historically, the bigger players in my niche (some so dominant that you couldn't envision knocking them off position 1) have never gone down the PPC route, but G's constant flux in the SERPS over the past 18 months-2 years had led even them to resort to PPC. That would seem like a big win for G if you ask me, as evidenced by their constantly increasing profits. I tried PPC but it was breakeven after 9 months no matter how much we refined it. The sad thing is, this all benefits Google. The chaos is their new business model, PBN's, bought links and black hat is thriving and so the only way you can keep a top listing on Google is by paying to play. Sadly, I don't see that changing given how well it's working for their business model so we all need to adjust accordingly...somehow.

[MayankParmar]

Rankings are fine and I don't think I am hit by any updates, but no Discover/News traffic for the past one week :/

[JesterMagic]

I am sick and tired of seeing multiple pages before mine in the SERPS that have a page title that includes the current month and year in the title that indicates it is the latest information when the page itself has not received and update in months. These page titles change every month to keep with the current month. If Google sees page titles constantly changing like this they should demote the page. It's an indication that they are trying to game the system, and who know what else they may be trying to do.

[RareBit]

@UpdatePains - I am seeing exactly the same! Only this time my results are not bouncing around with the changes

[glakes]

Sadly, I don't see that changing given how well it's working for their business model so we all need to adjust accordingly

Businesses need a certain degree of predictability, particularly when it comes to spending marketing budgets. Many have wisely sidelined Google, or at least greatly reduced their dependence on Google, over the last few years. These are the businesses best positioned to survive along with the hobbyists that don't rely on Google traffic for their primary source of income.

I don't care how much one spends on SEO because it will never outrank the paid ads, the KB, Interesting finds and all the other fluff Google puts above the fold to compel businesses to pay just to be seen. At some point spending for that visibility becomes too costly and advertisers drop out and spend their money elsewhere. I personally plan on spending more with Bing and Facebook as we cut our branding campaigns in Adwords. As far as Google organics go, forget about it. Sure, Google will send traffic but what the send bounces as bad as traffic from pop-unders. It's nearly all garbage traffic coming out of Google and the only thing that changes is slight variations in odor. For those that think it's bad now, just wait. I have a hunch it will get worse until we start seeing Google losing marketshare as the result of the crap they are serving...

[seomotionz]

@MayankParmar there has been similar reportings. I hope you get it back.

[NickMNS]

@delta3girl
Two points about the legality of paid links.
But before I'm not a lawyer and this is not legal advice for actual legal advice speak to a lawyer with knowledge and experience in these matters.
1- It depends on your jurisdiction, but I believe in the US you would need disclose that the links are paid links, essential ads.
2- It is only illegal if you get caught and it is not like there is special FBI task force dissecting every link on the internet. Moreover, assuming that your website is relatively small (your not CNN), if you were to "get caught" so to speak it rather unlikely that any agency would actual pursue the matter. Basically it is a matter of risk more than legality. Don't forget if you do get caught you can always make the argument that no one ever clicked on the link so the linked website never got any benefit so therefore it wasn't advertising and there for you can't be charged with anything.

As from a Google perspective, again it is a matter of risk. One needs to realize that there is no way for Google to determine whether or not there was any money exchanged for any links. They can suspect it, but to prove it would be difficult if not impossible. Thus Google would be unlikely to take any direct punitive action against you the most likely outcome would that they would simply ignore the suspect links in terms of PR thus rendering them useless to the purchaser. A more severe outcome would be that they also start to ignore links pointing to your site thus causing a marginal loss in traffic. I think it is rather unlikely that they would apply a "Manual Action" penalty on you unless, you are selling links egregiously. Ultimately there is no way to know for sure what type of action will take if any.

All this said, generally I feel that selling links is a bad idea regardless of the legality or Google. If you have a serious website with a serious following your readers will notice this change and it will likely negatively impact your reputation and that alone could be far more damaging than anything else.

[Delta3Girl]

Thank you for all the helpful responses re: paid links. I do use nofollow links when I write sponsored product reviews and I'm assuming the people who are asking for links want the real thing, not a nofollow.

I like to sleep at night so even doing something that is only illegal if I get caught is enough to deter me.

Re: reputation. I've been at this a long time and I remember the first time I put up a short sponsored post in something like 2007? 2008? Good grief. You would have thought I had announced I had sold my first born child into slavery. "How can I ever trust you again to be honest?" and so on. It's different now because people are used to seeing sponsored posts everywhere, but it's still a good point.

Well, you all confirmed what I already thought, but I'm glad I asked. I was hoping I was wrong, but apparently I wasn't.

Back to riding out the Google insanity and looking for other income ideas.

Have a good day!

[Solipsism]

"I like to sleep at night so even doing something that is only illegal if I get caught is enough to deter me."

It is not "illegal", Google is not the law.

[UpdatePains]

It is not "illegal", Google is not the law.

Can someone please tell them that?!? :-)

[samwest]

It appears Google hates my content but loves when it's scraped and posted on other sites that are now outranking me with my own content...talk about "illegal"...

[browndog]

I'm continuing to drop, I'm now earning less than I was when I started with Adsense in 2005. Traffic is the worst I've ever seen it. Down from 20,000 to 3,000 and it gets worse every day.

[StupidIntelligent]

@browndog - so, you went from 600,000 organic Google visits per month, to now, 90,000. That's basically back to the old Kent road; like you already mentioned. Google seems to have killed your website over time.

[StupidIntelligent]

Or did I read that completely wrong.

[NickMNS]

It is not "illegal", Google is not the law.

Nobody was suggesting that Google was the law. Paid links are essentially advertisements, and thus must be disclosed at least in the US as well as many if not all western countries. See the link to FTC website:
[ftc.gov...]

Clearly paid links are not as cut and dry as the examples in the linked article, and as I mentioned in my previous post it is rather unlikely that anyone would go after you for selling a few links. The fact remains that it is "illegal" and there is a risk of getting caught. Now it is up to each webmaster to weigh risk vs the return.

Note that you could easily disclose that the links are paid and thus avoiding any legal issues while not no-following the links. But then Google would be well within its rights to penalize you or simply ignore the links.

[seomotionz]

Google is most certainly not the law. And neither they want to impose anything on people. Its just too big. And you cannot be good to certain amount of people without making another amount of people feel bad, when specially money is involved.

[MayankParmar]

Discover/News traffic is back today. All is good now, phew.. :)

[seomotionz]

@MayankParmar Congrats man! Your prayers have been answered. Although I haven't heard from anybody else.

[samwest]

Ok, back to the #1 position, but every time this happens, traffic turns off completely. Morning started out OK, but now over an hour without a soul. As the SERPs churn, traffic stops on each change...starts back up until the next change a few hours later. Stop messing with the remote!

[al1st]

I've taken on a project with a site in a very competitive space and I may have picked a bad time with all this google drama going on! It's hard to find a baseline to measure from.

[cheegum]

There is no sign of this update stopping. Can anyone who gained with this update shed a light on what they focused on?

[hopepro]

It seems to be shuffling again today. The previous contents published before 7th were down to hell after the update started. Now, they started to gain ranking. But for new contents publish during the algo update, they start to jump up and down.

[samwest]

Incredible how current traffic is tracking the previous period exactly. Seems impossible in what you would think is a rather chaotic system of millions of users...especially when compared to patterns from years ago. It's as if standard deviation and variance no longer exist in the SERPs world...even as results and user behavior appear to be bouncing daily...even hourly. Perhaps that apparent delta is the control mechanism itself.

[mosxu]

@samwest

Somehow the machine remembers the behaviour of your users from long time ago.

It makes me wonder why would the machine store it in the first place?